Learning to fly the AT-6

[Huggyu2]

Is there a "best book" for learning about the AT-6/SNJ? I'm talking about how to fly it, and about all the limitations/systems/etc...
I figure the old Dash-1 might be the best, but was wondering if someone published some sort of modern reference, especially for flying it in the pattern.

 

[stearmann4]

Huggy,

I used the Dash to start as well. I also subscribed to NATA several years ago as they have great R-1340 operating discussions in their newsletter. You can do a search on their web page and select all the appropriate articles that apply to operations.

There'a an extremely knowledgeable T-6 guy in Camarillo where I did my check out. He's taught several T-6 ground schools and puts together a nice, color systems and operator's guide updated and slimmed down for the layman. PM me and I'll hook you up with him. BTW, where is your T-6 out of?

Mike-

 

[svcta]

Absolutely join the NATA. The website will leaves a little to be desired, but the newsletter is a tremendous resource. Good articles, tips, etc, as well as advertisers that may be of use. If you're in the southeast I may be able to steer you to one or two people.

 

[Huggyu2]

svcta, I'm on the Left Coast, but thanks for the offer.
Stearmann, p.m. is on the way.
I'll check out NATA more: you're right,... the website didn't impress.

 

[RoundMotor]

Its a Stick and Rudder airplane. You have to fly by feel mainly. Some numbers work but mostly its yor butt telling you what to do.
I would not use a noise canceling headset you get a lot of cues from the different sounds. Find someone who has some time in it and go fly. Do Stop and goes instead of trying Touch and goes.
If you cant find someone to fly with you try a stearman. Rember there were 17 year olds flying these things with 20 hours.
If you are in the central florida area try gutmanair.com

RM

 

[svcta]

I generally don't think of a T-6 as a seat of your pants machine, to be honest. The airplane does give feedback like most others, but it is much faster than you would think in terms of approach and climb speeds(when it really counts) and does have some dirty secrets. I find that using the numbers and passing through "gates" at different points in an approach is still the best way to end up where you want to be. You'll find, though, that it's an easier airplane to fly if you sort of step outside convention in terms of how we as civilians choose to fly. Circling approaches in the T-6,for example, are much easier in my opinion than a typical traffic pattern.

It is not an airplane that you routinely want to fly slowly and it will absolutely do nasty things to you if you don't stay on top of the numbers. It makes drastic moves when stalled and the stall speed will increase dramatically with load. The T-6 was designed so well from an aerodynamic standpoint that it has what I consider to be textbook handling characteristics. When it's stalled...it just stalls and that's that. No questions asked and no in between. But when you break the stall it stands right back at attention(essentially). They don't recover from spins like a Cessna, either. You have to fly it out using your head as much as your bottom. There were MANY T-6s crashed by trainees during the war(on the order of thousands if memory serves) and it was the last stop before fighters were issued..the guys flying them had more than 20 hours(though still very low time, agreed).

I don't think of a T-6 as the hardest conventional gear airplane I've ever flown....ground handling is actually not that bad, but it is a "numbers" airplane in the air. And if you're not used to a little energy management then you'll need some dual.

I agree about the noise canceling headset, they don't work in environments with this level of noise and you'll find that they're louder than a set of regular David Clarks.

 

[erj-145mech]

Both cockpits must be placarded "Intentional Spinning Prohibited". This is in the FAA type certificate data sheet. Your IA should be checking for this at each annual inspection.

Its my understanding that its easier to recover if the CG is near its forward limit, so if you have a fat boy in the back seat, you may not be able to recover from a spin.

 

[svcta]

These things are true...

 

[bugchaser]

I agree about the noise canceling headset, they don't work in environments with this level of noise and you'll find that they're louder than a set of regular David Clarks.

Sorry, but I have to disagree with that. A good ANR headset or helmet works great with the noise produced by this engine and prop combo. At least thats my experience in a few thousand hours of 1340 operation. Don't have much time in the six, but also feel like its a "feel" airplane. As long as its going where its pointed, you'll have no problems. Just go fly it.

 

[svcta]

As long as its going where its pointed, you'll have no problems. Just go fly it.

Isn't that always the case? It really is the kind of airplane that can hurt you, it just depends on where you're coming from. It does have comfortable margins, but where it differs from just about every other airplane that I've flown is how is responds when it's manhandled at the wrong moment or just taken a little beyond said margins. There is no gray area with a T-6, IMO, it's either flying or it ain't.

Depending on your background I wouldn't necessarily be afraid to tell you to go fly it and figure it out, either, but I'd certainly have to know a little about where you're coming from before I made that suggestion. As an example, I'd tell a guy with a few hundred hours and basic tailwheel competence to get in a super cub and figure it out for himself. But I would NEVER do that with this particular machine.

Regarding the ANR, I used a set of BOSE once and the lack of any sort of passive canceling really seemed to make my eardrums shake when the power was pushed up. One man's experience. I think that for the average flyer, doing an hour or two a day, the DCs work great with no ANR. I've done as much as 6 + hours a day in a T-6 and have had no comfort issues with the good ole' clamps.

 

[VNugget]

Just thought I'd stick my head in the thread, as it's interesting rading in anticipation of getting checked out in a few weeks.

I've got one flight so far including a bunch of acro and one landing, and can't wait for more. So far, my experiences echo what Bugchaser said... if you put it down at the right attitude and pointing straight ahead, everythings' fine, just like any other airplane. I guess the differences come in when you don't.

 

[svcta]

I guess the differences come in when you don't.

That was my exact point. While not really hard to fly, it isn't what you'd call forgiving.

Where abouts are you, nuggy? Anywhere around the S.E.?

 

[VNugget]

Nope, I'm in the SF bay area, but I'll be all over the west coast this summer hauling rides, which brings me to my present situation regarding the Texan

 

[Tomct]

Nope, I'm in the SF bay area, but I'll be all over the west coast this summer hauling rides, which brings me to my present situation regarding the Texan

Which is? Have never heard of any FBO's flaunting T-6 time? Do you know someone who owns one? That would be Too Cool for School!

 

[VNugget]

Which is? Have never heard of any FBO's flaunting T-6 time? Do you know someone who owns one? That would be Too Cool for School!

Actually these guys in San Carlos offer one for a little under $300 an hour, and it even says they'll rent it to you solo, with minimums that are very very reasonable.

Anyway that's not what I'm doing, since I can't afford it. So I did the next best thing, I got a job flying one http://www.americanwarbird.com/. I go get checked out mid-February and then spend 6 months on the road eating, sleeping and drinking T-6 all the way from Arizona, through California, up to Oregon, Washington, and Idaho. I'm so giddy in anticipation that I pee a little every time I think about it. :nuts:

 

[Ill Mitch]

Actually these guys in San Carlos offer one for a little under $300 an hour, and it even says they'll rent it to you solo, with minimums that are very very reasonable.

Anyway that's not what I'm doing, since I can't afford it. So I did the next best thing, I got a job flying one http://www.americanwarbird.com/. I go get checked out mid-February and then spend 6 months on the road eating, sleeping and drinking T-6 all the way from Arizona, through California, up to Oregon, Washington, and Idaho. I'm so giddy in anticipation that I pee a little every time I think about it. :nuts:

LOL...did KK tell you about the time he got lost flying out of Fresno and ended up in the Owens Valley?

 

[VNugget]

LOL...did KK tell you about the time he got lost flying out of Fresno and ended up in the Owens Valley?

No, should I be worried? If I were in Fresno for more than a few minutes I'd wanna get lost too....

 

[Ill Mitch]

No, should I be worried? If I were in Fresno for more than a few minutes I'd wanna get lost too....

I hear that! I've been there nine months and am making my escape back to the Bay Area in a few weeks. Whew....
:uzi: ---->Fresno

 

[Huggyu2]

Side note: when I spoke with West Valley Flying Club at San Carlos, they informed me the T-6 couldn't be rented out solo.

 

[Ill Mitch]

Side note: when I spoke with West Valley Flying Club at San Carlos, they informed me the T-6 couldn't be rented out solo.

From what I understand, the only people that can solo it are the 'partners' in the airplane.

 

[cargoflyr69]

I knew Kevin when he was working with Bruce and the NATG gang out of florida. Sounds like a fun gig. Curious what about the pay? travel stipends? that is if you dont mind sharing. Have fun, you'll have a blast and meet all sorts of cool people on the road, not to mention a few FBO Hotties!

Actually these guys in San Carlos offer one for a little under $300 an hour, and it even says they'll rent it to you solo, with minimums that are very very reasonable.

Anyway that's not what I'm doing, since I can't afford it. So I did the next best thing, I got a job flying one http://www.americanwarbird.com/. I go get checked out mid-February and then spend 6 months on the road eating, sleeping and drinking T-6 all the way from Arizona, through California, up to Oregon, Washington, and Idaho. I'm so giddy in anticipation that I pee a little every time I think about it. :nuts:

 

[Ill Mitch]

I knew Kevin when he was working with Bruce and the NATG gang out of florida. Sounds like a fun gig. Curious what about the pay? travel stipends? that is if you dont mind sharing. Have fun, you'll have a blast and meet all sorts of cool people on the road, not to mention a few FBO Hotties!

I did a two year stint with Warbird Adventures from 2001 til 2003. During that time, I grossed about 36K with another 8-10K in tips and logged about 1200 hours in the mighty Texan.
My whole time there was spent in Kissimmee, while the other guys went on the road with two of the airplanes.
It was a fun gig.

I can't answer about the hardcore roadshows the other guys do.

 

[VNugget]

While I prefer to keep the pay private, I'll say that I'm real happy with the situation.

Well, one day closer to flying the T-6!

 

[topbnk]

Hopefully you will show up for your next job!

 

[topbnk]

I did a two year stint with Warbird Adventures from 2001 til 2003. During that time, I grossed about 36K with another 8-10K in tips and logged about 1200 hours in the mighty Texan.
My whole time there was spent in Kissimmee, while the other guys went on the road with two of the airplanes.
It was a fun gig.

I can't answer about the hardcore roadshows the other guys do.

Hopefully you will show up for your next job!

 

[Ill Mitch]

Hopefully you will show up for your next job!

This regarding TDX? Couldn't do the training pay for however many months (2-3 or so) and pay alimoney to the ex-B*&%#.