jetBlue's RJ's

[jetblue320]

Thought I would start a new thread since the "RJ" thing really has nothing to do with the other thread it was buried in.

Here goes; you know what, it's a question of opinion whether or not you want to classify the new (and unmade) EMB190 an RJ. You want to call it an RJ, go ahead, I won't give a s=*# anymore, nor will I defend it's classification. Somebody responded that Professional Pilot called an F100 an RJ, so I guess an EMB190 is one too. Who cares anyway. I saw on a billboard the other day that Tony Roma's has the best ribs in town. If it's on a billboard (or in a magazine) it MUST be true.

What I will call the EMB190 is a soon-to-be kick a$$ money making machine for JBU that will further enhance our product selection and boost us into even more profitable routes and make all the others jealous that they didn't get to it first.

Whew.

Donning firehat now.

Have Fun.

 

[jetblue320]

Very interesting and incredibly insightful that there is this overall desire to make sure everyone thinks the Embraer 170 and 190 aren't "RJ's". Who cares? Why do you all care so much? Are "RJ's" beneath you somehow? This is not a classification issue. This is a inferiority issue.

Some of you people just amaze me. Thank goodness overall there is just a select few of you people like this in this profession. Some of you people have serious maturity and inferiority "issues".

Its an airplane... get over it. Be more concerned about operating it safely. Oh I forget, this is an inferiority issue.

Nevermind..

No inferiority here pal, you are the one with issues. As far as safety goes, the EMB190 will be operated the same as the A320. And no, they are not beneath us. And thank goodness you don't want to join us "inferior and immature ones" at JBU. You are an obvious misfit.

 

[Heavy Set]

I think the EMB-190 will be a great aircraft for serving thinner/longer market for route development. I have seen pictures of the flight deck and the cabin - both look great.

My question is for the Jetblue guys: does it upset you that you most likely won't be able to fly it? If given the opportunity (say you are an FO now), would you want to fly it or are you "happy as a clam" in the A320? The primus epic flightdeck looks pretty nice...

 

[skirt]

JetBlue 320,

I'm curious if there is any public speculation (worth talking about) as to the mission for the Emb-190. At 2200 nm it is not quite a transcon machine, so will it cover the N-S on the west coast (based from OAK, PHX or LAS), N-S on the east coast (based from IAD, BOS or MCO)or do you expect a midwest base of operations (ie. MSP, DEN, MCI)? I've seen some compelling DOT numbers on each one of these markets (RASM's well into the 30 cents per mile and above) and see many great possibilities for this airplane. It looks like a market that all the big players have ignored for now.

I fly around in a 737 on the west coast that has a load factor that averages out to 100 people. Could we expect some competition in this arena?

Skirt

 

[jetblue320]

I think the EMB-190 will be a great aircraft for serving thinner/longer market for route development. I have seen pictures of the flight deck and the cabin - both look great.

My question is for the Jetblue guys: does it upset you that you most likely won't be able to fly it? If given the opportunity (say you are an FO now), would you want to fly it or are you "happy as a clam" in the A320? The primus epic flightdeck looks pretty nice...

No, not upsetting at all because if a A320 pilot elects to transfer to the EMB190, he/she is free to. The transfer details are not official yet but it is already been said by our highers (Senior VP of Opns) that if you want to transfer, for whatever reason (quality of life, basing, equipment choice, whatever) you will be able to. Of course, the pay will not be the same and I am sure there will be a term committment as well. You can be "happy as a clam" in which ever aircraft you prefer.

Hope that answers your ?.

See ya

 

[100LL... Again!]

Regional Jet. We're so over that. I'll now settle for nothing less than a IJ (Intergalactic Jet). Raise your expectations, people!

 

[~~~^~~~]

Who cares. At Jet Blue it is another nice, new aircraft.

Regional Jet, like Regional Airline, is a myth perpetuated by ALPA politics to justify their apartied system of pilots who's interests are to be promoted, or pilots who's jobs are to be limited.

Jet Blue is not ALPA, it does not matter for them. How nice!

 

[Skank]

~~~^~~~,
Well spoken. That is the crux of this whole stupid debate. Rj as a name, is an invention. An invention that ALPA and the ATA fully exploited. It has no real meaning. The mission of the EMB-190 will be similar to that of the A-320. It will be RVSM capable, and with it's range and wide cabin, a perfect compliment to our fleet.

For those who care, call it whatever you want.

 

[tech]

Two things that make no sense.

1) Why do people call an aircraft that can operate IAD LAX or BOS LAS or ATL SEA a regional aircraft?

2) Why do people call an airline that operates coast to coast and to other countries a regional airline?


There doesn't seem to be anything regional about it. Shouldn't a jet be called a jet? There used to be such a thing as a national airline. Isn't that what Air Tran and Jet Blue are if not yet a major. I find it silly to think of them as regionals.

 

[jethro38]

I wouldn't care if they said "your hired and you'll be flying the company cessna 172" I'm part of the team.

Doesn't matter if there is 1 person or 300 in the back, your job is to get them safely from point a to b and make it the best experience they have had in an aircraft.

R,
Jethro

Still waiting for the JB call.

 

[firstthird]

Although since airline pilot pay has been traditionally tied to the gross weight/speed of your plane (left over from the 20's and a gov't mail contract that was encouraging the postal contractors to fly bigger/faster planes, or something like that). I'd hate to see what the pay scale would be on a C-172, $1 an hour maybe, and only for time spent flying, ouch.

Some companies don't pay this way (SWA since they go by trip and just have 1 a/c type) but most seem to have some vestige left which makes sense in most cases since the more people get there faster the more money that pilot is making for the company. Obviously one of the arguments why a B1900 (or RJ) pilot shouldn't/isn't paid the same as a 757/747 pilot.

Even JB is gonna have different pay scales for the A320 and the EMB190 (notice I didn't call it an RJ, don't want to get people all upset) although to hear it told sometimes on this board "both guys are doing the same job, why not pay them the same." A variation of the "how much money is enough for a pilot to be paid" theme. Don't want to hijack the thread, but I couldn't resist replying to the C172 comment.

 

[jethro38]

Totally agree,
It really doesn't matter to me what I fly. I have flown the big iron and the small ones......it's all good and the best part is the people.

R,
Jethro

 

[LearAv8r]

While commuting I have fielded numerous questions about whom is going to fly our 50 seaters;

I thought the RJ's you guys were getting were going to be configured to 100 seats?


L-

 

[Helmsmen]

I am very surprised that JB is considering a different pay scale for the EMB jet. Seat pay is the wave of the future in this industry. When you start paying more or less for a new aircraft type some pilots will always strive to fly the higher paying metal. This drives up training costs. Never a good thing. Keep it simple sailor is something that all airlines should be striving for in this economy. Why embrace a two tier pay scale to save money only to lose the savings over time to training costs?

Helmsmen

 

[Redtails]

For those who want to look at one taxiing by on A or B taxiway, there will be an EMB-170 on display at T-6, JFK on 2-3 Sep. It's the shorter version of the 190. It's suppose to fly to ROC and back one of those days too. I think it'll complement the fleet on those markets that can support 100 seats but not 156...

 

[LearLove]

~~~^~~~,
Well spoken. That is the crux of this whole stupid debate. Rj as a name, is an invention. An invention that ALPA and the ATA fully exploited. It has no real meaning. The mission of the EMB-190 will be similar to that of the A-320. It will be RVSM capable, and with it's range and wide cabin, a perfect compliment to our fleet.

For those who care, call it whatever you want.

Key Word/Words Here Boys And Girls: "stupid debate"

END OF TOPIC

 

[firstthird]

originally posted by LearAv8r

I thought the RJ's you guys were getting were going to be configured to 100 seats?

I think that Mo' Better Blue was being ironic (or ironical if you prefer) with his comment about 50 seaters. Implying that many of the people asking about JB's coming 'RJ's' (known as EMB-190s to those of us that don't want to incur the wrath of the Blue Enforcers, a new super hero consortium coming to a metropolis near you) don't know what they are talking about.

random question, did SWA come out with Canyon Blue paint scheme before JB came along? I'm just wondering who can call bragging rights over the blue.

Also, does JB owe royalties to Blue Man Group for this whole blue thing? I think there could be something there for an enterprising litigator. j/k (since irony doesn't play well on the BBS sometimes)

 

[Redtails]

originally posted by LearAv8r


I think that Mo' Better Blue was being ironic (or ironical if you prefer) with his comment about 50 seaters. Implying that many of the people asking about JB's coming 'RJ's' (known as EMB-190s to those of us that don't want to incur the wrath of the Blue Enforcers, a new super hero consortium coming to a metropolis near you) don't know what they are talking about.

random question, did SWA come out with Canyon Blue paint scheme before JB came along? I'm just wondering who can call bragging rights over the blue.

Also, does JB owe royalties to Blue Man Group for this whole blue thing? I think there could be something there for an enterprising litigator. j/k (since irony doesn't play well on the BBS sometimes)

I think you'll find that 95% of our pilots, especially those who've been here since the get-go are a pretty humble bunch. As for the other 5%, well, you know pilots, heheh... As for the color blue, it's just pleasing to the eye...

 

[Mr Hat]

As an E145 CA I think Im qualified to speak on the subject. Those who do fly "RJ's" Embraer or otherwise know that there is nothing regional about them except the pay.
Here's how it went down at my airline. The company decided to get these airplanes and knew the mainline group would get really pissed about it. So they went to them and said "Dont worry about it, it's just an ATR without props. Express will continue to feed the mainline but with quieter airplanes" Then they came to us and said, "Yes, they are kinda like jets but they are just turbo-props without props" and negotiated the pay as a larger turbo prop as opposed to a smaller "mainline" jet. A short 8 years later they have all but replaced Cleveland as a Continental hub and we are flying routes such as Newark to Omaha and Houston to Toronto.

So, why is everyone so upset by the term RJ? Well, mainline pilots hate them because their managements have chosen to take mainline flying and send it to the lower paid "regionals". Embraer and Canadair pilots hate being called an RJ pilot because it somehow degrades them as lesser pilots, its bad enough we are paid so much less than other jet pilots. Its a big sham and the entire industry of pilots fell for it.....I do get annoyed because ALPA, MY union, has a policy of equal pay for equal work, unless your an "RJ" pilot. I understand that my airplane doesnt carry as many people and as a result it should pay less than a 737 but the E145 is no where near the same scale. If you took the E145 pay and extrapolated the pay upward to an aircraft that had as many seats as a 737, most of the 737 pilots would end up loosing half their pay.

Jetblue on the other hand is actually doing it right, it will be flown by mainline pilots for mainline wages. I assume they will base the pay on reduced A320 pay. I'm sure they will do right by their employees and pay them fairly. Good for you guys, I wish nothing but the best for Jetblue, they are definatly an industry leader and an example to be followed. No whipsawing and no BS.

 

[George Jetson]

The EMB-190 will not have a true 2300nm range. Those are zero wind, just enough gas for 45 minutes reserve, manufacturer's numbers. Our EMB-145XR (longest range 145) supposedly has an 1800nm range. We fly it EWR-OKC and that is extremely tight in the winter westbound when the weather is bad. If I were you, I'd wack about 500nm from the Embraer numbers if I were you guys. That should take into account winds, hold fuel, alternates, flying airways, etc.

GJ

 

[Humty72]

Reuters
U.S. fines 3 airlines for treatment of disabled
Thursday August 28, 5:21 pm ET


WASHINGTON, Aug 28 (Reuters) - The government fined three big airlines on Thursday a total of $750,000 for not providing adequate services for disabled passengers.
The Transportation Department found that JetBlue Airways (NasdaqNM:JBLU - News), Southwest Airlines (NYSE:LUV - News) and America West Airlines (NYSE:AWA - News) violated federal law and other regulations by not providing enough space for passengers to stow their wheelchairs in the cabin.

ADVERTISEMENT


As part of a settlement, the carriers were ordered to immediately resolve the problem and were fined varying amounts. JetBlue was fined $100,000, America West, $150,000 and Southwest, $500,000. Larger penalties generally reflect more violations.

The airlines were given credit for most of the fine amounts to make room for wheel chairs or take other steps to improve services for disabled passengers.

In Southwest's case, the airline will have to retrofit a number of older Boeing 737 aircraft to comply with the settlement.

Among other steps, JetBlue must install equipment at its ticket counters to help individuals who are deaf and hard of hearing.

Regulations require planes with 100 or more seats ordered after 1990 to have priority space in the cabin for storing at least one wheelchair that can be folded.

 

[JimNtexas]

Question from the peanut gallery.

I don't fly airlines a whole lot, but I just now got home from flying Las Vegas - Salt Lake - Austin.

The Salt Lake to Austin leg was Skywest 3885, which was an RJ-50.

It was living hell. When we boarded the plane, it was an inferno. All the window shades were draw, giving it a dark cave like feeling. The plane was hot for the whole trip.

I was happy that I'm not real tall, but I better not gain any weight if I plan on doing much more RJ riding. That seat was skinny, but at least the roof is very low. The faux air vents were tiny, like something from Barbie's Fun Jet.

Two hours in that thing was about my limit, no way would I get on one for any longer.

I found myself really missing the nice wide seats and excellent ventilation in my Archer

Is the airplane Jet Blue is buying as narrow and cramped? Does it have middle seats?

 

[Sppedmode]

Not the JetBlue "RJ"

Jim,
If you flew on a 50 seat jet on Skywest, you flew on a CRJ. That is what I fly and can attest that any flight over 2 hours is ridiculeous. I used to fly Minneapolis to Jacksonville quite a bit last year and it was miserable for the pax. I personally think that our CRJ's shouldn't be used on any flight blocked for over two hours, however, we probably have at least 30 out-n-backs that are well over 2 hrs and about 10 that are over 3 hrs!!!
The aircraft that JetBlue is getting is the EMB-190...the 170 is pictured and here is the cabin of the EMB190...it looks like it has a lot more room that a CRJ or ERJ.

 

[airbaker]

The seats on the EMB-190 are supposedly a 1/4" wider than what's provided for on the Airbus (which themselves are wider than a 737 or 757)

Looks like it'll be a pretty fantastic airplane...range, speed, efficiency, automation, comfort, etc..

Question for the JetBlue folks: I understand the Emb-190 has a highly automated flightdeck including fadec and autothrottles; will it be certified for CatIII operations?

 

[jetblue320]

Question for the JetBlue folks: I understand the Emb-190 has a highly automated flightdeck including fadec and autothrottles; will it be certified for CatIII operations?

Yes, yes, yes, and Yes.

As well as RVSM and LiveTV in every seat. In just about every respect it will be a A320 clone ecept with 56 less seats. Our A320 have 162 seats now but we are reducing them to 156 starting this week I think.

See ya

 

[Airpiraterob]

RVSM and live TV in every seat? ....i guess with the FA in the cabin...RVSM in the seat would be a good thing?

yep interior looks nice...that is untill someone figures out a way to make it a 3x2 "high-density" interior. all that space and comfort, BAH! you could fit more people in there....you know someone somewhere is gonna order an option like that.

 

[jetblue320]

Correction

RVSM and live TV in every seat? ....i guess with the FA in the cabin...RVSM in the seat would be a good thing?

Ok, so I forgot the comma. I meant - RVSM capable "and" LiveTV at every seat.

Is that more better?

 

[jetblue320]

"Canyon Blue" paint scheme

originally posted by LearAv8r
random question, did SWA come out with Canyon Blue paint scheme before JB came along? I'm just wondering who can call bragging rights over the blue.

Also, does JB owe royalties to Blue Man Group for this whole blue thing? I think there could be something there for an enterprising litigator. j/k (since irony doesn't play well on the BBS sometimes)

First question: As far as I know, the Canyon Blue paint scheme that SW uses on it planes came out after jetBlue was born. It is rumored that the scheme came about because of a bet/challenge Herb made to David. Supposedly, Herb told David that if JB made a profit within 6 months (? or some such time frame) that he would paint his planes blue! Well, we did post a profit and SW started sporting some "blue planes". Believe it or not but that's the scuttlebutt. There was also some rumor about that same time that Herb went out and bought like 10 JB model planes and placed them on his cronies' desks with a note saying something like, Know your enemy, or watch out for these guys, etc. True?, who knows, ask Herb. I don't know the man but I have read a lot about him and have heard a lot of stories from folks that used to work with him (Neeleman and Anne Rhodes) and it sounds logical.

Second questions: The name "jetBlue" has an interesting story. It was actually a last minute decision after we had exhausted a number of choices. Some of the losers were - It (thank goodness this one was out!), Taxi, and a host of others. At the 11th hour, one of our marketing executives (I think it was Amy Curtis) came up with "Blue". It had promise but you cannot patent or register common generic terms like blue, car, rock, as trade names. So somebody, maybe David, was mumbling (he does that a lot) and out came "jetBlue", with the small j and capital B.

The detailed story can be found out there on the WWW somewhere if you search for it.

See ya.

 

[amfteamster]

All you jetBlue folks better talk with your union reps. I hear that your pay is going to be adjusted to match the rest of the regional airlines as soon as you start flying the Rj's.

 

[Eagleflip]

All you jetBlue folks better talk with your union reps. I hear that your pay is going to be adjusted to match the rest of the regional airlines as soon as you start flying the Rj's.

OK, I'll go talk to my union rep. Promise. I think its the International House of Pancakes and Flapjack Guild.