Is this practical?

[flyboy]

Thursday I was offered 135 job flying a baron for a local charter company. I was given the ops specs, a POH and 135 regs and told to report for training Monday morning. The checkride with the FSDO is Wednesday. After looking over the info it seems a little quick for a checkride, especially since I have to be out of town this weekend. I've never flown 135 before and was wondering if this is a realistic time table. The chief pilot assures me that it will be no problem. Any ideas?

 

[Tommy Boy]

Since you have never flown 135 before I would want a little more time to study the regs. Opspecs are all cookie cut, the only differences are in what the FSDO allows on that operator's certificate (take off min, type of aircraft and operations etc). Section C would be what I would study first. The baron should be pretty easy to learn. It is a well proven and stable aircraft. If you are uncomfortable or don't get enough flight time before they want to turn you loose then just tell them you want more.

As far as the 135 goes, will someone be flying with you for a few trips? That would make all the difference in the world.

You could make a little checklist to take with you until you get in the groove also. Things like runway requirements, alternate requirements etc.

Good luck eh

 

[TonyC]

Practical?


If that's the question, aviation isn't the answer!



Take your books with you wherever you "have" to go this weekend. If you're really worried about it, cancel the weekend plans. It's about priorities, right?



Good Luck, and Congrats on the new job!




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[Hung Start]

Ahhh, most 135 training programs specify a minimum amount of ground school, as well as flight training. I'd bet it is in the 40 hour gound, 4-9 hour flight range. Now,,, I know some can be waived if your experianced in same type of operation , and almost all if your 135 current in the equipment.

And I know a lot of operators "fudge" the time a bit, but this really seems not kosher.

I'd ask for a little bit more time, since what would you say if the POI askes you how much time was given to train you? Would you lie??

 

[100-1/2]

Do not set your self up to fail a 135 Checkride! That will be with you where ever you go. The operator has not provided sufficient time for indoc, ground school and flight training under ANY companies' new hire and initial aircraft training program. Previous 135 or in an similar aircraft is a different story. If the employer has painted themself into a corner and expecting you to adapt, they are representing their (un)professionalism to their POI who is likely well aware of the practices of the operator already. I have know of POI's who otherwise were really great guys capturing an opportunity like this to send a message to the Operator by thoroughly examining the newhire's rectum and documenting every deficiency. Unfortunately, the candidate becomes a casualty in this exercise.

If you are checked out with a company check airman with a rubber stamp, I agree partly with what a previous poster has implied. If in fact the checkride is with the POI, you will likely be alone and conduct a records and log review prior to beginning the Oral portion of the checkride. Voice your concerns then and at ANY time you begin to feel uncomfortable or unprepared with the material being evaluated. It is at the POI's discretion to file paperwork that will go into your record for an UNSAT during the Oral. Once in the Cockpit, that UNSAT paperwork is required except under certain conditions which will be explained to you. Again, if you are uncomfortable with the maneuvers or exercise at any time, you have the right to discontinue the examination and return to the airport. The flight is required to be rescheduled and no determination of your performance is allowed. Previous (poor) performance is not supposed to be used during the subsequent flight evaluation. It is purposed as a fresh start completely. Of course, at their discretion, the examiner may use the successful portions of the previous flight, however, will definately require the portions where you were deficient before. You and the examiner each reserve the right to discontinue the flight for any reason and at any time.

This operator is conducting business in a very shady area of the FAR's. They are more than likely cutting corners in other areas to turn a profit as well. Performance like this is why so many of us legit business are so heavily scrutinized, financially, operationally and professionally. These occurances are becoming more frequent and that is a shame. If you bag on the gig, there are likely 10 others salivating behind you eager to step in and probably with less impressive credentials. I would await a better opportunity if you could and have others in the stew.

I would strongly recommend that if the checkride is internal, become an expert in the regs and aircraft. Failure to do so will increase the chances down the road of certificate action stemming from any number of possibilities to which ignorance is not a defense as per many Far's in 61, 91, 119 and 135. And I certaintly don't want to read about you in the not-so-funny papers come winter. Get sharp and stay that way always (sooner rather than later) looking for the next better job. The barron is a great pleasure to fly but it can eat your lunch if this is your first exposure to high(er) performance twins. Many instrument panels, radio stacks and throttle quadrants are non-standard. A majority have the Gear and Flap controls in reverse locations which has led to a number of gear "collapses".

Good luck.
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p.s. - Hey, Tony! What happened to your avatar?

 

[TonyC]

p.s. - Hey, Tony! What happened to your avatar?

I took it down in deference to a mourning CEO. Now the software won't let me put one back up.








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[semperfido]

i can't put a new one up either...what gives?

 

[kilroy]

Initial New Hires (INHA)with no experience are required 34 hrs of basic indoc as well as 2 hours emergency train couple of hours of longrange nav,hazmat, and a few other items. Equals to about 40 hours. You can get credit for home study about 20 hrs worth but the rest has to be done in indoc. They have to sign you of as trained so be careful of what training records you sign. Good Luck

 

[flyboy]

Thanks for the responses. The checkride is with the POI and I had it moved until next week. I did about 2.5 hours of ground training and 2.3 flight training with the chief pilot. I saw in the training manual where it required like 30 hours of ground and at least 4 hours of flight. The only real issues i've encountered flying the baron is, as someone stated earlier, the throttles are in the wrong place. I've screwed up a couple of times doing single-engine work b/c of that. The ops manual, 135 regs and POH are the only study materials I've received. It doesn't seem like a whole lot which is what scares me. There just has to be more to it than this.

The chief pilot is the check airman on every other a/c in the fleet except for the baron. THAT SUX!! He says that I'm ready but I just don't share the enthusiasm. This company has been doing this for 50+ years and the chief says he has a great relationship with the POI. However, the POI has a reputation in our area of being very tough. I've met HER and I can see how she could be. Anyway, I've bought myself another week so hopefully I can pull it off. Thanks.

 

[100-1/2]

You wouldn't be in KY would you?

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