Iran Air pilots are joining the uprising

[Indy319FA]

I feel like the underlying problem that many are failing to grasp is the SEVERE fiscal irresponsibility that we as Americans have nurtured for all of these years. And by years I mean nearly 30. Read my posts from a year ago. If the average family of 4 earns 49K, and carry 18K in UNSECURED debt, then their budget will never balance. If lenders truly do turn back to fiscal responsibility, similar to the period from the 40's to the 80's, then we may very well be in for a "lost decade". The other alternative is that the irresponsible masses quell their debts through the courts and defaults. The financial repercussions in this instance would also be dire. I'm not a doom-and-gloomer, but I see this situation being far worse than many media and government outlets would like us to believe. It is in their best interest for us to have confidence and spend, but what are most going to use for their purchases? Negative savings rate for how many years? Debt loads per person never before seen? In my mind we have had 25 years of VIRTUAL prosperity, and to unwind that will take a long time. Please input your ideas and how you see things shaking out. This is simply my belief. Good luck to us all!!

I went to an energy policy meeting last week and there were four economists present. Usually if you get two economists, they can't agree on anything. ALL FOUR agreed interest rates are getting ready to skyrocket, which will kill any recovery in the housing sector. Next year, they all agreed we are likely to see inflation in the area of 10-12%, unemployment north of 10%, and zero economic growth (stagflation). One pointed out that Bernanke's plan, is to start taking money out of the system when economic growth takes off. His hope, they said, is that economic growth will take off with inflation. During a hearing he was asked what the Fed will do if we get inflation with no growth, and he did not have much of an answer.

There are several reasons for expecting stagflation. First interest rates are expected to climb over the next few months. Also the price of oil is increasing. Finally, any growth for next year is expected to be killed off by crushing tax increases. What many do not realize is the spending from the "stimulus" bill does not take off until 2010. Obama is going to be forced into massive tax increases to pay for this. That is why you have heard several new taxes floated lately. Unfortunately the "stimulus" bill was nothing more than a spending bill for projects Democrats had wanted for years, and will not be very stimulative to the economy, but it is going to drive the deficit through the ceiling.

For those of you who say all this isn't Obamas fault, you don't understand how much he has increased the debt. The best presentation on this I've seen was last week. This economics professor had a peanut butter jar filled with popcorn kernels, one for every billion in debt Bush was responsible for. Next he demonstrated the amount of debt Obama is responsible for. The popcorn kernels filled a two gallon bucket. So say what you want about Bush, he deserves every bit of criticism. But his financial irresponsibility pales in comparison to Obama.

This is why Obama and the Democrats are pushing for so much legislation. These guys are not stupid enough to believe what they are hearing from a fawing media. They know they are likely to face large losses in 2010, because they will be going into an election that historically faces the party out of power, while pushing through tax increases with a horrible economy.

I read an article recently that discussed Clinton and Obama. The author pointed out that Clinton, love him or hate him, was a brilliant politican who knew exactly how far he could push when it came to taxes and spending, and no more. Obama, on the other hand, is a street activist who passionately believes in social justice. He will burn the house down, rather than compromise on issues related to social and economic justice. There was an article in the New York Times a couple of weeks ago about strong disagreements over spending on his economic team. Hopefully some these guys will get him to back off the spending and tax increases and get back to the moderate fiscal programs he promised. What is likely, however, is Obama is going to continue with his policies and sink or swim with them.

 

[JustaNumber]

box,
I completely agree with your assessment. Combine the personal debt problem with the Federal Reserve artificially having lowered interest rates to encourage irresponsible borrowing (trying to postpone the inevitable collapse of that virtual prosperity), and add in congress pushing lending institutions to make horrible lending decisions, and we have a mess far greater than many realize. No matter how much government tries to "control" the market, the free market will eventually triumph and find equilibrium. All of the "virtual prosperity" that you wrote of never truly existed, so all the associated jobs can't be brought "back" since they too never truly existed. There is a lot of pain coming.

I feel the solution is to take the pain, the sooner the better. It can only be postponed, but the longer that is tried, the worse the eventual crash.

We also need to get our politicians to stop meddling in the marketplace. Abolish the Fed. Stop printing money and devaluing the currency. Stop the bailouts. The only reason banks have been making such assininely stupid loans is because they knew the government (in the form of Fannie, Freddie, and eventually the FDIC) would bail them out and buy their worthless mortgages. 30-year mortgages were some of the safest investment products available for almost a hundred years before Congress started mandating that they be made to the "disadvantaged" during the 1990s. Now how safe are they? We need to get out of the socialism/fascism business and allow the free market to take on all the risk. Only then will risk be truly quantified and managed.

Bush made terrible decisions. Obama is making terrible decisions. We need to stop the left/right BS ("your guy is much worse than my guy") and start demanding accountability and common sense from D.C.!!!!

 

[waveflyer]

Maybe you should actually read some history rather than relying on MSNBC/NBC/ABC/CBS/PBS/New York Times, etc. The current recession we are in is the worst since Jimmy Carter was president, not the 1930's. It sounds to me like you need to expand your sources of information beyond the official govt propaganda machines.

I love how the list of "discredited" news agencies keeps growing. You forgot to add the vast educational conspiracy against the right. This thread is about Iran- not our bs partisanship. If they overthrow ahmadenijad- that will prove enormous arguments against the idea of forced democracy. The world is global and people are connected- I'm hoping for them.

 

[Indy319FA]

We also need to get our politicians to stop meddling in the marketplace. Abolish the Fed. Stop printing money and devaluing the currency. Stop the bailouts.

Just,

I was talking to a member of the Paul family, and this person told me Ron Paul's bill to audit the Fed actually has a chance in the House. Apparently Bernanke is pretty worried about it. If it passed, it would be the first piece of legislation Ron Paul has authored that was passed in the House.

 

[FR8mastr]

Yes, life under the Bush administration was just wonderful. Unchecked corporate greed leading to the worst recession since the 1930s, massive bank failures, government granting itself unchecked powers to detain and spy on its own citizens, a long war based on personal revenge and faulty intelligence that has cost thousands of American lives and hundreds of billions of dollars and hundreds of thousands of American jobs lost or shipped overseas. What fun, why can't we have more of it?

Stop watching Fox News and listening to Rush Limbaugh. It is amazing what happens when you do, I speak from experience.

Yep, I mostly agree. One question, why hasn't his worship done anything to repeal the Patriot act? Why hasn't the Supreme done anything to stop the unfair trade practices that have cost this country so much. Bye the way, NAFTA was Clintons baby.

I know its the "in thing" to bash Fox news, but other than the editorial segments what is your beef. CNN, and worst of all MSNBC have much more biased editorial crap.

The sooner you realize Dem. Rep. what's the difference the better off we all will be. One is paid off by oil the other by drug companies.......

the real enemy to our constitution is the Bilderburg group, they are the ones pulling the strings of all our so called leader, bar a very few.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Yep, I mostly agree. One question, why hasn't his worship done anything to repeal the Patriot act? Why hasn't the Supreme done anything to stop the unfair trade practices that have cost this country so much. Bye the way, NAFTA was Clintons baby.

I know its the "in thing" to bash Fox news, but other than the editorial segments what is your beef. CNN, and worst of all MSNBC have much more biased editorial crap.

The sooner you realize Dem. Rep. what's the difference the better off we all will be. One is paid off by oil the other by drug companies.......

the real enemy to our constitution is the Bilderburg group, they are the ones pulling the strings of all our so called leader, bar a very few.

We have a winner!

 

[NEDude]

Bye the way, NAFTA was Clintons baby.

Read your history of NAFTA. It was actually George H.W. Bush's "baby" and was ceremonially signed by Bush, Canadian PM Brian Mulroney and Mexican President Carlos Salinas in San Antonio, Texas on December 17, 1992.

Bush left office before the treaty was ratified by the U.S. Senate. Clinton insisted in greater protections for U.S. jobs (oh the horror!) and more stringent environmental protections resulting in a reworking of the treaty before being ratified and signed into law in December 1993.

 

[regionaltard]

Yes, life under the Bush administration was just wonderful.

I hate to nudge the thread back on topic, but it's very unlikely that Iran's citizens, airline pilots included, would even have a concept of a fair election were it not for the good work that American fighting men have done next door. Domestically his Administration was arguably an unmitigated disaster but I think that there's a good chance that history will be much kinder to him on the subject of Iraq.

 

[coogebeachhotel]

Frickin people are dying over there and you guys are having a pissing contest. Pilots are tools

 

[JustaNumber]

Frickin people are dying over there and you guys are having a pissing contest. Pilots are tools

Debate over policy by us the people is essential to freedom in our republic's future. People will always be dying around the world, both for and against freedom. The best thing we can do is debate.