Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

I need some encouragement

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web
k_EAT=ho_ME said:
You gotta have one of three things to go from 250 to employable: access to a big bank account (not necessarily your own), a wife/husband/parents (hopefully your own) to support you during 1,000 hours or so of flight instructing wages (particularly in a small market), or really good industry contacts.

What do you mean by industry contacts?
 
Quick bit of persepective for you bud...

I've been unemployed for longer than you've been "grinding away" in line service.

I am BY NO MEANS an old salt, or even remotely experienced. I have to grow a goatee to even have a chance at not being carded. I have had passengers ask for an older crew.

First off, I'm amazed that anyone could think their worth so great that with ~350 hours that any flying job would be theirs other than as a CFI. I'm even more amazed that there are flying schools that allow anyone to believe such (and I fully realize that they are about their scrilla).

Don't think that instructing is bad. If I could, I'd be instructing on the side right now. Go get your CFI ($5000, that sounds like a rip off to me though). Get the heck out of Florida. Go find an FBO at an airport that only has a few wanna be pilots hanging around (as opposed to the few dozens you probably compete with now). Make a name for youself by not worrying about the next step. Trust me, the next step can easily be a letdown. Make yourself happy instructing, and frankly, the next step will step on your toes and be a bit of an inconvenience.

Like I said, there are many, many more experienced chaps than I out there, but I got my CFI, did that on and off for 4 years, worked as an A&P on King Airs for a while, and had to leave that to find a job on the "career track" in the right seat, with a relatively quick upgrade in sight--and was laid off. After months and months of looking, I landed another right seat gig.

From the time that I first got a paycheck as a professional pilot (CFI) to now, I've been unemployed as such more than I have been employed. But the "off periods" have been a lot of fun. I've worked in youth camping, I've been a handyman, I drove buses in a ski town for the winter (and got to shred a lot), I've restored a few old trucks, and I've been the envy of all I know while the aviation industry has decided my services aren't needed.

You don't need encouragement. You need to stop thinking of flight instructing as boring, crappy, or whatever you are thinking it is. There are parts of it that can suck, but that comes with nearly every job.

And once you've given flight instructing an honest try, after half a year to a year, I'm sure that you could find another job if you wanted one bad enough.

Good luck to you. But realize who you are competing with for those jobs. Until recently, I was in the market for a job, and I've fueled my share of planes, I've cut my arms with safety wire, I've ridden through more student landings than I can recall, I've been through 10 hour flying days, I've loaded a few thousand pounds of boxes when it's freezing out--and I'm still just a scrub (hanging out the right hand side of my best friend's ride, trying to holler at me).

Whatever man, just do it with a smile.

It doesn't necessarily get better, but it gets different.

Dan
 
Groundpounder said:
What do you mean by industry contacts?

Well, I didn't have any, so I'm only speculating. But, for example, there's a guy at a nearby airport with a CJ that seems to have a revolving SIC. I know the owner doesn't really enjoy paying for the co-pilot, but grudgingly does.

I don't really want to encourage anyone to whore themselves out to greedy rich guys to avoid getting time in a more respectable manner, like instructing, or dropping meatballs or towing banners, etc. But we have probably all heard of a pilot getting legit (though possibly not deserved) right seat in something Part 91 that actually required a right-seater, because he or daddy had contacts.

I recommend marrying a gainfully employed woman who thinks pilots are noble, cool and sexy. Let her pay the bills while you teach. This worked for me, but did involve much kowtowing and suck-upping. Oh, and yes, my wife does need glasses.
 
Groundpounder said:
I've wanted to fly for as long as I can remember, and I've been trying to reach this goal for a long time. I got my Multi commercial Insturment almost a year ago, and moved from New Hampshire to down here in Ft Lauderdale, with the goal of getting some sort of flying job. I haven't had any luck getting flying time, so now I am going to start working on my CFI. I don't really want to instruct, but I don't see any other way of getting flying time. So I am going to invest about $5000 more into my flying career, and I hope something comes of it. But, I am going to take a huge pay cut from working line service, and I am going to have to try to work full time and instruct part time.
So what do I have to look forward to? Those of you that are 'succesful' how long were you stuck being an instructor? How did you make enough money to be able to feed yourself? What kind of flying job did you get after being a CFI? My goal is to get a good part 91 corporate gig, how can I help myself toward that goal at this point?
Last but not least, was it all worth it?

Sorry if this is a bit rambling, but I'm just feeling a lil' depressed, and need a good kick in the rear.

P.S. Oh yeah, most of the guys I worked with in line service that were working on their ratings at the same time that I was are now flying, two at Comair, one just got hired by CoEx, and another is flying a G4.
Hey Dan, give Wisconsin Aviaiton a call? Maybe they could use a CFI and you could work on your ratings there...seen it happen. Good luck to you man!
 
Dan CFI/CFII said:
Get the heck out of Florida. Go find an FBO at an airport that only has a few wanna be pilots hanging around (as opposed to the few dozens you probably compete with now).

The rest of the post was too long and I didn't read it ;) , but this part is excellent advice.
 
My CFI candidate went to the FSDO for a seminar for prospective CFI's, the first thing the Fed made the guys do was teach the class how to tie a shoe. So,as MsKittyKat's fiancee knows,and this very experienced Fed was trying to relay to these guys, teaching skills are paramount. (and in many cases, independent of flying skills).
 
There's a lot of good advice in this thread, but Dan makes some exceptionally good points...

Dan CFI/CFII said:
First off, I'm amazed that anyone could think their worth so great that with ~350 hours that any flying job would be theirs other than as a CFI.

I'm not sure what "scrilla" means, but even with a couple hundred more hours than that, the same applies to me.

$5000, that sounds like a rip off to me though.

Amen!

Make a name for youself by not worrying about the next step. Trust me, the next step can easily be a letdown. Make yourself happy instructing, and frankly, the next step will step on your toes and be a bit of an inconvenience...You don't need encouragement. You need to stop thinking of flight instructing as boring, crappy, or whatever you are thinking it is. There are parts of it that can suck, but that comes with nearly every job...It doesn't necessarily get better, but it gets different.

Agree 100%, and may I submit further that if you aren't happy as a CFI, you probably won't be happy in other flying jobs. That's not necessarily true in all cases, but every flying job you have will require you to perform certain duties, i.e. actually work for a living. The days of joy riding and having an instructor focused on your progress (that is if your instructors were any good) are rapidly coming to an end. Every job will suck a little, and if you have the ability to enjoy it anyway, that speaks volumes about you. Ironically, one of the few sucky things about my instructing job is all the complaining that some of the other instructors do! Now out of the nest with ye!

-Goose
 
Last edited:
Groundpounder said:
I get along with people very well, and I have great customer service skills, and I want to have happy students that know what they are doing. I'm tasked with doing training at the FBO, and I think I do a good job with that. I'm just a bit nervous that I won't be a good CFI, and it will just be another $5k down the tubes.

Don't get nervous until you log your first dual given. If you're worried about being a bad instructor you should study like crazy and practice teaching in your free time. I know one guy who set up two chairs side by side in his dining room and put his dog next to him to practice teaching. Sounds weird, but the guy was an excellent CFI. Think about all of the good and bad instructors you had through the course of your flight training. Combine the traits of the good and think to yourself how you won't be like the bad. But don't be worried about not being a good CFI, if you study hard and truly learn how to teach that shouldn't happen.
 
My .02 cents worth
There are other ways to build flight time. I got my first job flying jumpers with 300 hours and logged 350 hours flying meat bombs. Was it a dream flying job? Heck no..... but it was a blast....
Go to dropzone.com and check the classifieds listings for the skydiving jobs.
You could always tow banners along the beach..... I've never done it but it looks kind of fun flying low and slow along a beach watching the sharks attack the kiddies.

How about flying fire patrols?
Get a list from the Dept of Conservation of who has the fire patrol contract in your state..... I flew 3 years worth of fire patrols and logged a ton of cross country time this way.

You could always fly scenic tours..... It's kind of late in the season to be looking for scenic tour jobs but it's an amazing way to network (you would be amazed at the amount of pilots who take scenic flights).

I agree with the other posters who have said get out of Florida (too many pilots down there).
Be willing to pack your bags and move at a moments notice. Realize that you aren't going to become wealthy flying these jobs.

Goodluck
 
I want to get the heck out of Floiduh, it stinks down here. I'm from NH, and I'd love to get back up there, but I didn't think there were any jobs up there. But, I guess I could be wrong.......
 

Latest resources

Back
Top