Leaving Jetblue

[Lake Alice]

When are you leaving Alice?

No timetable yet. The apps are out, just waiting for the call.

 

[Lake Alice]

I think there will be a noticeable, not expansive, attrition of mid to senior FO's at Jblue for the majors in 2013. The draw of heavy international metal will win over schedules and bases. It's the pilots way.

It's not a tremendous concern of Jetblue if more senior pilots leave but during the mid 2000's when many junior pilots left that certainly raised some eyebrows. Given career progression at Jetblue is mainly tied to expansion many junior pilots can get the same QOL with better career potential at the bottom of a DAL or SWA list. This isn't a knock on Jetblue but the reality of our benefits package/career progression. This leads many doing interviews to believe Jetblue is intentionally hiring pilots with below average time in an effort to retain them longer.

 

[Flyby1206]

It wi be very interesting when the legacies finally do start hiring en masse. When AA starts their Airbus deliveries will they prefer to hire a RJ Capt with 1000PIC or an A320 FO with no PIC? Either way, once the retirements at mainline start cranking up then the requirements will drop like a rock.

 

[Lake Alice]

I had a united MEC pilot on the jumpseat a few months back and he showed us the projected retirements for UAL/CAL combined list over the next 12 years and it's shocking. The first year or two average low hundreds but 3,4 or 5 years later they are close to 1000 or more per year. Usair is still projected to turn over half the east list in the next 10 years, AA depends on how bankruptcy/merger works out. Who knows where the new hires will come from but there will be hiring.

 

[Fins Up]

I had a united MEC pilot on the jumpseat a few months back and he showed us the projected retirements for UAL/CAL combined list over the next 12 years and it's shocking. The first year or two average low hundreds but 3,4 or 5 years later they are close to 1000 or more per year. Usair is still projected to turn over half the east list in the next 10 years, AA depends on how bankruptcy/merger works out. Who knows where the new hires will come from but there will be hiring.

That part about USAir is interesting. Retirement might be the way they get rid of east and give more and more routes to west. I'm not sure if that's how it works.

 

[say again]

Remember all the pilots who left SWA, FedEx, UPS, etc in 2000-2001 for the great jobs at UAL, AAL, DAL, NWA, USAirways. When you make a move there is an element of luck. Often is will take 10 years before you know if you made the right move.

Exactly, aviation is one big gamble!!

 

[Lake Alice]

Remember all the pilots who left SWA, FedEx, UPS, etc in 2000-2001 for the great jobs at UAL, AAL, DAL, NWA, USAirways. When you make a move there is an element of luck. Often is will take 10 years before you know if you made the right move.

Holy sh!t. You're a gawd darn genious! You gotta put that Zhouyi commentary in some sort of publication for all to enjoy.

 

[ackattacker]

That part about USAir is interesting. Retirement might be the way they get rid of east and give more and more routes to west. I'm not sure if that's how it works.

That's not how it works. Right now all the hiring is on the east and I expect that's how it will be for the near future. There's not enough for the west pilots to do so they're actually flying some east routes.

 

[PsubS]

I think at least one has--a female FO who's hubby still works at JB.

 

[pilotyip]

all part of the 2012 hiring boom

 

[labbats]

all part of the 2012 hiring boom

Oh man I hope you're right. It's been over a decade of cuts and stagnation.

 

[JA-601]

I'm about 1400ish on the senority list and will be leaving ASAP.......I've seen the real JB and tired of the lies, double talk, lack of improvements, and working like a slave..........
WE WORK 30% MORE THAN ANY OTHER AIRLINE PILOT !
The Direct Relationship has brought me sub-standard pay, terrible medical, and a serious lack of retirement 401K match........
All the while our schedules are getting worse and worse......their mentality is "how long can we keep you on duty, while paying you as little as possible."

I have finally come to the realization its just not a good job........just my opinion.

 

[say again]

Well then I guess you are the expert. Enjoy your AMAZING 91 job.

You're one ignorant fool to think that your "superior" A320/E190 gig is better than all part 91 gigs (yes, mine is AMAZING). I'll enjoy my better pay, QOL and beni's. Like I said, I have many friends there, and not all thinks it's a great gig..for reasons above. You don't like the negative talk, then I hope you all do something to fix it.

 

[BentOver]

It's not a tremendous concern of Jetblue if more senior pilots leave but during the mid 2000's when many junior pilots left that certainly raised some eyebrows. Given career progression at Jetblue is mainly tied to expansion many junior pilots can get the same QOL with better career potential at the bottom of a DAL or SWA list. This isn't a knock on Jetblue but the reality of our benefits package/career progression. This leads many doing interviews to believe Jetblue is intentionally hiring pilots with below average time in an effort to retain them longer.

I kinda have to agree with your last statement....

Not that I'm a NASA pilot or anything. But a perfectly clean record 7000+TT, 1000+TPIC, 4 jet types, edumicated (although only an associates due to finances but close to the full deal, Dean's list otherwise). many many recs.... and not a peep.

Although I know I'm just about on par with thousands of other applicants, I can't see how I'm less qualified than many of the 3000 hr regional FO's that have been hired.......

questions/comments/thoughts...

BTW, after careful consideration, I don't think I can afford JB (or any other airline) for atleast another year or two anyhow....Gotta take care of the family first

 

[CRJ200pilot]

I agree! JB would rather have less experience guys because they Won't (but more importantly CANT) go anywhere else when the more desireable places start to hire... JB has learned from their past. JB wants/NEEDS you to stay, so why not hire lower tiered candidates. Just my theory

I kinda have to agree with your last statement....

Not that I'm a NASA pilot or anything. But a perfectly clean record 7000+TT, 1000+TPIC, 4 jet types, edumicated (although only an associates due to finances but close to the full deal, Dean's list otherwise). many many recs.... and not a peep.

Although I know I'm just about on par with thousands of other applicants, I can't see how I'm less qualified than many of the 3000 hr regional FO's that have been hired.......

questions/comments/thoughts...

BTW, after careful consideration, I don't think I can afford JB (or any other airline) for atleast another year or two anyhow....Gotta take care of the family first

 

[TommyG]

Lower tiered? Don't think so. They can pick whoever they want in this job market. Look at Bent, he can't get a call and maybe he should have been at NASA with his time. He's a top tiered candidate. My point, earlier, is that guys like JA-601 will leave Jblue when the big dogs all open up in late 2012 and on. That will shake up the culture enough at JBlue so guys who hate it and need to leave do so. And, guys who are junior will gain that seniority like it and will stay. JBlue takes its cues from the industry and pay, benefits and work rules will change in step. The key to the industry will be when the new Delta and United contracts are negotiated. This will set the tone for the next decade.

 

[MikeSF340]

Getting hired at any airline is a crap shoot. When Continental was hiring
In 2005-07 I personally saw interns, sons, daughters, etc get hired with
less than 2500 TOTAL time and NO 121 PIC. I don't think it's some grand
conspiracy at JB. I can tell you in my class at JB out of 12 people only one
had no turbine PIC and he had over 4000 hours. I can understand the frustration
about not getting a call, but I would believe the conspiracy theories.

 

[Smarta$$]

You're one ignorant fool to think that your "superior" A320/E190 gig is better than all part 91 gigs (yes, mine is AMAZING). I'll enjoy my better pay, QOL and beni's. Like I said, I have many friends there, and not all thinks it's a great gig..for reasons above. You don't like the negative talk, then I hope you all do something to fix it.

You should put up your pay and benefits package along with your schedule (the way our information is public) so we can pick it apart and criticize its imperfections the way you do. You hide behind the anonymity of your inconspicuous 91 job and throw out shots at our package.

I can GUARANTEE you that we would find critical things to hate about your job.

You're a jacka$$.

And just so we are clear you arrogant prick, F.U.

 

[Smarta$$]

The interview selection process has many components to it. One of which is random. We also have thousands of applications from people with your qualifications, (the pilot above), and they can't and won't all be called. Often times, the ones without the PIC know the RIGHT person, not just a some JetBlue pilots. Not that I agree with hiring low time pilots, but I know for a FACT that it is a function of knowing the RIGHT person. I can say from my class and the classes around mine, that non-T-PIC pilots made up less than 15% of the new hires. 15% is still way to high in my opinion.

 

[$$$4nothin]

I'm about 1400ish on the senority list and will be leaving ASAP.......I've seen the real JB and tired of the lies, double talk, lack of improvements, and working like a slave..........
WE WORK 30% MORE THAN ANY OTHER AIRLINE PILOT !Absolutely FALSE. As a matter of fact I am home more now commuteing to reserve than I was with a line liveing in base at my old airline. With long call and release days I will be spending 16 nights minimum in my own bed this month on reserve.
The Direct Relationship has brought me sub-standard pay,(Pay is industry average or better depending on aircraft type) terrible medical,(Medical is actually pretty standard. However the costs are absolutely horrible. That I definately will give you) and a serious lack of retirement 401K match (This is a fact, especially for our peer set)........
All the while our schedules are getting worse and worse......their mentality is "how long can we keep you on duty, while paying you as little as possible."

I have finally come to the realization its just not a good job........just my opinion.

JB does need work, and I believe it will only get better with time. (be that through a union or the DR) However this is obviously the first airline gig for anyone that does nothing but say how bad it is here at JB. Either that or they have financially backed themselves into a corner and no matter how much money they get it will never be enough.