Lear 60 PIC needed......10,000 TT needed. lol

[westwind driver]

To all those who wouldn't want to help with oil changes / extra duties etc,

It may not be what you're looking for, after all seems most pilots just want to fly an airplane and get paid an incredible ammount of money for doing it, but to someone a job like that might pay their bills until something better comes along.

You know why CFOs and other management don't like pilots? Because airplanes cost money. Pilots in general do nothing to generate revenue or contribute to the bottom line. And now with the state of the economy, many organizations are trying to pinch pennies, so instead of just flying the aircraft, you might actually have to do something constructive for the company.

Pilots are a dime-a-dozen. There is nothing special about being a pilot. To management pilots are just a piece of meat in the seat, easily replaced.

When was the last time some of you went in armed with records showing where you helped the company save money. Such as where there are two FBOs on a field, one has fuel that is $1 per gallon cheaper, so you go there, and keep a log of how much money you saved by purchasing at one FBO and not the other?

I've heard many a pilot say 'Whats it matter, if they can't afford the gas, they can't afford the airplane.' Same thing with really nice hotels and SUV rental cars.

Bottom line is this, in today's economy and job market, if you're not willing to lower your standard just a little bit, and get off the GOD complex, you simply will have to wait for a job when this turns around.

Everyone knows this joke:
What's the difference between a pilot and God? God doesn't think he's a pilot.

Just food for thought. I'm not trying to rag on anybody here, just trying to open some eyes to the fact that there is no need to complain if you're not willing to even apply for the job. Someone will take the job, and that is the reality. Many have been too high on the hog in recent years and don't know how to adjust. I don't agree with flying for free or flying for currency or paying for training, but someone out there does and is willing to do these things just to get their foot in the door.

Okay anyway, rant over.

BTW, if you have questions about why a company wants 10,000TT, why don't you try to contact them directly and ask? No stupid question except the one never asked (that could be argued too LOL)

Ya'll have a great day!

 

[X man]

Lear 60

Not to get involved with the discussions as of date, did anyone land this job, is it still open, any feedback on resume's, etc.

Cheers

 

[rjpilot7667]

To all those who wouldn't want to help with oil changes / extra duties etc,

It may not be what you're looking for, after all seems most pilots just want to fly an airplane and get paid an incredible ammount of money for doing it, but to someone a job like that might pay their bills until something better comes along.

You know why CFOs and other management don't like pilots? Because airplanes cost money. Pilots in general do nothing to generate revenue or contribute to the bottom line. And now with the state of the economy, many organizations are trying to pinch pennies, so instead of just flying the aircraft, you might actually have to do something constructive for the company.

Pilots are a dime-a-dozen. There is nothing special about being a pilot. To management pilots are just a piece of meat in the seat, easily replaced.

When was the last time some of you went in armed with records showing where you helped the company save money. Such as where there are two FBOs on a field, one has fuel that is $1 per gallon cheaper, so you go there, and keep a log of how much money you saved by purchasing at one FBO and not the other?

I've heard many a pilot say 'Whats it matter, if they can't afford the gas, they can't afford the airplane.' Same thing with really nice hotels and SUV rental cars.

Bottom line is this, in today's economy and job market, if you're not willing to lower your standard just a little bit, and get off the GOD complex, you simply will have to wait for a job when this turns around.

Everyone knows this joke:
What's the difference between a pilot and God? God doesn't think he's a pilot.

Just food for thought. I'm not trying to rag on anybody here, just trying to open some eyes to the fact that there is no need to complain if you're not willing to even apply for the job. Someone will take the job, and that is the reality. Many have been too high on the hog in recent years and don't know how to adjust. I don't agree with flying for free or flying for currency or paying for training, but someone out there does and is willing to do these things just to get their foot in the door.

Okay anyway, rant over.

BTW, if you have questions about why a company wants 10,000TT, why don't you try to contact them directly and ask? No stupid question except the one never asked (that could be argued too LOL)

Ya'll have a great day!

The problem is that the amount of time required confuses quantity instead of quality. I have flown with 20,000 hr pilots that have scared the daylights out of me and leave me wondering how they have lived that long. The focus should be on quality and while we are on the subject guys that look at themselves as just meat in the seat are just that. You need to contribute to your organization and the minute you hear those kind of comments out of someones mouth you need to correct them. I can crunch numbers at a desk all day and I do, can they fly jets? the answer almost always is no.

As an MBA I am keenly aware of the economy and how it has effected people and if you are one of them I feel sorry for you too. But don't mistake arrogance for obsurdity for a lear 60 10000 hrs is absurd, I've flown that aircraft a lot. It is a bit to handle but not the space shuttle. The part I have a problem with is changing oil in the company cars.

Did you work this hard to change oil? How about showing some backbone and doing your (flying the airplane) instead of taking the job away from the guy at quicklube.

You should also be careful when commenting on high pilot salaries because most of us are worth every penny and more. Our industry needs to get back to paying reasonable rates for the jobs that we perform. It is people that think the contrarty that ruin the industry and as someone who hires pilots I am on the look out for just that type. And the reason I won't contact this company to find out why they want the time is because I don't care.

What ev

 

[westwind driver]

The problem is that the amount of time required confuses quantity instead of quality. I have flown with 20,000 hr pilots that have scared the daylights out of me and leave me wondering how they have lived that long. The focus should be on quality and while we are on the subject guys that look at themselves as just meat in the seat are just that. You need to contribute to your organization and the minute you hear those kind of comments out of someones mouth you need to correct them. I can crunch numbers at a desk all day and I do, can they fly jets? the answer almost always is no.

As an MBA I am keenly aware of the economy and how it has effected people and if you are one of them I feel sorry for you too. But don't mistake arrogance for obsurdity for a lear 60 10000 hrs is absurd, I've flown that aircraft a lot. It is a bit to handle but not the space shuttle. The part I have a problem with is changing oil in the company cars.

Did you work this hard to change oil? How about showing some backbone and doing your (flying the airplane) instead of taking the job away from the guy at quicklube.

You should also be careful when commenting on high pilot salaries because most of us are worth every penny and more. Our industry needs to get back to paying reasonable rates for the jobs that we perform. It is people that think the contrarty that ruin the industry and as someone who hires pilots I am on the look out for just that type. And the reason I won't contact this company to find out why they want the time is because I don't care.

What ev

Points taken and chewed over a bit. I too have flown with other pilots with high time that just didn't seem to be safe, for whatever reason. Do I believe it takes 10,000 hrs to safely fly a lear 60? Absolutely not. I agree with you that quality matters over quantity, but in a way they have to go hand and hand. It's the quality of experience, over a length of time that matters.

As for changing oil, well you gotta look at this. They wanted a 700 hour pilot minimum. In other words, somebody hungry enough to pay a few more dues. Should the department manager lower his own standard to changing oil himself? For the higher time, more experienced pilots this brings the level kinda low. But that's what he decides to do. Without really knowing how many cars they have, it's kinda hard to know what's really involved. I mean, the company car could mean a corvette you get to drive home. Don't laugh, my dad flew a Hawker 400 (that's hs125-400a for those of you who think a beechjet is a hawker) years ago. The guy that owned it gave him a vet as a company car.

As for highly qualified pilots making top dollar. Why? Is it QOL? The way I see it, if you're qualified in one jet aircraft, chances are with the right training and operational experience, you can fly any other jet. So why is it a captain on a G550 makes an annual average $140,000, but a Falcon 7X Captain averages $126,000. Or a Legacy captain averages $97,000 (figures according to the Pro Pilot 2009 US Salary Survey) Why should the Gulfstream captain make more? Because it's a Gulfstream? So that's what I was getting at with the God complex. Many pilot believe they should be paid simply because of the type of equipment they fly. They want their pay based on image. I see this a lot.

So I agree experienced pilots should be paid appropriately for their experience, but what difference should it make if it's a G550 vs Citation Bravo? And like I said, you know just as well if you had to replace a pilot, you could do so very easily. And that is why, some will dig their heels in and just have to wait for the right position to come along for them. Others are going to take full advantage of the current situation, possibly creating some abuses, not only on themselves, but affect other pilots as well (pay being #1)

I don't know, I really hope for all this thing will begin to turn around soon so guys, and gals, can provide for their families.

Keep it straight and level ya'll.

 

[Fly91]

To all those who wouldn't want to help with oil changes / extra duties etc,

It may not be what you're looking for, after all seems most pilots just want to fly an airplane and get paid an incredible ammount of money for doing it, but to someone a job like that might pay their bills until something better comes along.

You know why CFOs and other management don't like pilots? Because airplanes cost money. Pilots in general do nothing to generate revenue or contribute to the bottom line. And now with the state of the economy, many organizations are trying to pinch pennies, so instead of just flying the aircraft, you might actually have to do something constructive for the company.

Pilots are a dime-a-dozen. There is nothing special about being a pilot. To management pilots are just a piece of meat in the seat, easily replaced.

When was the last time some of you went in armed with records showing where you helped the company save money. Such as where there are two FBOs on a field, one has fuel that is $1 per gallon cheaper, so you go there, and keep a log of how much money you saved by purchasing at one FBO and not the other?

I've heard many a pilot say 'Whats it matter, if they can't afford the gas, they can't afford the airplane.' Same thing with really nice hotels and SUV rental cars.

Bottom line is this, in today's economy and job market, if you're not willing to lower your standard just a little bit, and get off the GOD complex, you simply will have to wait for a job when this turns around.

Everyone knows this joke:
What's the difference between a pilot and God? God doesn't think he's a pilot.

Just food for thought. I'm not trying to rag on anybody here, just trying to open some eyes to the fact that there is no need to complain if you're not willing to even apply for the job. Someone will take the job, and that is the reality. Many have been too high on the hog in recent years and don't know how to adjust. I don't agree with flying for free or flying for currency or paying for training, but someone out there does and is willing to do these things just to get their foot in the door.

Okay anyway, rant over.

BTW, if you have questions about why a company wants 10,000TT, why don't you try to contact them directly and ask? No stupid question except the one never asked (that could be argued too LOL)

Ya'll have a great day!

Can't argue with any of that, its all spot on.


.

 

[Fly91]

As for highly qualified pilots making top dollar. Why? Is it QOL? The way I see it, if you're qualified in one jet aircraft, chances are with the right training and operational experience, you can fly any other jet. So why is it a captain on a G550 makes an annual average $140,000, but a Falcon 7X Captain averages $126,000. Or a Legacy captain averages $97,000 (figures according to the Pro Pilot 2009 US Salary Survey) Why should the Gulfstream captain make more? Because it's a Gulfstream? So that's what I was getting at with the God complex. Many pilot believe they should be paid simply because of the type of equipment they fly. They want their pay based on image. I see this a lot.

I know alot of these jerk-offs. Their half the pilots as the rest of us but they somehow got lucky and landed a Gulfstream job. The owners fly around with these inexperienced pilots because they were "recommended" by someone. I know a few Global Express pilots that I would let drive my car. They call me up every week somewhere in the world asking the most basic of questions on how to properly do flight procedures or how to read an approach chart in Italy somewhere. I understand that alot of Gulfstream and Global get lucky and land jobs they have no business getting....but you would at least think the experienced guys at their companies would get them up to speed after a friggin year on the aircraft. There my friends and I help them out, but it really kind of bugs me too.

Its pretty funny.

 

[CopilotDoug]

Take a look at the Big Picture

Pilots in general do nothing to generate revenue or contribute to the bottom line. And now with the state of the economy, many organizations are trying to pinch pennies, so instead of just flying the aircraft, you might actually have to do something constructive for the company.

Your average pilots may be a dime a dozen, but it's tough to find a good pilot. A good pilot does contribute to the bottom line. They know which airports make the best economic sense (i.e. best combo of fuel, landing, and ramp fees), they compare hotel and rental car costs and some even schedule hotels and rental cars for their bosses. I don't consider this above or beyond for being a pilot in the charter/corporatre world. But to those who wrongly categorize pilots as a dime-a-dozen...you get what you pay for. That is where the value of a good pilot comes in.

So I agree experienced pilots should be paid appropriately for their experience, but what difference should it make if it's a G550 vs Citation Bravo? And like I said, you know just as well if you had to replace a pilot, you could do so very easily. And that is why, some will dig their heels in and just have to wait for the right position to come along for them. Others are going to take full advantage of the current situation, possibly creating some abuses, not only on themselves, but affect other pilots as well (pay being #1)

Image? Not so much. Alot of people like to erroneously compare flying to your regular 9-5 job. Unlike your regular 9-5 job, there are more opportunities for you to lose your livelihood in the blink of an eye. Fail a checkride, ding up an airplane, or lose a medical just to name a few. Then there's the international aspect which brings a whole new host of possibilities where the consequences can be alot more severe. Take a look at the average mission of a company that owns a Citation Bravo and that which flies a Global Express. Chances are, the Bravo won't be flying to Europe or Asia on a regular basis. Maybe someone who flies a G-550 can chime in on the difference between their pay and the pay of a 7X pilot. Maybe benefits are different.

Just wanted to point out that there are methods to the madness.

 

[CopilotDoug]

I know a few Global Express pilots that I would let drive my car.

Can I drive your car, too?