Looks like it might be over for VA...

[JungleJett]

And I have seen the poor raise up and make their own way.....some even become president.

We are the captains of our own ship...personal responsibility is becoming a rare commodity in this country.

...the rich we see on TV do not represent the majority of the wealth in this country. Just as the $hitbags we see on TV that kill 11 people in the south do not represent normal everyday people.

 

[The Prussian]

You're better off not realzing the humilty you endure to feed, clothe and shelter yourself.

It's OK...it's OK...grab ahold of yourself, man.....

(!!??!)

 

[~~~^~~~]

OK, so where I live the County contracts with some Laser Thingymabob that takes pictures of me if I wait for traffic to clear and end up in the intersection when the exactly 3.0 second yellow light turns to Red. I don't dare break that law because justice is terrible swift, although no one was harmed by my yielding to oncoming traffic.

But, blow off the rules about a several hundred million dollar investment and foreign ownership, throw a few thousand Americans out of work and eh' the government can't really get around to enforcing THAT law.

Anyone else think the executive branch of government has been asleep at the wheel since Ronnie was in the White House?

 

[~~~^~~~]

Just a quick question. Why is AS the only carrier to file this motion with DOT? It's not like VA is the direct competitor for AS in SEA for that matter...

True, the rest need to come to the table.

Frankly, if the Government is not going to enforce the law, maybe we should put tax receipts in escrow somewhere until they decide to do their job.

 

[Dizel8]

Fwiw...

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Virgin-America-says-it-apf-14621383.html

http://cbs5.com/video/[email protected]

I am pretty sure that VA's position could not be any clearer.


Maybe the old saying about "tilting at windmills" amy apply here...

Skipper

Well, if VA says it, then it must be true!

"Should the U.S. investors decide they want out of the company, which they have not decided yet, then there would have to be replacement (U.S.) investors found to hold those shares," Cush said. "That's the law. That's very clear."

 

[ualdriver]

Fwiw...

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Virgin-America-says-it-apf-14621383.html

http://cbs5.com/video/[email protected]

I am pretty sure that VA's position could not be any clearer.


Maybe the old saying about "tilting at windmills" amy apply here...

Skipper

Did you believe it when Diffenderffer, the CEO of Skybus, said he was leaving Skybus so that he could "write books?" What do they say about management and when their lips are moving?

VA's position is really this: Don't stop buying our tickets even though we've run into a little *ahem* bump in the road. He's getting out in front of the bad news so travel agents, companies, and travelers don't book away from VA.

And I don't think it's only Alaska wondering about the legality of VA's existence. I bet UA is taking a look, too. They're probably just not being as vocal about it.

I also loved the quote in the Yahoo! article that stated that fares are down 15% in the markets that Virgin enters. Just great. Because we all know airfares in this country are WAY too high.

 

[Dizel8]

And I don't think it's only Alaska wondering about the legality of VA's existence. I bet UA is taking a look, too.

I bet most carriers are starting to take a look!

 

[another cfii]

Back when oil was 140+, all the airlines' CEO jointly wrote a letter to the congress, asking for some sort of relief. With the economy the way it is now, I could only imagine this VA debacle isn't on top of their list of things to do.

 

[bluesideup340]

Corp HQ in one country, operating certificate issued by another, labor law and flight crews in yet another country.... that is the wave of the future...

The problem with globalization is the market is wide open, but there are minimal laws to keep it all together.

How is a pilot based in one country supposed to enforce labor law or civil air law against his company who is legal in another country, all while the operating certificate is issued by another country...

this is the end game..... foreign ownership is just the camels nose under the tent...

Rez,
what you are discribing here has absolutly nothing to do with foreign ownership.
The Operating Certificate is still in the US and the US labor law still ably.
So stop scaring people with empty speech.

 

[Skippy]

how much do they need to raise -- i thought they paid out 177 million plus 8% interest--- they can find that chump change anywhere-- look at republic-- they just gave 40 mil to frontier.

and im sure the govmnt gives them adequate time to find the backers--- aka a foreign company funneling money to them ( the "us based" company) so they can "invest" it back into VA.

SKIPPY

Va is fine--

 

[fam62c]

Fwiw...

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Virgin-America-says-it-apf-14621383.html

http://cbs5.com/video/[email protected]

I am pretty sure that VA's position could not be any clearer.


Maybe the old saying about "tilting at windmills" amy apply here...

Skipper

I notice that they keep saying "voting shares." They are not denying that the majority of the common equity is no longer held by Americans. They have (or at least they think they have) found a way around the intent of the rules by defining a small portion of shares as "voting shares" that "control" the company. If they can get away with this you could have a situation where US airlines are almost completely capitalized with foreign investment dollars but are technically "controlled" by a small number of voting shares that are owned by Americans. While it's true that VA is just a small airline this could be a test case for significant foreign investment in much larger carriers. What they are really saying is that the people who put up all the money and "own" the company don't "control" the company i.e. the majority owners are "passive" investors. It sounds shady enough that it just might actually work, or if nothing else, delay things long enough to find another solution. The DOT regulations may be large enough to fly a fleet of A-320's through. This could get very interesting and set a new precedent for high foreign ownership stakes in US airlines.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

I love it when a LUV pilot talks about the need for a level playing field. Unless that field is Love Field.

Actually....he didn't mention a "level" playing field....he talked about a new playing field that he feels could result with too much government interference in how business operates.

In a free market society, none of us should ever want a "level" playing field. Whoever makes the better, more efficient widget should be the winner.

Competition is what makes Americans love a winner. I don't recall the Pittsburgh Steelers taking it easy on an opponent just because that opponent had injured players. You bring the talents you have to the game.

"Level" playing fields are what the former Soviet Union had in thier business environment...not what any of us want here.

BTW...if your product is better than what is currently offered at Love Field...then you are free to get in there and compete for the customer with all you have to offer.

And, with AA's recent announcement, 2 more gates will become available at Love Field on June 11, so you'll be able to compete....more.

This LUV pilot says...."Bring it on"

 

[Flopgut]

Why is it when pilots talk about "free market" they are talking to/about some unfortunate pilot losing a job? We all speak selectively about a "free market" when we talk about our corporations. It wouldn't be too hard to look back and chart a sequence of events that played out after deregulation that has led us to this point.

What if Branson get's political and they give VA exclusive use of some West Coast airport for 20 years or so? Sounds impossible until you consider it's happened before.

I don't know if that's worse than other airlines' multiple BKs dragging everyone down. Maybe it's not.

I do know how you would answer.

 

[The Prussian]

Actually....he didn't mention a "level" playing field....he talked about a new playing field that he feels could result with too much government interference in how business operates.

In a free market society, none of us should ever want a "level" playing field. Whoever makes the better, more efficient widget should be the winner.

Competition is what makes Americans love a winner. I don't recall the Pittsburgh Steelers taking it easy on an opponent just because that opponent had injured players. You bring the talents you have to the game.

"Level" playing fields are what the former Soviet Union had in thier business environment...not what any of us want here.

BTW...if your product is better than what is currently offered at Love Field...then you are free to get in there and compete for the customer with all you have to offer.

And, with AA's recent announcement, 2 more gates will become available at Love Field on June 11, so you'll be able to compete....more.

This LUV pilot says...."Bring it on"

...and this LUV pilot says...."Bring it on"

 

[The Prussian]

Why is it when pilots talk about "free market" they are talking to/about some unfortunate pilot losing a job? We all speak selectively about a "free market" when we talk about our corporations. It wouldn't be too hard to look back and chart a sequence of events that played out after deregulation that has led us to this point.

What if Branson get's political and they give VA exclusive use of some West Coast airport for 20 years or so? Sounds impossible until you consider it's happened before.

I don't know if that's worse than other airlines' multiple BKs dragging everyone down. Maybe it's not.

I do know how you would answer.

It really gets to be a stretch for me to understand where you're coming from.