I am Confused, Should I Right it Up?

[BoilerUP]

If discrepancies are legitimate maintenance issues...how could the company legally justify punitive action against a pilot that wrote those items up?

 

[chqflyer]

If discrepancies are legitimate maintenance issues...how could the company legally justify punitive action against a pilot that wrote those items up?

It probably varies widely depending on the outfit. My company comes down like a bag of anvils on you if they deem a write up to be unworthy. I've had my employment threatened several times over the years for holding my ground on certain maintenance items. It sucks balls, but it's a fact of life at the dirt bag regionals.

 

[Oakum_Boy]

And they won't hesitate to throw you under a bus if the item in question causes an accident. Damned if you do, eternally damned if you don't.

 

[Holy Shiite]

Every time a Pilot has been suspended/terminated for "alleged" inappropriate mx write-ups they always get their job back with back pay. Don't give in to fear and intimidation as some "supposed" Pilot's here advise you to. These message boards are chock full of shills and fake's and it is easy to see right through them. HS

 

[PCL_128]

Every time a Pilot has been suspended/terminated for "alleged" inappropriate mx write-ups they always get their job back with back pay.

Wrong. Oh so very wrong.

 

[jynxyjericho]

Every time

You're not seriously going to speak for every single action against a pilot are you? Pilots do get in trouble for this crap.

 

[Holy Shiite]

Wrong. Oh so very wrong.

Let me be a little more clear, What I am referring to is during negotiations when the company decides to take hostages. Lets say after the company publishes something like "any inappropriate write-ups will result in discipline up to and including termination" I happen to be living proof of a nice paid vacation so don't let these turds try and scare you. Sure, there have been guys fired in the past for just cause but I am specifically talking about the company taking hostages during negotiations. If you do your job by the book you are covered. How can you be fired (justly) for following company procedures?? Do your job and document everything and you will be fine. Don't give in to the fear and intimidation. These tactics have been used many times in the past and are standard procedure. Get educated and the knowledge you gain will give you confidence.

 

[PCL_128]

Holy Shiite, I've personally been there to see someone lose his arbitration in a case like this. I've seen others suspended. And then there's the court case where a judge actually ordered ALPA to tell the pilots to stop writing up airplanes. I'm telling you, it's not as cut and dry as you make it out to be. You're going to get people fired. Stop.

 

[Ineedabrew]

Holy Shiite, I've personally been there to see someone lose his arbitration in a case like this. I've seen others suspended. And then there's the court case where a judge actually ordered ALPA to tell the pilots to stop writing up airplanes. I'm telling you, it's not as cut and dry as you make it out to be. You're going to get people fired. Stop.

I am sorry... I respect your opinion but if something needs to be written up it will... If I lose my job so be it... You are mistaken if threats like this will scare us away... We will right up stuff till the chickens come home to roost

 

[Ineedabrew]

And personally I find it offence they would publish a warning like this... I am more determined to follow the law...

 

[SoberIrishman]

Better be right than rong I guess!

 

[jynxyjericho]

And personally I find it offence they would publish a warning like this... I am more determined to follow the law...

What you are purposefully missing is an important counterpoint, if a pilot has always written crap up, they're fine, they should continue to act as such. If you or someone at work suddenly finds Jesus and starts following the law all the sudden they'll get canned.

 

[PCL_128]

I am sorry... I respect your opinion but if something needs to be written up it will... If I lose my job so be it... You are mistaken if threats like this will scare us away... We will right up stuff till the chickens come home to roost

If you've always done so, then no problem. The problem comes in when people suddenly change the way they've been doing things. The company tracks the number of write-ups each pilot has, and they monitor trends. When it spikes, they've found a target. And arbitrators are very sympathetic to companies in such circumstances, because the pilot really has no defense. Either he's taking part in an illegal job action, or he never cared about following the law before there was a labor dispute. Either way, he's not looking good, and the arbitrator feels no remorse about ending his career.

 

[PCL_128]

And personally I find it offence they would publish a warning like this... I am more determined to follow the law...

They're required to publish a warning like this. A judge in the 11th Circuit ruled years ago that labor unions have "an affirmative obligation" to stop illegal job actions. It's not enough that the union doesn't start the job action, they're actually required to do everything in their power to stop it. The judge went so far as to suggest that ALPA should expel members from the union who are suspected of taking part.

 

[mightyM]

Meanwhile at booger king, Mr. I ain't got no education but I best be gettin my $20 raise or else I'm gonna flip those burgers a hole lot slower because I got babies to feed gets national coverage and a high five from everyone....FML .....FT..RLA.

Various parts spelled in error on purpose for dramatical humor.
Your welcome.

 

[Ops check good]

airlines have software that tracks maintenance write-up rates by aircraft, engine, pilot, mechanic, etc.

I'm not at Xjet but I am an airline mechanic so I need to say you are correct on this to a point. Every discrepancy/corrective action for every A/C is entered into a database (including all employee #s). People are tracking said entry's but it is for reliability reasons (checking for repeat items to flag). I have no idea if somebody is looking for any single employee discrepancy rate to go up. I do know that you can search an employee number and everything that employee has written up/signed off comes up. Either way if it's broke it's broke! We can't do our job if you don't do yours. I think all airline professionals know what the appropriate flight line discrepancies are.

 

[Holy Shiite]

If you've always done so, then no problem. The problem comes in when people suddenly change the way they've been doing things. The company tracks the number of write-ups each pilot has, and they monitor trends. When it spikes, they've found a target. And arbitrators are very sympathetic to companies in such circumstances, because the pilot really has no defense. Either he's taking part in an illegal job action, or he never cared about following the law before there was a labor dispute. Either way, he's not looking good, and the arbitrator feels no remorse about ending his career.

If this guy is/was your ALPA grievance committee member/volunteer then take matters into your own hands. This wimp is exactly the type of person the company loves to see on the other side of the aisle..... A pushover afraid of his own shadow. Is this guy for real?? I really hope not and have to question the validity of this person. A 717 pilot? What reason do you have to be here on these boards? What agenda do you have? Who's side are you on pal?????


During negotiations I have seen the number of maintenance discrepancies increase and the number of deferrals increase as well. If the company chooses to increase the number of deferred items on each aircraft than the number of write ups will increase as well. More stuff to break and go wrong and subsequently more maintenance write-ups. Been there, done that and worked on the grievance committee as well. Yes, the Pilot has a defense and the alpa attorneys I have worked with were excellent. I Support Pilots in their negotiations. Who supports weakness and apathy?

 

[tyuwerty]

Silly children, PCL is for real.

Never mind though, don't listen to experience, make your own mistakes. I am sure it will work wonderfully for you this time around.

 

[PCL_128]

I really hope not and have to question the validity of this person. A 717 pilot? What reason do you have to be here on these boards? What agenda do you have? Who's side are you on pal?????

Plenty of people here know who am and know my experience. Whose side am I on? I'm on the side of the pilots whose careers I don't want to see lost because some ignorant people on the internet told them that they can't get fired for something that they really can get fired for. You aren't a pilot's advocate if you end his career with your false bravado. I have no problem if you want to be ignorant and end your own career. But please don't encourage others to do so by giving them false information.

 

[jynxyjericho]

If this guy is/was your ALPA grievance committee member/volunteer then take matters into your own hands. This wimp is exactly the type of person the company loves to see on the other side of the aisle..... A pushover afraid of his own shadow. Is this guy for real?? I really hope not and have to question the validity of this person. A 717 pilot? What reason do you have to be here on these boards? What agenda do you have? Who's side are you on pal?????


During negotiations I have seen the number of maintenance discrepancies increase and the number of deferrals increase as well. If the company chooses to increase the number of deferred items on each aircraft than the number of write ups will increase as well. More stuff to break and go wrong and subsequently more maintenance write-ups. Been there, done that and worked on the grievance committee as well. Yes, the Pilot has a defense and the alpa attorneys I have worked with were excellent. I Support Pilots in their negotiations. Who supports weakness and apathy?

Shut your mouth, open your ears (or eyes I suppose).