IFR Passenger Tips

[KigAir]

I've got a PPL friend who wants to tag along the next time I fly in IMC practicing approaches. This guy is low time and will only fly in severe clear daytime conditions. Never at night. My main concern is that he may panic and become a major distraction. We would be doing this at an airport in class C airspace which tends to be quite busy. On the other hand, I think it would be a good experince for him. Can anybody provide any suggests or advice on how I should approach this??

Thanks

 

[Toy Soldier]

Jittery passenger

HI

You may want to consider one or all of the following:

1. Take the friend up one day while it is NOT total IMC and see how he reacts. Kind of like "indoctrinating" him to the task ahead.

2. DEFINITELY, DEFINITELY, apply CRM here! Make sure that he understands FULLY what he is to do, and NOT do during the flight. You may even want to ASSIGN specific duties to keep him busy - keep him occupied.

3. Be TOTALLY prepared to deal with a "possibly panicky" passenger. You will need to develop this skill for ANY emergency that may come up with ANY passenger. The CHALLENGE is for YOU to be able to deal with the tasks while calming your passenger.

4. Have him fly with a CFI the first time.
5. Don't get in over your head!
6. Have fun with your friend.

I hope this helps...

 

[ILLINI]

Don't go on a low IFR day. Go on a day when there are high ceilings around 2-3,000 AGL so you can duck beneath the clouds if he does get a little too nervous. This way you won't have to worry about shooting an approach with your buddy spazzing out next to you. If you fly out of a busy airport, then just leave the airport VFR under the clouds and then ask for an IFR clearance for an altitude that will put you in the soup. I'm not sure what part of the country you are flying in, but make sure you are careful with icing. If he does ok with this, then maybe you can think about taking him on a day when the ceilings are a little lower. Remember to know your limitaions and don't exceed them by trying to impress anyone. You might want to let him know a little about what to expect. Talk about the illusions he may experience. You don't want him grabbing at the controlls because he thinks the plane is banking when it is really straight and level. It might also be fun to take him on top of the clouds. Every student I took above for the first time thought it was the coolest thing, especially when it was dark and gloomy on the ground, but bright, sunny, blue skies above the clouds.

 

[KigAir]

Re: Jittery passenger

We have already discussed some of the points you mention. We have talked about his role in the flight. We've agreeded that he would be responsible for pressing the IDENT button when required and verify FREQs that I tune in. Small but important tasks. For me, this flight is about the items you discuss in #3. I consider myself a proficent IFR pilot but I've only flown solo in IMC. I am very interested in seeing how I react if he happens to panic. I am 100% confident that I can safely operate the aircraft but I would very much like to test myself.

HI

You may want to consider one or all of the following:

1. Take the friend up one day while it is NOT total IMC and see how he reacts. Kind of like "indoctrinating" him to the task ahead.

2. DEFINITELY, DEFINITELY, apply CRM here! Make sure that he understands FULLY what he is to do, and NOT do during the flight. You may even want to ASSIGN specific duties to keep him busy - keep him occupied.

3. Be TOTALLY prepared to deal with a "possibly panicky" passenger. You will need to develop this skill for ANY emergency that may come up with ANY passenger. The CHALLENGE is for YOU to be able to deal with the tasks while calming your passenger.

4. Have him fly with a CFI the first time.
5. Don't get in over your head!
6. Have fun with your friend.

I hope this helps...

 

[aviatrix]

Re: Re: Jittery passenger

We've agreeded that he would be responsible for pressing the IDENT button when required

Awesome! He must be thrilled about the challenges that lie ahead!

 

[Flylo]

So what is the recommended procedure for a seriously panicked passenger in a light airplane? Grabbing controls, etc.

It would seem to be fairly straightforward in an airliner, especially if they're trying to light some portion of their anatomy or tear open one of the hatches or hop the Hooters chick, I mean FA, or something like that. You've got room to maneuver and firmly convince them of the error of their ways. But in a little single engine, the only thing I can think of is to have a spring loaded sledge hammer mounted over the right seat so you can give them the "Slaughterhouse Swat" if they need it.

Really, what could you do but deliver a few well placed elbows?

Aw, I probably shouldn't worry anyway. The only time they panic on me is after we shave a few limbs and get to that third or fourth bounce and by then, we're going slow enough that I can just jump out.

 

[Toy Soldier]

Link to an article...

I am searching for info/articles to help you out with this dilemma. I found the following article at the attached link. Maybe it will be helpfull. I will search some more and give you all the info I can.

LINK:
http://www.studentpilot.com/articles/medical_articles/article.php?medical_id=31

 

[Toy Soldier]

In response to FLYLO's question about the technique for a PANICKY-GRAB-THE-CONTROLS kind of guy... Well, my instructor taught me to "chop the throat" of such a person to give them something else to think about!

Of course, we prepare ourselves and our passengers to the fullest extent of our abilities, BUT, things DO and CAN go wrong!

I have had to "bully" students on occassion that simply "froze" on the controls to a point that I couldn't put in any inputs! However, simply "forcefully telling them to BACK OFF" has helped. I haven't had to chop anyone yet!

I have YET to have a regular (non-pilot) passenger try to touch the controls. OTHER pilot's have tended to grab controls when the winds blew unexpectedly and it kind of surprised me when they did - since it was unexpected. This is why it is important to "lay down the rules" of just who is PIC... and who isn't. ALSO, have a stern command voice.

 

[ClassG]

HMMMmmm.....

I've been hearing about the ever elusive sczhizophrenic (yea, spelling, I know) control-grabbing student pilot for years, but I have never unwittingly run into him or heard from anyone who actually has experienced such a sighting.

Have any of you? I mean REALLY seen this creature?

I believe we should continue to train for this (possible, yet unprobable) eventuality. Practice a little flight deck Kung Fu every now and then. But does this guy really need to limit himself just because this clown might become a little frightened in IMC?

Have the talk with him, strap him in, start the plane, remind him what he cannot do one more time, and fly go out and shoot approaches to minimums (or your personal limits) all day long. Remember, he asked you to go along. To me, this implies he trusts you and he'll take the risk. He knows he has no business touching your aircraft. You will be PIC and he'll just sit there. If he talks too much or gets weird, tell him to quiet down or you'll have to take him home. He'll cooperate.

Or have you finally uncovered proof that "First Officer Wackadoo" really does exist?

Have Fun. Maybe it'll help to promote a little future confidence in this pilot to watch someone else doing the things that scare the hell out of him.

I know I would. But that's just me.

 

[tarp]

...or this little sage advice (which I got on flying with spouses)

"If the whine from the right seat exceeds the whine from the engine, change something!"

 

[ibaflyer]

I have also used s few low time pilots to fly with me while I shoot approaches. I usually have a pre-flight talk about what approaches I am going to do and the duties that I expect of him (her). I try to never go in low IFR conditions. Personally I use a cloud deck of 2000 feet or higher.

Also remember, that after you are done with your approaches, let the other person have some stick time. It may be the only time that they will get to fly on someone elses dime or in my case, get high performance time. Hope that this helps.