logging time in a Conquest I?

[210FR8DOG]

I'm sure this subject has been covered, sorry if it has. I have a chance to go back to my hometown and fly pipeline patrol in a 152 plus contract flying in a Conquest I. I only want to do it if I can legally log at least some of the Conquest time. Is this just like a Baron as far as logging? (sole manipulator, etc.) It is all part 91 and probably only about 20 hours a month or so. But it is twin turbine if I can log it and the pipeline work would be my steady income! Not to mention $150 a day plus expenses in the Conquest!!

I don't really want to leave my steady job at Fright Express flying the Baron 60-80 hours a month. But the Conquest is SWWWWEEEEEEEEEEEET!!!!!! I flew with this guy before I took the job at Fright Express. He's crazy so we get along great!!

Any thoughts or advice? Thanks a bunch,

Jeff

PS If I couldn't legally log it, how about just showing it in the log book for CRM/turbine but not adding it in the totals? A friend of mine did this and he is now full time in a KA 350.

PSS I've got about 320 ME now and would probably have close to 500 by the time this all goes down.

 

[jergar999]

Under part 91 you can log the time that you are the sole manipulator of the controls as PIC time. I believe the Conquest is a single pilot aircraft when operated under part 91, so I believe SIC is out of the question. Good luck with your decision. Conquests are faster than King Airs, that's all I know about them, but they seem like a nice aircraft.

 

[KINGAIR PIC]

If you like flying at Flt Express, I would say stay there. If you don't, or are sick of freight flying, only then should you leave.

The time that you are getting at F. E. is priceless. You are getting 80-100 hours a month flying the baron, and you are the ONLY PIC on that a/c. There is no question in the minds of the interviewers down the road that you know that baron inside & out, and that your experience with weather and the IFR environment is good.

If you take the pipeline job you will be building SE time with maybe a Conquest trip in between that you may or may not be able to log, depending on if the guy lets you fly or not. You probably won't go to school on the Conquest, so your knowledge on the aircraft won't be as good as the baron, and your multi time will slow down quite a bit.

Finally, Flight Express is a stable company, they are probably not going anywhere. As far as this Conquest, you don't really know how steady that job is. Any number of things could happen: They could sell the a/c tomorrow if the owner has financial trouble, the guy you fly with could end up being a jerk, and he starts using someone else in the right seat, you never know.

I would stay with Flight Express if I were you. I do speak from experience.

 

[C425Driver]

210,

The Conquest is a single pilot airplane, so logging SIC time is out. However, if you are going to alternate legs while flying the Conquest, you may log each of those legs that you fly as PIC provided that you have a high altitude endorsement in your logbook since the Conquest is a pressurized aircraft. If you don't have the endorsement, make sure your employer will train you to get it, otherwise you will just be a warm body in the right seat with nothing to show for it in your logbook.

Hope that helps a little.

C425Driver

 

[aviatrix]

Hey Jeff,

I agree with Kingair about staying at Flight Express, simply for the stability. It's hard to pass up the chance at some multi turbine PIC time though. By the time you moved back there and trained on the Conquest, you'll be getting called for regional interviews. The Baron time is accruing fast!
Let me know how Cleveland goes on the 28th, will ya? Good luck!

 

[Deftone45075]

However, if you are going to alternate legs while flying the Conquest, you may log each of those legs that you fly as PIC provided that you have a high altitude endorsement in your logbook since the Conquest is a pressurized aircraft. If you don't have the endorsement, make sure your employer will train you to get it, otherwise you will just be a warm body in the right seat with nothing to show for it in your logbook.

Actually, you DO NOT need the endorsement. You can log PIC in the airplane anyway. You are rated for the airplane, and thus meet the requirements for logging PIC time. The endorsement is a sign off, NOT a rating, and is only required for you to ACT as PIC.

 

[Nolife]

Safe isn't always safe

Safe job @ FLX, good piston multi... it's not going to get you anywhere for a while. I'd take the chance and get turbine time. Get a high alt sign off and if the guy is an MEI log some training to justify PIC.
You may get lucky and get called for an interview when you have 1000 multi, maybe not, at least with some turbine time it will open more doors.
Nashville guys aren't moving out very fast.

 

[KingAirer]

No brainer! Stay!

 

[msw]

Good Baron time vs. Maybe Conquest time

A Baron in hand is worth more than an occasional Conquest in the bush. At 80 - 100 hours a month of solid multi PIC time that you get at Fright Express, you should be real marketable for some entry level REAL job flying turbine equipment probably in less than a year.

My vote is to stick with the Baron.

But you gotta lets us all know what your final decision ends up being.

Inquiring mimes want to know.

 

[skylane58]

Actually, you DO NOT need the endorsement. You can log PIC in the airplane anyway. You are rated for the airplane, and thus meet the requirements for logging PIC time. The endorsement is a sign off, NOT a rating, and is only required for you to ACT as PIC

Actually, you DO need the endorsement. PIC is PIC wether you are the acting PIC or not. There isn't a spot in your log book for acting PIC and non acting PIC. The high altitude endorsement is the same as the high performce and the complex endorsements. You have to have them to be PIC. And you have to log training, both ground and flight, to get them. If the airplane can go over 250 and or it is pressurized you need the endorsment.

Aside from that, its a tough call. Do you get a little turbine time or continue a lot of piston? I personally would stay at the Baron, but I have one of those part time Conquest jobs now and am not flying near enough for my liking. I would give it up in a heart beat to get job to build good solid multi time, piston or turbine. If you got 500 multi by the time you get to the Conquest, that would be OK too. You definatly need the turbine time to help you out later on in the career. Just keep in mind that only one of you can log PIC at a time, so if you alternate legs or by an off chance he lets you do all the flying, you can definatly log the time. Good luck with your decision, its a tough one.

 

[j41driver]

Actually, you DO NOT need the endorsement. You can log PIC in the airplane anyway. You are rated for the airplane, and thus meet the requirements for logging PIC time. The endorsement is a sign off, NOT a rating, and is only required for you to ACT as PIC.

How do you log PIC time if you are not acting as PIC?

 

[A Squared]

Actually, folks, Deftone is correct. You may indeed log PIC in a plane that you do not have all the reqired *endorsements* You must be *rated* for the airplane. Notice that the reg that allows sole manipulator PIC logging (61.51) requires you to be *rated* but says nothing about being *endorsed*

For whatever reason, the FAA makes a distinction between *acting* as PIC and *logging* PIC. There is a FAA chief counsel interpretation which sheds some light on this, I'll see if I can dig it up.

 

[skylane58]

Regardless of the gray area, how is an interviewer going to look at it if you log PIC and don't have the endorsment?

"I see you have some conquest time. But you don't have the high altitude endorsement. How did you log PIC?"

"I wasn't acting PIC."

"Well, either you were PIC or you weren't. Which is it?"

I know they look for it also, the couple of interviews I have been to, they looked for it when they say I had turbine time at only 1200hrs. Lucky for me I played by the rules and got the training I needed and the endorsement.

Its a valid argument on how you log your time. Its your log book, put what you want in it. Just be prepared to back it up later.

 

[BaronFR8Dog]

Stay put!

Hey Jeff,

This is Ron up at LUK. Hang onto that Baron gig like grim death man! Don't move until you have a minimum of 1000 multi. 1500 is better. I just passed 1000 myself.

 

[spitfiremk8]

Jeff,

Don't do it! Rumor is that the conquest won't be there for long. The lady might be going to a nursing home. Keep doing what you're doing, before you know you'll have an airline interview.
Try SkyWest; they love part 135 guys.

Just another fellow from the FALLS!

 

[A Squared]

Regardless of the gray area, how is an interviewer going to look at it if you log PIC and don't have the endorsment?

"I see you have some conquest time. But you don't have the high altitude endorsement. How did you log PIC?"

"I wasn't acting PIC."

"Well, either you were PIC or you weren't. Which is it?"

Skylane, I agree with your comments. I question the value of "sole manipulator" PIC time.

In my personal opinon, you should only be allowed to log PIC if you are fully qualified and you are *acting* as PIC, but my opinion is not shared by the FAA and they make the rules.

 

[210FR8DOG]

thanks guys

I guess I could have saved you all some trouble. I do have the high altitude edorsement. It sounds like more votes for staying in the Baron. I appreciate all the responses. Especially one Baron in the hand......!!LOL I like flying the Baron by myself 'cause I can sing real loud without anyone gettin a headache!! Anyway, it can always be worse. Thanks again guys.

Aviatrix- Hey Captain C!!! How's it goin up in yankee land? I'll call you soon.

spitfiremk8- Is that you Sasha? Send me a PM or E-mail. Let me know what's going on. [email protected]

Jeff

 

[LAXSaabdude]

Do NOT go for this "opportunity". I have heard this countless times over and over again.

Whenever someone pitches a job that promises "some" multi/turbine/jet time as a carrot for some other less desirable job, it is NEVER EVER what is promised. I have been burned by this one, and so have many of my other friends in this industry. Stay put. Sounds like you are just fine where you are.

LAXSaabdude.