Looking for Info on Pinnacle

[skippy767]

LEAR 70- Just for my review when we say 90 day upgrade. I thought you need 500 in type? or is it true you can upgrade in 90 days by 3500 total 1000 turbine 2000 multi. IS that true?

Also where are you based?

 

[Lear70]

I'm DTW-based, although I sport bid around, I'll be going back to DTW and staying as soon as I can hold it again.

Short answer: you don't have to have ANY CRJ time to hold Captain here as long as you hold the flight times you listed. We have several pilots who were here as F/O's less than 60 days and had no previous CRJ time who are now in Captain class.

The 90 days WAS a good figure... about a month ago. Every week that goes by, if you're not already here and in class, your odds of getting a Captain slot anytime in the near future dwindle dramatically.

 

[Chest Rockwell]

DTWFO,
We all deserve more, but when you put being a CRJ FO into perspective over the last 15 years in the regional industry, two grand a month is not bad. It was not that long ago that new hires at several regionals were getting $1,200 a month (or less) flying much more demanding aircraft (unpressurized, no autopilot or FD). I respect were you are coming from, but we often forget how much better the industry is compared to a short time ago.

Skyboy,
It may be shortsighted to choose a company over training pay. The opportunity fo advancement(upgrade) would be much more important ,if your goals were to move on to a major. If the regional ended up being your carrier for the long-term, whether or not you received pay during training would be of negligable impact (assuming you have a few bucks saved up for food during training). It is easy for us to allow issues such as these to allow emotion to guide our decisions, rather than sound judgement. I have to admit, I was fortunate to never having to train for free, although minimum wage @ $3.35/hr until taking the checkride was pretty close.

 

[sf3boy]

Lear 70,
I agree with ya that the Mesaba contract is no where near what it should have been with pay for 50 seaters and the Avro. It is a good thing we don't have the RJ's, so we can't say that we are the worst paid. However Saab pay (65% of the fleet) is outstanding.

It's funny, all the things that you said you liked in our contract.....well those items were already in our 1996 contract. Nothing new there.

Skyboy,
It is true that it would be shortsighted to limit your choice of airline on training pay. Look to the future. When I got hired at Mesaba, there were only a couple of more Avro's to come online. I have been an FO for over five years with no upgrade in sight. Pinnacle has around 25 more airplanes to receive, you do the math. They might get more, but I believe they will not. So if you're looking at being a career regional FO, here is my situation:
5+ years
40k/year (includes per diem)
Avg 15 days off/mo (some weekends off)
Avg 82 hr/mo
3 weeks of vacation

 

[Lear70]

It's funny, all the things that you said you liked in our contract.....well those items were already in our 1996 contract. Nothing new there.

Wow. I didn't know that. I went to the roadshow in DTW and your MEC made it sound like those were all "new and improved" things that would add 8 to 10% over your current pay.

If they were already there and weren't real improvements and things you would have had anyway, it makes me wonder why the TA passed?

I agree the Saab rates are great, our management is simply trying to use your rates, Mesa, etc, as our "peer" rates and trying to ignore Air Whiskey (pre-concession), Comair, and COEX's soon-to-be-signed increases, which we KNEW would happen when your TA was ratified. Since your CRJ rates were lower than ours at DOS and are now within 1% and Mesa and others have EVEN LOWER rates, our management is saying we're comparably OVER PAYED (DTW joke) and they want CONCESSIONS on work rules (duty limits, etc).

Like I said, it's going to be a LONG negotiating process...

 

[DTWFO]

DTWFO,
We all deserve more, but when you put being a CRJ FO into perspective over the last 15 years in the regional industry, two grand a month is not bad. It was not that long ago that new hires at several regionals were getting $1,200 a month (or less) flying much more demanding aircraft (unpressurized, no autopilot or FD). I respect were you are coming from, but we often forget how much better the industry is compared to a short time ago.

You are quite right, the aircraft are much easier to fly and make the job simpler. However, I wasn't referring to my pay rate in my previous post. I was referring to our managements inability to run an airline correctly and their negative attitude toward the pilots. Although if you want to talk about money, I made 1200 a month when I started here and that was only 2 years ago. And I still barely make 2000 a month now!! And you're right, two grand a month is not bad if you are single, live in Detroit, don't commute, and have no life, but I have a hard time believing that someone can support a family on that without some kind of government assistance. I agree with what you are saying, but I was just referring to our management..

 

[scabseeker]

I still believe that my W-2 at the end of the month would be within 2% of a Mesaba 4-year CA on the 50-seat jet rate when compared block for block, credit for credit and since I believe that we are paid sub-standardly, I therefore still believe the Mesaba contract to be sub-standard when taken as a whole.

Actually you're much closer than 2% at the end of the month being that:

1) There are no 50 seat jets at Mesaba.

2) There are no 4 year captains at Mesaba.

 

[CRJDog]

DTWFO,
We all deserve more, but when you put being a CRJ FO into perspective over the last 15 years in the regional industry, two grand a month is not bad. It was not that long ago that new hires at several regionals were getting $1,200 a month (or less) flying much more demanding aircraft (unpressurized, no autopilot or FD). I respect were you are coming from, but we often forget how much better the industry is compared to a short time ago.

Rockwell you are a **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED**in idiot! 2K a month is deplorable no matter how you look at it. Especially when you are flying a 30 million dollar jet with your family on it.

 

[Flyingdutchman]

I agree.. I get paid 200 bucks a day as a 21 y/old BE-200 F/O.. go figure..


G'luck folks!

 

[I.P. Freley]

I agree.. I get paid 200 bucks a day as a 21 y/old BE-200 F/O.. go figure.

...and someone running a spray plane makes more than even that. There's always gonna be a better-paying job than a regional. The point is you're not going to get a job at a major with only BE-200 time or doing loop-de-loops in an Ag Cessna, ya know?

The bottom-end pay scale sucks industry-wide, but it's a means to an end.

 

[Flyingdutchman]

...The point is you're not going to get a job at a major with only BE-200 time ya know?

I wouldn't put any money on it, if I where you..

FD

 

[Lear70]

Actually you're much closer than 2% at the end of the month being that:

1) There are no 50 seat jets at Mesaba.

2) There are no 4 year captains at Mesaba.

Nope, sure aren't now, but someday there undoubtedly will be both. Then, when you compare rates, maybe you'll understand what I'm talking about... then again, most guys with that type of mentality won't EVER get it.

I just hope there aren't too many people like that in OUR pilot group...

 

[I.P. Freley]

I wouldn't put any money on it, if I where you..

Beg pardon?