Jumpseat...IRS.....This must be stopped

[Icebergclub]

Here is a little excerpt from our jumpseat chair who just got back from a meeting in D.C. It seems the IRS wants to tax us for the use of the jumpseat. This has to be stopped! I am hoping for some more info to be posted on this. It seems to me that now is the time to start writing our Representatives. If you have any info on this please post it!

"Now the bad news. The IRS is attempting to TAX the use of the jumpseat. There is a clause in tax law that states that “HIGHLY COMPENSATED” (I know, I know) workers who receive additional benefits from their companies must report the fair market value of those benefits to the IRS as income. The IRS is attempting to add the use of Jumpseats to their list of additional benefits. This means if you jumpseat 10 times a year and the average price of the ticket was say $500.00, you would have to report an extra $5000.00 to the IRS as income. The IRS is apparently well along in this idea so if you know any one that you think can help squash this then NOW is the time to write to them."

 

[ceo_of_the_sofa]

is there a way for them to find out? I know you're trying to be legit and all, but what are the chances?

 

[Icebergclub]

CEO,
Yes there is a way, this is another excerpt from our jumpseat chair, we asked the same question!

"They are going to require the airlines to track it. So if you JS on Alaska, Alaska will have to report your use of the JS, and the fair value of a ticket to your destination, to the IRS. Believe it or not some airlines are for it for many reasons, including the tax write off they think they would get for your free ride. XXX has already set up their computer system to allow the reporting of JS use to the IRS. Even though they (XXX) are one of the airlines that do not want to see this happen, the are convinced that it may. Remember, this law is already in effect. All it will take is for the IRS to add "Pilots" to their list of "highly compensated" career fields and then add jumpseat use to the list of items that must be reported as "income." Of course then the airlines will have to limit or prohibit jumpseating AT ALL (even in the back) until they could put procedures in place to track and report the JS use. So we would have another situation such as immediately post 911 when no one knew which airlines would allow jumpseaters and which would not."

 

[FastPilot]

The first thing that comes to mind is that as an airline employee we get travel benefits at greatly reduced rates, (sometimes even free) which is an industry standard, so they should only be able to tax us on that amount, if at all. The other thing that comes to mind is the fact that when you are in the jump seat, you are technically an extra crewmember, and can be pressed into service in case of an emergency (evacuating pax for instance), that is why using the jump seat has always been considered a professional courtesy. What does ALPA National say about this?

 

[mckpickle]

OH for christ sake! this is just F'ed. I say we hold a national sick out. Im sick of ALL this crap. We are the most highly regulated industry in the world. Freaken doctors kill more people every year but they dont get in the papers because they do it one person at a time. I say we hold a national sick out to show the people of this country we are sick of the SHAT!

Remember if it's the pilots day it's everyones day!

 

[Dieterly]

Who controls Washington right now...

 

[dispatchguy]

But question -

How are they going to actually track it. To the IRS, youre nothing but an SSN - so if they know that Joe Shmoe jumped on such-n-such flight, thats fine, but no j/s form I have seen asks for your SSN - and to be honest, I'll be d-a-m-n-e-d if I am going to list it on any J/S form. My license number is now a 7-digit number issued by the FAA - maybe another reason we all should get the FAA to reissue our certs with the new random number.

I've heard rumors to this effect for the past few years, that the internal ripoff service wants to do this w/ all airline employees, and make us consider as income the fair market value of the travel we use, that's not new - but the airlines balked a few years ago as since its a perk for us, from the min-wage ramper to the CEO, what is the true value of the seat? The retail fare, or the actual cost to carry?

But, if this were to come to pass, I would wholly support a national sick-day, or other form of civil disobediance - this has got to stop. But, like I said after 9/11, what the terrorists didnt do in decimating our national aviation system, it appears that the guvmint will just as happily take that ball and run with it...

 

[Flight_Line]

If we really want to have a national sick day we ought to include all the other BS that is going on in our list of demands and get the other affected parties involved. Someone please correct me if I am wrong but can't ATC folks and dispatchers also jump?

 

[fluther]

Don't take this lightly guys, before getting into flying I was in sales. The IRS said that company supplied cars used during personal time were income.....the next year we were paying taxes on any personal use of company cars. If they want this they will get it.

 

[cornbread]

I am with Gunfyter. I plan to deduct as much as possible due to commuting and job-related expenses. If the JS is taxed, I will be much more prudent in my deductions of expenses.

 

[Timebuilder]

Who controls Washington right now?

A better question is "who WAS in control of Washington when the IRS was created?"

 

[CFI'er]

Just another case of the IRS going out of it way to find more income for the Gov’mnt. If they do enforce this rule, what is next? Will we pay tax on the in-flight meals? Will we pay tax on our airport parking? How about the per diem as a taxable income?

If this goes to fruition, then all the Corp. presidents, VP’s, CFO’s etc…must be required to pay taxes on the difference between a commercial ticket and the Corp. aircraft expense. Maybe the IRS can look at making the Corp. PAX pay taxes on the actual value of the aircraft. This is just another example of our Gov’mnt going out of control. Maybe the IRS can make Congressmen and Senators pay income tax on the campaign donations.

 

[RockyMnt1]

Commuting expenses

The commuting expenses relating to getting to your job are not deductable. However, if you happen to have an legal, income producing asset in that same area, then the trip would be to inspect/maintain that asset, which would be deductable.

I'll let your imaginations run free on this one.

 

[FlyToVegas]

irs

While I am sure the IRS will find a way, how will they say the "fair" value of what is essentially a space-available, you-may-never-get-there, you cannot-check-luggage, you may not even get a "seat" passage the same as a confirmed seat with the luggage insurance and denied boarding rights? Apples and oranges.

 

[ifly4food]

C'mon, guys!

This has all the marks of one of those rumors that is passed so many times it takes on its own life. So far we've heard "I heard from so and so who heard from so and so...". Let's wait until we hear something official from the IRS, the airlines, or the unions before we panic and plan "civil disobedience".

Having said that, I find this extremely unlikely. Think of the thousands of pilots who jumpseat monthly. It would be an incredible burden to the airlines to track, store, and report all of these people. Some airlines, like Delta, don't even put you in the computer if you work for them... you just fill out a form and off you go.

Also, there is no way to ascertain the "fair market value" of a jumpseat. Would it be full coach fare? First class since that's where you sometimes sit? Who decides this and how is it put into a database? See where I'm going?
I could see them trying to tax travel privilleges such as non revving since that's tracked and easily assigned a value, but the jumpseat is just too hard to track.

I'm waiting to panic until I hear something official.

 

[SDF2BUF2MCO]

For what it is worth, the government wanted to tax frequent flyer miles a while back and it didn't happen. However, with increased "security" speculate some day we'll all need our SSN to travel then they'll have us by the private spot as far as being able to track and tax.
Another example of the government's insaitable appetite for more money (and power). If paying taxes is so great then why to all the law makers/politicians go to great lengths to avoid paying them? Oh well, "it's for the children".

 

[Timebuilder]

Thanks, gunfyter.

I heard that brilliant explanation of taxes on the radio as I was driving to the airport a couple of weeks ago.

Truly, we are being "serviced" by the IRS.

 

[crxpilot]

I agree!

mckpickle, I like you're style! ;-)

OH for christ sake! this is just F'ed. I say we hold a national sick out. Im sick of ALL this crap. We are the most highly regulated industry in the world. Freaken doctors kill more people every year but they dont get in the papers because they do it one person at a time. I say we hold a national sick out to show the people of this country we are sick of the SHAT!

Remember if it's the pilots day it's everyones day!

 

[checkessential]

The use of the jumpseat/non-revenue is for non-business travel only!! Nice try though.

 

[ifly4food]

The use of the jumpseat/non-revenue is for non-business travel only!! Nice try though.

I don't follow you...

Are you saying using jumpseat/non-revenue privilleges to get to/from work would be an illegal use of these privilleges?

 

[prpjt]

(If this goes to fruition, then all the Corp. presidents, VP’s, CFO’s etc…must be required to pay taxes on the difference between a commercial ticket and the Corp. aircraft expense. Maybe the IRS can look at making the Corp. PAX pay taxes on the actual value of the aircraft.)

This is already the case for non-business travel in the corporate world. If our CFO wants to use the aircraft to go to his condo in Vail, he will recieve a 1099 for the cost of the trip, and must report that use as income. (simplistic example)

 

[propilot150]

Not to much on jumpseating myself. King airs dont gots dem LOL! I did hear rumor , Louisiana Aircraft is trying to work out a deal with American eagle and USAir express for letting their pilots commute back and fourth jumpseating from place to place, out of BTR and taking the king airs and Hawker back and fourth to save cost of keeping the crews up there. But this is just talk.
cap'n Landry

 

[FastPilot]

hey Landry, where you from? I take it you fly out of Baton Rouge. Anyone around there hiring right now? I wouldn't mind getting closer to home. So, is La Aircraft willing to let us Eagle guys ride for free in exchange?

Steve

 

[browntail]

Or you could all just jumpseat on a cargo flight, no fair market value on that stuff!!!

Fly Chicaga, now that is the funniest thing I have ever heard from you. "So if you commute start pimpin some hoes."

 

[pilotmom]

What everyone keeps forgetting is that the IRS does not write the rules. Congress does. That is who folks should be concerned with. The IRS only administers the rules written by them and has no say in what is taxed or is not taxed.

 

[Timebuilder]

Actually, congress merely rubber stamps what has been written by the IRS. Sometimes the idea for a new rule comes from congress or the executive mansion, but the IRS, like many federal agencies, has been granted "regulatory authority" which takes most of the burden off of congress' back. If this had not been done, we would see nothing but endless voting on C-SPAN involving particulate standards for water treatment plants.

Since congress has oversight (they didn't give away the store, mind you) a campaign to your reprersentatives IS in order if this is more than an internet legend. Enough pressure from us can generate a memo from the head of the appropriate comittee (ways and means?) that we really don't need to begin a new burdensome system of taxing the jumpseat.

Who has called their MEC to find out if this is true?

 

[charterpuke]

This story is just URBAN LEGEND!!!

 

[propilot150]

FastPilot

Yeah im from New Roads, near False River. 20 miles southwest of BTR. dunno what is in store for LA Aircraft at the moment this is all just talk i been hearing the last few days. I was just curious if anyone else around heard bout that. Anyways i noticed you said * Getting a job closer to home would be nice * are you from Louisiana by any chance ? Take Care
Cap'n Landry

 

[Since 1926]

This whole "IRS taxing the jumpseat" is ***CENSORED***.

When you are in the flight deck jumpseat (up front), you are serving as an additional crew member (ACM). It is impossible to tax a pilot for being an ADDITIONAL CREW MEMBER. Again, the IRS cannot tax a flight crewmember when they are serving as a crew member. That stops the buck right there. End of story.

 

[abxaviator]

1926 - Just to play devil's advocate, you write "the IRS cannot tax a flight crewmember when they are serving as a crewmember", then how do you explain all that money withheld from my pay, which I receive as a crewmember serving as a crewmember. If it is deemed "additional compensation", that certainly seems like something they would justify as taxable.