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Jet Blue 11th biggest Airline

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Well-known member
Nov 26, 2001
Jet Blue had the 11th highest RSM of all airlines. 1/19 the size of American for the first seven months of 02. Also had the highest load factor of all airlines reporting. Not bad for an upstart.
Wait till those airbusses start to need heavy maintenance, then costs will rise and so will their fares. Its a good time to be a discount upstart, but the economy will improve soon, and their competition SWA will not stand still.

Eitherway, it is good for a new company.
SWA had better watch their backside. I have flown many a times on both and jetBlue offers a far superior product.
What up with the shots at JB?

I love the run the JetBlue bashers give. Gee, I don't think that the whole aging process has been thought out by the management at JetBlue. Its not like the 320 has been around for more than 10 years, and they have no track record as to what to expect as the plane and the engine age nor are they being proactive about these issues now. I mean, there is no reason to expect that the management or pilots would give a moments thought to this fact and plan for it. Me, I am a TO/GA man 100%. Don't forget to tack on that- JB is leasing its airplanes and the favorite non union below pay scale complaint as well.

I wanted to laugh at G. Bethunes quote that we are 'smoking ragweed' whatever that is- check that, I did laugh, not at the quote, but at what an anachronism he is. There is a man living in todays world. Ragweed, what is that? Something he did in the 50's at the Sock Hop- that stuff is the cats pajamas.

I mean, what is the deal with the potshots at JetBlue? I have nothing to but good things to say about 'the competiton' -SWA. That is a great airline that has the big picture. But where is the love for JetBlue?

Some dude named Gandhi once said-
First they ignore you,
Then they laugh at you,
Then they fight you,
Then you win.

You see, Gandhi was this guy who....ahh, never mind.

I will save my good smack for the future, JetBlue hasn't quite reached critical mass yet, and you never know what could happen, but I never seem to read posts from JetBlue dudes ripping other companies, why is that?

V70T5- you do the math.
Sorry not really meant as a rip, just pointing out a fact. When the CEO of JB was asked over a conference call about this subject he skirted it, even though SWA has significantly higher maintenance costs, and are returning the same margins at the end of the day. JB will make it, that's not debatable, they just won't beat SWA at a game they invented. And both will not spell the end of "network" carriers, unless we do away with 65% of the traveling public who don't live in the 80 big cities that are workable under the SWA/JB model.

BTW CNN did a great 1 hour with CEO Neeliman(sp?) on Pinnacle today. Very interesting when they asked him on how to compete with SWA.
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Jet Blue is great!

Well, I for one will say that I think Jet Blue is a great airline. I have read a lot about them both from an employer and customer perspective. I think David Neeleman (correct spelling for sure), David Barger, and all the others in management there have thought this thing through in great detail. Neeleman has plenty of airline experience including a company he sold to Southwest in 1993. I believe he knows where his airline is going and how to get there. If he skirted around questions the media asked, I say GREAT!! Most of those media types would just as soon hang someone that's out there trying to do the right thing and working for a living. Jet Blue is here to stay and all the "low-cost" carriers (which soon will be everyone anyway) better keep a keen eye on them. SWA may have started it all '71 but look at it this way, some of the airlines that literally started it all way back when are no longer here.
What is the deal with the training agreement or employment agreement that you have to sign with JB? I'm not talking training costs, pay for training...something like an employee contract? Anybody know anything about this?

You guys know what I mean? I just heard this from a Guy who turned JB down and he was talking about something that they wanted him to sign. (He turned them down over a year ago). It was his belief that your CEO was going to sell down the road.

I wonder what will happen to JBLU stock when everyone trys to cash out in October?
I'm not sure what you mean by being held by the short hairs. It has the same kind of content you'd find in collective bargaining agreements, and is patterned after them to a large extent. It's a binding contract, so there's no arbitrary changes to working conditions by the company, and also no excuse on the pilot's part for claiming not to know what the conditions would be. Except that the conditions can be arbitrarily *improved* (e.g. the wages are a defined minimum). It's not written as a set of handcuffs, just as a clearly defined employment agreement. I've seen negotiated agreements that are far worse. Indeed, look at just about any other national carrier, and you'll find one. What's the problem here?

BTW, Zonker, why did you turn down JB? Just curious. I've heard stories both ways and wanted yours.
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Well, like I said, I was speaking from a limited base of knowledge. So it seemed to me that there were no improvements available for 10 years. Obviously that was incorrect.

I had a choice between JB and one of the Big 5. Hindsight, you know... I update my application all the time. I'll be back.

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