Jumpseat Gripes

[beech1900kid]

A history lesson for anyone who doesn't quite get it - once upon a time airline management fought long and hard to hedge this "privilege" against the pilot group. They used it in contract negotiations; "You give up XYZ and we'll allow reciprocal jumpseats." If you want a more modern example, look at the bull$hit TSA is going through with their jumpseat policy...

Second, this is a big f*ck you to whomever decides to ride the jumpseat on company business. Simply put, you are making the union effort to earn the right to jumpseat worthless. Don't kid yourself, they were looking out for number one when they allowed reciprocal jumpseats; we gave up something, pay, benefits, whatever. My only way home out of LGA last night and a CHQ guy *WITH A POSITIVE SPACE TICKET* bumped me out of the jumpseat. I even asked him to reconsider...this led to a "well this is good for the company" conversation. Try telling that to an ALPA guy who fought on the negotiating board for jumpseating privileges back in the 1970's....

 

[anon]

Just curious.

Did the CHQ guy with the PS pass ride the jumpseat in an effort to allow a paying passenger in the back? If so, he did the right thing.Would it have been better to send a paying passenger home or an off-line jumpseater?

 

[Slice121]

Sorry to hear about your JS. That's a major foul!!! Some guys just don't get it.

 

[rtmcfi]

I have no problem riding the jumpseat on company business. If I can help get one more person aboard, I will do it. That one person could be a non-rev utilizing a buddy pass. However, things change dramatically when a pilot is trying to get home or to work. At that point, I use my positive space ticket, and they get the cockpit. What the CHQ pilot in LGA did was flat out wrong. I hope he reads this, and sees how he screwed a fellow pilot.....

 

[beech1900kid]

Exactly my point...some guys just don't get it. Talk about helping the company, what if I was trying to get to work and they end up cancelling a round trip? You may be helping one passenger, but you need to see the bigger picture...

 

[GEORGE DUBYA]

Your airplane doesn't have a jumpseat so stop bitching

 

[StarChecker]

Just curious.

Did the CHQ guy with the PS pass ride the jumpseat in an effort to allow a paying passenger in the back? If so, he did the right thing.Would it have been better to send a paying passenger home or an off-line jumpseater?

That's crap. He did the wrong thing and I'm sorry that happened to you.

I never allow deadheading crewmembers to sit in the jumpseat. Perhaps if our company constructed better pairings, we wouldn't have to bump passengers. We got a note from Delta awhile back telling us to stop bumping their passengers. Perhaps Airways will care someday too.

 

[beech1900kid]

Just curious.

Did the CHQ guy with the PS pass ride the jumpseat in an effort to allow a paying passenger in the back? If so, he did the right thing.Would it have been better to send a paying passenger home or an off-line jumpseater?

Yes it was to get a passenger in the back. No, he didn't do the right thing. As I stated, it was something management used as a negotiating tactic. You piss it away when you use it to their advantage. It's a huge ALPA no-no. I understand CHQ is not ALPA, but don't ever get caught doing that on an ALPA affiliate carrier....you will get your a$$ chewed out big time...

 

[Dave Benjamin]

What the CHQ pilot in LGA did was flat out wrong. I hope he reads this, and sees how he screwed a fellow pilot.....

Some airlines require their pilots to ride a cockpit jumpseat when they are travelling positive space and the cabin is overbooked. If CHQ has a policy like that the pilot could have got in trouble for refusing to ride in the actual. I know of some legacy carriers that do the same thing. Without knowing CHQ policy it's hard to condemn the guy. Also did the guy even know someone was else was trying to get the jumpseat? When I commuted I used to stay in uniform for that very reason. Sometimes I'd get a pilot from whoever I was trying to commute on asking me if I was trying to jumpseat.

 

[beech1900kid]

Your airplane doesn't have a jumpseat so stop bitching

The 1900 doesn't have a jumpseat?!?!?!?!?

Listen, jacka$$, you were probably offended because you've done this to a guy in the past. Read my profile, I've flown the B1900, the CRJ, the 737, the 717, etc. Let's stick to the issue at hand please...

 

[anon]

Yes it was to get a passenger in the back. No, he didn't do the right thing. As I stated, it was something management used as a negotiating tactic. You piss it away when you use it to their advantage. It's a huge ALPA no-no. I understand CHQ is not ALPA, but don't ever get caught doing that on an ALPA affiliate carrier....you will get your a$$ chewed out big time...[/quote]

Oh really? By you? By ALPA? I doubt it.

BTW. I am a commuter. If I get bumped by a PAYING PASSENGER, that's life! On my airplane, I'll min fuel, defuel, and do whatever it takes to get everyone on board. But, I'm not going to bump a paying passenger for an off-line jumpseater.

Also, some companies REQUIRE that a deadheading crewmember ride in the JS if bumping a paying passenger would result. Does CHQ? I have no idea. But you should find out before you start slamming another pilots actions.

I'm sorry you got bumped, but that kind of stuff happens. If you ever need my JS, rest assured, I'll do everything I can to get you on.

And one last thing, the paying passenger probably appreciated getting home also.

 

[beech1900kid]

Oh really? By you? By ALPA? I doubt it.

BTW. I am a commuter. If I get bumped by a PAYING PASSENGER, that's life! On my airplane, I'll min fuel, defuel, and do whatever it takes to get everyone on board. But, I'm not going to bump a paying passenger for an off-line jumpseater.

I hope by me...anyone ever tries to ride my jumpseat on company business, I tell them exactly why you don't do that. I was offline, yes...but don't pull this crap with me, we're both working CONTRACT for USAirways. Put the shoe on the other foot for a minute...I'm trying to get to work and you get one paying person on instead of a jumpseater...now there is potential for 2 or more flights to be cancelled for one person. You need to look at the forest, not the trees. What goes around shall come around... I promise not to put any metaphors in my next post...

 

[b82rez]

At least your user name fits you.......GROW UP. You're the one commuting. Complaining about a pilot that rides the Jumpseat to get a paying pax on is retarted. If you're so concerned about making it to work on time you should either...

A) Leave more options when commuting
B) Live in Domicile
C) Convince the company to hire more pilots for reserve
D) Use your obviously great knowledge of ALPA and union practices to get a commuting clause in your contract.

 

[8HourPilot]

CHQ does not have this policy, and neither does Republic Holdings in general. I am sorry that we were misrepresented by this dude, he did something wrong forsure. It's interesting that the Capt let him/her do it.
It's a poor representation of our pilot group.

Some airlines require their pilots to ride a cockpit jumpseat when they are travelling positive space and the cabin is overbooked. If CHQ has a policy like that the pilot could have got in trouble for refusing to ride in the actual. I know of some legacy carriers that do the same thing. Without knowing CHQ policy it's hard to condemn the guy. Also did the guy even know someone was else was trying to get the jumpseat? When I commuted I used to stay in uniform for that very reason. Sometimes I'd get a pilot from whoever I was trying to commute on asking me if I was trying to jumpseat.

 

[j41driver]

From ALPA's own Jumpseat Policy, Section F, paragraph 2:

"An abuse of the jumpseat privilege includes, but is not limited to, individuals revenue positioning at company request for reasons other than commuting to or from work or on personal business."


If you are deadheading (revenue positioning at company request) you should take a seat in the back. If they have to bump a paying passenger to do it, well that sucks but so be it.

 

[Mike man]

Yeah dude sorry about that 1 pilot out of 1441 pilots took the Jumpseat to let a paying passenger get on the airplane. I, like Star Checker, will not allow anyone on company business sit in the Jumpseat--if there is a Jumpseater. But again I want to say I'm sorry and don't let .06939625260235950% of a pilot group make you have a bad impression of the rest of the group.

Just out of curiosity, how many times has Chautauqua taken you home or to work?

 

[Dave Benjamin]

From ALPA's own Jumpseat Policy, Section F, paragraph 2:

"An abuse of the jumpseat privilege includes, but is not limited to, individuals revenue positioning at company request for reasons other than commuting to or from work or on personal business."


If you are deadheading (revenue positioning at company request) you should take a seat in the back. If they have to bump a paying passenger to do it, well that sucks but so be it.

There's a huge difference between sitting in the jumpseat on your own company to aircraft to accomodate a paying passenger and jumpseating on another carrier to save your company from having to buy a ticket. You never jumpseat on another carrier in a situation where your company should be providing positive space. Positive space has to be provided for deadheading and any company related travel away from domicile.

 

[mdanno808]

According to ALPA, thou shalt not ride the jumpseat on company business period.

 

[ReverseSensing]

Not saying I approve, but at QX, this is the policy:

Deadheading

CEME: E25

• Deadheading pilots shall follow normal check-in procedures
described in section 7.1, Reporting for Duty – First Day of a Trip.

• Training Scheduling books pilots positive space for flight or training
assignments.

• The First Officer of a deadheading crew is listed in the jumpseat.

​

​

​

Not really sure how an FO is supposed to say no and avoid a carpet dance. Furthermore, I would imagine a CA who said no to a deadheading FO in the jumpseat would probably dance, too.

I'd like to see the policy change for the benefit of commuters.​

 

[Caveman]

"If you are deadheading (revenue positioning at company request) you should take a seat in the back. If they have to bump a paying passenger to do it, well that sucks but so be it."

"According to ALPA, thou shalt not ride the jumpseat on company business period.'

Say a non-CASS OAL jumpseater shows up. Should a DH crewmember ride the jumpseat to get the OAL guy a seat in the back?

 

[Smarta$$]

Some of you are missing the point. The jumpseat is NOT for company buisiness. Even if it would bump revenue passengers. If the company needs to get a pilot somewhere they need to positive space them in the cabin.

One of the very important reasons for this is to force the company to build better pairings.

Also to leave the jumpseat open for the crewmembers that need it to get to work or home.

Dont screw your fellow pilots and reward the company for poor planning.

 

[SiouxHockeyFan]

OFF-LINE or ON-LINE jumpseater who gives a F*(&!!! We are all pilots and we shouldn't worry about who works for who and who has what union. Just help each other out, we shouldn't be fighting amongst ourselves that is only what Management wants!! BTW I would have sat in the back for sure for two reasons 1. ALPA 2. It is the right thing to do!! Beech1900kid welcome aboard any Air Willy js without our guys taking it from you!

 

[Fred Rogers]

Say a non-CASS OAL jumpseater shows up. Should a DH crewmember ride the jumpseat to get the OAL guy a seat in the back?

That is a good question.. also I agree.. we shouldn't be fighting amongst ourselves.

 

[Dirty Sanchez]

Listing the FO for the jumpseat on a DH? WTF is that? You probably don't get paid for the deadhead either.

The captain should have made the DH ride in the back. It's the company's fault the pax gets bumped, not the jumpseater.

 

[ReverseSensing]

You probably don't get paid for the deadhead either.

If you're referring to QX, we get credited for DH's same as flown segments.

 

[mckpickle]

I cannot believe this situation has come up yet again. For crying out loud people! It's the captains JS and the captain of these flights should be standing up and telling Joey Pilot Deadhead to take his seat in the back and STFU!

Please report this to your jumpseat coorditator. There is a forum that we all use to communicate. We have access to every unionized pilot group to talk directly with that airlines jumpseat com. But it has to be reported. Sorry about your commute.

 

[OPECJet]

1. Airline needs to build pairings that don't require deadheading all over the system. There is actually a trip at my company that has you DH back to base after a 4 day from the hub, then DH back to the same hub the next day for a 3 leg out and back. Total BS!!!!!

2. Airlines shouldn't oversell the airplane by the margins that they do. 55 seats sold on a 50 seater and all 55 show up. Go figure..... Been happening a lot lately.

No way I'm going to sit bolt upright for an hour with DC headclamps on in the jumpseat of a 145 because the airline can't hit its a$$ with both hands.

 

[Bluestreak]

Ummm,1900kid,do you work for a company that charges for "jumpseats" , say, Airtran ? Thank your union for that one.Now,I'm sure you're a Big-Boss-Man conservative,like 90% of us,correct ? A "take responsibility for your actions" dude,eh ? So I'm sure you would've went to the bumped pax and explained "Gee,I'm so sorry you won't make your (son's funeral,kid's graduation,job interview,etc.) but it's more important for me to get home than you,even though you bought a ticket,even though I don't even work for this airline, because my union says and I agree this is the right thing to do".You don't have a hair on your a$$ if you don't.Good for the company,was it ? Maybe.Good for the person who pays the bills ? Ab-so-lutely.

 

[wmuflyguy]

I have ridden in front on a DH to get a non-rev on before. It was one of our FA's commuting home and full flight. They don't have the luxury of a jumpseat on the RJ.

Captain and FO of the flight had no problem. I was helping out a co-workeer and friend. I'd do it again.

 

[Smarta$$]

Ummm,1900kid,do you work for a company that charges for "jumpseats" , say, Airtran ? Thank your union for that one.Now,I'm sure you're a Big-Boss-Man conservative,like 90% of us,correct ? A "take responsibility for your actions" dude,eh ? So I'm sure you would've went to the bumped pax and explained "Gee,I'm so sorry you won't make your (son's funeral,kid's graduation,job interview,etc.) but it's more important for me to get home than you,even though you bought a ticket,even though I don't even work for this airline, because my union says and I agree this is the right thing to do".You don't have a hair on your a$$ if you don't.Good for the company,was it ? Maybe.Good for the person who pays the bills ? Ab-so-lutely.

The company should not put us in this position. They need to plan better.

If in using the jumpseat you are not denying someone else that needed it to get to work or home then I dont have a problem with it. But if so, then it is the company's problem for their poor planning.