Logging Approaches

[Swerpipe]

Giving up?

Attempting to have a discussion with you is nearly as productive as trying to dance with water. Crikey..

Probably right, you have no intention to discuss just patronize.

Clearly you've never been through the enforcement process or dealt directly with the FAA legal system. You can be forgiven, therefore, your ignorance on the subject. Unlike you, I do have experience at several levels within the administration, and though I presently do not, have represented the Administrator. ..

No, nor I intend to...you are an expert in Law not in flying that much was clear

You seem to have it all figured out, though, so good luck to you. With that level of ignorance, you may well one day need it! You're so busy trying to tell the world how it turns. Like so many. Good luck to you; hopefully you won't find out how ignorant you are of the regulation, the hard way.

I have not figured anything out. I visit the board to learn.
You are always condescending and patronizing to myself and others. When confronted with a challenge, for example, show me where in the regs it says approaches have to be flown to minimmums in IMC to count, then you come back with nothing.
Many of the folks posting here (like minitour) are just passionate about aviation and just want to learn to be greeted by a person with a superiority complex.

Posted by Transpac...about AVBUG
"My only real complaint is his condescending attitude toward anyone who disagrees with him, right or wrong."

Not just me AVBUG.BTW I read you did rodeo clowning as a hobbie. That's fascinating....I certainly don't have the balls to try that. See? found something cool about you....

 

[minitour]

...Many of the folks posting here (like minitour) are just passionate about aviation and just want to learn...

As evidence by my retarded amount of posting over the past (not quite a) year that I've been a member here... LOL

Seriously,
I do appreciate all information/help that I can get here. Sometimes, you just have to weed out the bad from the good. Typically, avbug does provide good advice/information, so I tend to take into consideration what he has to say. Others are the same way.

...ANYWAY...moving on...I just wanted to clarify my position on this thread (which was that I was wrong - as I admitted before - and appreciate the help and information)...

-mini

 

[PropsForward]

The whole safety pilot thing boils down to what you can do and what you should do. The regs does not specify so you are free to use a safety pilot anytime, anywhere, any conditon. But it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that letting your buddy log PIC in IMC because you are under the hood is a form of moral cheating. It's one of them loopholes. There is no way the saftey pilot can contribute to a safe working environment when he can't see 100 feet.

As for logging approaches. Log an approach when you need to use an approach to get down. If ATC can only clear you down to 2000 feet (MVA) and it is overcast 1000 feet. Then the only way you can expect to get to the airport is the fly the approach. Even though it is not to minimums, it is a countable approach because it was requried to land (...in actual or simulated conditions). Same thing goes if you have to fly through a layer below the FAF. Again, the regs do not specify so your free to log them how you wish. but this way is the most reasonable and generally accepted. It is not until CAT II/III approaches that the regs talk about where and when to count.

If everyone only logged approaches to mins then you could probably exclude better then 90% of the approaches counted even though they were required.
You would look quite the fool at your job interview if you had 2000hrs IMC logged and only 20-30 or so actual IMC approaches and tried to explain this "to minimums" thing.

 

[minitour]

...It is not until CAT II/III approaches that the regs talk about where and when to count...

and even then, it's pretty vague...

...follow the approach to DA/DH or "alert altitude"...or something like that...

on a related note...I'm surprised at how easy the regs make it seem to get Cat II/III authorization...weird

-mini

 

[PropsForward]

The next question is "What is a base". On Christmas eve, I was flying into Tampa and the WX was OVC005. I shot the localizer and saw terrain at 700ft, but did not have forward visibility until 600ft. I gave ATC a pirep that the bases were 600ft. Then about 6 aircraft behind me all called ATC and reported 700ft. Yes, I did "breakout" at 700ft, but I could not see the airport, and could not see a tower in front of me (should there be one) so I waited until I did see the airport, and that was 100ft less.

Now this gets more interesting on an ILS approach. WX is calling OVC002, you shoot the approach and at DH you see the ground but do not have the forward visibility to the field. I typically start a "lazy" missed knowing that in another 3-4 seconds or so I will see the runway, approach lights, etc and be able to land. I find myself more comfortable with this than utilizing the fact that DH is not MDA and letting the aircraft descend an additional 50ft on the go around knowing that will also let me see the runway, etc. While both are pushing the edge of the approach envelope (not going to say "unsafe"), the first one feels safer.

I probably should have saved this for it's own thread....

 

[nosehair]

Training, Training, Training! - A good pilot is always training.

I remember when I left the school environment and "went into the field", I was shocked (this was many years ago) to see that pilots did not wear the hood provided in each aircraft, but logged the monthly required instrument training time anyway. "How could this be?", I said to myself, this is life-or-death stuff. Does not every pilot try to be the best that he can be? Well, I have come to know that is not the case.
It makes absolutely perfect sense to practice one full instrument approach a month to minimums - to minimums, right? that's where it gets hairy - that's where the practice needs to occur. If you don't get an actual one to minimums, you need to put the hood on and practice one.

If you put the hood on during one of those in-and-out days, you would keep the hood on during the entire approach to insure doing the full approach to mins in simulated conditions. No matter what's going on outside. You're in-and-out. Maybe solid for the entire approach, but you don't know if it will stay solid or not, so you keep the hood on and therefore you need to keep the safety pilot employed.

Got it?

 

[midlifeflyer]

Sounds simple to me.