Major vs Regional Dilemma

[Creamer]

I'm rapidly approaching my Air Force separation date and have been trying to get a job with a major airline for the last 6 months without luck. I feel I'm qualified for FedEx, UPS, JetBlue type jobs with almost 4000 hrs of multi-eng jet time (2500 hrs of which are PIC). I've been an instructor and an evaluator. Eventually my turn will come for the best jobs, but in the meantime I have to put food on the table and have medical insurance for my family. A regional job will provide that.

If a major airline sees that I've been working for a regional airline for only a very short time, will that deter them from calling me? If I do get an interview and I show willingness to leave a company only after a few months will that go against me even though it is a major step up?

Thanks for any advice you may have.

 

[General Lee]

The regional may not like that, but the Major carrier won't care. They are looking for qualified people (hey, I made it....?) and HOPEFULLY that will be the last new job you will ever take. But, the way things are going these days, the regional may be the stable airline. I don't think any Major would mind you going to a regional first. Heck, we all know the Regionals have tougher schedules, and you will probably get accustomed to airline flying really quick. I see it as a positive.



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[FDJ2]

Get whatever job you can first, it doesn't have to be your dream job. There is no negative stigma associated with moving on to your dream job if the opportunity presents itself. This isn't the military, where loyalty is expected, this is a business. Just conduct yourself in a professional manner at all times and if an opportunity comes to move on give your company adequate notice.

 

[FLB717]

Not flying looks a lot worse than going from a nice place to the place you want to be. Provided you sell yourself well in the interview the Regeonal flying will be a plus that will give you an edge vs the other Mil guys who are off for a year or more.

 

[BoilerUP]

Don't want to be rude, but despite your experience (I and most if not all others thank you for your service), you are no more qualified for the majors that are hiring than any turboprop or RJ captain who has been a PIC for 3 or more years, who is completely used to the 121 lifestyle, who routinely flies in crappy weather with ungreatful passengers for a company whose mangement probably could care less about them.

I trust you didn't think you are more deserving of such a job, but I figure I'd get it out of the way in the third response. EDIT: 4th response

Have you considered an ANG position? I've met many pilots flying for both regionals and majors who fly in the Guard, and they seem to enjoy it. Plus its nice to always have a backup plan, given today's economic environment. Some regionals can be good places to be right now, and with your qualifications, you would be sure to get a quick phone call. Just watch out for those places that make you sign training contracts (Chautauqua, for example, is 24 months) if you hope on making a quick exit. Also, don't discount the fractional business; I hear Citation Shares is a good place to be, and Netjets might be a *decent* place to spend a bit of time before moving on.

Best of luck!

 

[WhiteCloud]

Get whatever job you can first, it doesn't have to be your dream job. There is no negative stigma associated with moving on to your dream job if the opportunity presents itself. This isn't the military, where loyalty is expected, this is a business. Just conduct yourself in a professional manner at all times and if an opportunity comes to move on give your company adequate notice.

I agree. On the bright side....6 months to a year of regional flying would be good for getting a lot of instrument work and familiarization with 121 ops under your belt. You'll be able to go into training at your final destination with more confidence, especially if you have been desk bound or not flying a lot lately. Having been on a few hiring panels I'd like to add that, if your experience is only military, doing some part time CFI work in a 172 or just doing some instrument work in a GA airplane looks very good to those of us that came up that way. It helps us view you as one of us and as someone who likes to fly. Good luck.

 

[Jimdandy]

sdfgfghjkl;'

 

[klhoard]

. . . <snip>. . . who routinely flies in crappy weather with ungreatful passengers for a company whose mangement probably could care less about them. . . . <snip>. . .

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You forgot about flying uphill both ways, in the snow, inverted on the ILS. . .
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oh, yeah, with ungrateful passengers and management. . . . .blah, blah, blah. . .
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Trust me, Creamer will figure it out quick enough. . . .
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[skykid]

Have you considered staying in the Air Force? The pay and benefits out here flying pax is going from bad to worse. Cargo still has good pay, but you have limited hiring opportunities and you have to fly nights. That wouldn't be a big deal for me (nightowl), but some people literally cannot do that schedule, and what good is a great paying job when you hate it and die 15 years quicker.

None of the "majors" are going to look unfavorably at you for taking another flying job until you get the one you want.

With very, very, very few exceptions, it is who you know is this environment.

You will get used to the "121 lifestyle" these guys are talking about in roughly three minutes.

 

[Secret Squirrel]

There was a guy in my express jet new hire class from the navy. he had a lot of mil time and was told by many that he needed 121 time to be competative. He was at express under six months and now is at southwest.



SS

 

[Jeff Helgeson]

121 time will make you more employable.

A regional job will provide that.

If a major airline sees that I've been working for a regional airline for only a very short time, will that deter them from calling me? If I do get an interview and I show willingness to leave a company only after a few months will that go against me even though it is a major step up?

Thanks for any advice you may have.

Creamer:

121 time will make you more employable at any major. You have the flying skills, but I think the majors like the fact that if you have some 121 experience, then the transition will be easier for them, OPS SPECS, 121 rules, etc.

I know for a fact that at TWA they liked that fact that a military type wasn't above working for a regional, got some 121 experience working as a crew (if former fighter back ground, etc.)

My sim partner was an F4 driver in the USAF, worked about a year flying a C402 in the Grand Canyon and came to TWA. I think the 135 experienced helped him get the job.

Regionals are hiring, as are the fractionals.

Jeff

 

[Jeff Helgeson]

Lighten up, Francise!!!

I guess you must be a Gold Seal CFI!

Who knew?

Don't want to be rude, but despite your experience (I and most if not all others thank you for your service), you are no more qualified for the majors that are hiring than any turboprop or RJ captain who has been a PIC for 3 or more years, who is completely used to the 121 lifestyle, who routinely flies in crappy weather with ungreatful passengers for a company whose mangement probably could care less about them.

I trust you didn't think you are more deserving of such a job, but I figure I'd get it out of the way in the third response. EDIT: 4th response

 

[BoilerUP]

Hey now, I wasn't busting the guy's chops, I was trying to give him some perspective about something that has been discussed ad nauseum on this board and beyond. I tried to interject some humor as well as give some positive, helpful information. As you can see from my profile, I dont have enough credibility to criticize anybody, and I am pursuing the military route myself.

And no, I'm not a Gold Seal, but thanks for the promotion

Regards...

 

[Clyde]

I'm rapidly approaching my Air Force separation date and have been trying to get a job with a major airline for the last 6 months without luck. I feel I'm qualified for FedEx, UPS, JetBlue type jobs with almost 4000 hrs of multi-eng jet time (2500 hrs of which are PIC). I've been an instructor and an evaluator. Eventually my turn will come for the best jobs, but in the meantime I have to put food on the table and have medical insurance for my family. A regional job will provide that.

If a major airline sees that I've been working for a regional airline for only a very short time, will that deter them from calling me? If I do get an interview and I show willingness to leave a company only after a few months will that go against me even though it is a major step up?

Thanks for any advice you may have.

Creamer,
Take what you can get for now. Like you said, you have to put food on the table. Also, you want to stay current too. A major isn't going to care that you've been somewhere for a short time, only to leave to take a job with them. Just make sure the place you are going to fly for is safe.

 

[Clyde]

Creamer:

121 time will make you more employable at any major. You have the flying skills, but I think the majors like the fact that if you have some 121 experience, then the transition will be easier for them, OPS SPECS, 121 rules, etc.

I know for a fact that at TWA they liked that fact that a military type wasn't above working for a regional, got some 121 experience working as a crew (if former fighter back ground, etc.)

My sim partner was an F4 driver in the USAF, worked about a year flying a C402 in the Grand Canyon and came to TWA. I think the 135 experienced helped him get the job.

Regionals are hiring, as are the fractionals.

Jeff

Jeff,

This isn't a slam, just a testimony.

I had zero 121 experience prior to my job here at Brown. Now given, it was pre-9/11 when I got hired, but my only experience was 125 and 135, all of it non-scheduled. The transitionn was pretty easy, and several people had been hired with Part 91 background and no 121 backgrounds in the same timeframe. We did have 121 people (regional and national) as well as all military backgrounds.

Almost 5 years later, it could possibly have changed, and I know it may be different at other carriers.

 

[Jeff Helgeson]

Many roads lead to Rome....

The more experience one gets can only help, especially in todays environment. I didn't state it isn't possible to go direct from the military to a major, just one less thing to learn in the transition.

If Creamer seperates from the military and takes a non-flying job in the intererim while waiting for a major, he will become less employable as non-currency sets in.

It's all opinion, roll the bones!

Jeff

Jeff,

This isn't a slam, just a testimony.

I had zero 121 experience prior to my job here at Brown. Now given, it was pre-9/11 when I got hired, but my only experience was 125 and 135, all of it non-scheduled. The transitionn was pretty easy, and several people had been hired with Part 91 background and no 121 backgrounds in the same timeframe. We did have 121 people (regional and national) as well as all military backgrounds.

Almost 5 years later, it could possibly have changed, and I know it may be different at other carriers.

 

[Jeff Helgeson]

No worries....

Hey now, I wasn't busting the guy's chops, I was trying to give him some perspective about something that has been discussed ad nauseum on this board and beyond. I tried to interject some humor as well as give some positive, helpful information. As you can see from my profile, I dont have enough credibility to criticize anybody, and I am pursuing the military route myself.

And no, I'm not a Gold Seal, but thanks for the promotion

Regards...

...but drop and give us 25 just for good measure. The board may reconvene!

 

[Clyde]

The more experience one gets can only help, especially in todays environment. I didn't state it isn't possible to go direct from the military to a major, just one less thing to learn in the transition.

If Creamer seperates from the military and takes a non-flying job in the intererim while waiting for a major, he will become less employable as non-currency sets in.

It's all opinion, roll the bones!

Jeff

Yes, I agree. Anything you can add to your experience level can only help you. A 121 flying job will definitely make the transition easier. Not flying at all and allowing one to become non-current, I think can do harm.

 

[TheTIC]

First of all, keep flying. But I recommend a Gaurd or Reserve job over a regional. I got out of the military a few years ago and have about the same experience. Most of the people that I got out with are hired, or they are having a better life in the reserves then they had on active duty. I have a few friends that have your qualifications that are not hired, but are holding out for certain airlines. In the mean time they are making more money and getting more PIC in the reserves. Also, coming from the military and going into civilian world, watch out for the taxes. My take home pay is 62% of my income.

The 121 world isn't that cosmic, but you can only fly 30 hours in 7 days.

Good luck

 

[Rhoid]

Clyde, how did the "Yokohoma Mama" get hired? She had practicially no flight time and I've heard that she STILL can't upgrade after all these years. But she can say "Fraps 1"!