International Flt. Planning

[empenage]

This isnt a poll so get those fingers off the keyboard.

Our department uses Universal Weather & Aviation, to the tune of over 20,000$ a month. The service is OK but I was wondering if anyone has used Air Routing International, etc. ?

Has anyone had problems with Universal lately?

Any feedback is appreciated.

 

[ultrarunner]

I have been using AirRouting for the last couple of years and I have no complaints really to speak of.

I don't have near the usage your deparment has, and with the costs you are currently at, I would recommend having AirRouting come in and give you a proposal.

Additionally, I'd have Universal "compete" for the business as well. Since if you're unhappy with any aspect of what they are offering, I would have to think they would listen.

At nearly a quarter of a million dollars a year in fees, you are in an EXCELLENT position to dictate what you want, and what you're willing to pay.

At the very least, I would expect your costs to be reduced no matter what vendor you choose.

 

[empenage]

I wanted to try to have another company like Air Routing do a trip for us and see if there is real difference. I was just wondering if anyone has used both and if so what was the difference.

If I do this I'm sure this "other company" would be on their best behavior and I dont want to find out 6 months down the road that they are the same or worse than Universal. We will fly 31 out of 31 days this month and to try and switch over to another company, with our schedule, could be tough on the crews.

What I'm really looking for is "service". We go to a bunch of out-of-the-way places and we have had problems with handlers and flight planning with Universal.

 

[ultrarunner]

As I said, I have been using AirRouting, and the places that I frequent, I have not had any problems with flight plans or handlers. The release, wx, etc has, in nearly each case, always been at the hotel AND at the airport when they said it would be.

Handlers have been fine as well.

Most of the problems that I have run into when traveling to 'out of the way places' have more to do with folks you have little control over.

Case-in-point:

Fueling... If you're at an airport where there is no FBO, per say, and it's just airline fuel, you wait if there's a push...simple as that.

Issues such as this have little to do with the handling agent.

I would expect if you do a trip this week with AirRouting, you will not eno**CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED**er any problems.

But again, I must iterate... if you're spending a quarter mil a year at Universal and you're having problems with flight plans, I'd be up someones butt so quick....

well, you get the point...

And in the mean time, try AR. A word of caution... I have seen instances where each of these vendors might use the same handling agent at destination so ask when you book the trip.

 

[empenage]

And in the mean time, try AR. A word of caution... I have seen instances where each of these vendors might use the same handling agent at destination so ask when you book the trip.

Now that is very interesting. I didnt know that.

We did the "up the butt" thing last week. Universal doesnt want to lose us as a customer. How about switching "teams"? We have the yellow team right now and they are used to us. I'm wondering if we might get better treatment on another team?

 

[ultrarunner]

Teams huh? Didn't know Univ. used teams. Hmmm.

I suppose you could try that, but maybe the problems you are encountering are deeper than that.

 

[empenage]

I think the problem, for the most part, is lack of attention to detail. We do encounter many changes to our trips before our departure dates. I know that anytime there are changes to a schedule there are bound to be mistakes. It just seems that it is happening more often.

On a standard trip for us, say KMMU-LFSB-RJAA-VABB-VAAH-VABB-LFSB-KMMU, small details start to add up fast.

 

[ratings:all]

int'l

is seems most of these discussions revolve around 'the two that used to be one'. from what i understand, air routing started out first, and universal was started by air routing employees. from my humble experience, no matter which planning company you use, you're going to come across the same mentality.

as far as pricing goes, i never never never forwarded an invoice for payment withouth looking it over for accuracy first . . . and caught many mistakes that were on *their* part, and got the bill reduced.

as far as differences between the two, air routing has the best security arm, but i prefer universal's weather. however, nobody seems to mention the other players in the game. jeppesen and baseops, and arinc just started up one, as well. might well be worth looking into

 

[ukipilot]

Try AIRINC, we have been using them for quite some time at a much better price than you have been paying with UNIVERSAL, and have had excellent services with them, they do everything that universal does, and you have AFIS capabilities with them also. Typical trips for us are:

KMCO-PHNL-VHHH-LIRN-LIMC-LOWS-UUEE-EFHK-ESSA-EGSS-LFPO-LEMD-HECA-KMCO

Try them

 

[lawndart]

International

We've tried about everyone out there.... Universal, Air Routing, Baseops, Skyplan, Jeppesen, etc...and have settled on Universal. We did go to them and beat them down on their prices. We are with the Yellow team also, and have had very few problems (we had far more problems with the other vendors). There are some locations that we frequent that we specify the handling agent we want to use (Buenos Aires- Transair, Sao Paulo- Ogden, just to name a couple). Universal doesn't like it, but they will do it. There are some locations that there isn't a choice, but most of the handling agents are independant agents that will work for whoever is paying them. Tony D'Asta is the best guy to deal with on the yellow team. Some of the other guys you have to watch. Overall, they do a decent job and will talk pricing with you if they think you are going to use someone else.