How the hell does this happen?

[Vne]

It's called captain's authority, a quaint old concept I learned from my elders in this business.....

AA captains have no authority on the ground not given to them by the gate agents.

 

[RJAA]

Unless the airplane is on fire, smoke or about to explode, for any other reason the slides are being deployed, it's unlikely that I would jump off the slide off a MD-80 or B737. Maybe I will congregate to get some fresh air by the door, that's about it. It's clearly not a live or death situation. What are they going to do? Walk to the terminal?

 

[JimG]

What are they going to do? Walk to the terminal?

Uhm....yeah.

 

[Huck]

What are they going to do? Walk to the terminal?

It won't kill them. I work in the freight world (now), and believe it or not, you can get off an airplane on a set of stairs, and you can walk to the terminal. You really gonna turn that down and sit in that tube for that long?

Every big airport has an FBO. And every big airport FBO has a set of stairs. If the station won't bring you some, call the FBO on unicom (I've actually done this at Gemini), and get them to bring the stairs over. This captain would have been treated like a hero.

And no, the station manager's authority begins when the plane's in the chocks. Until then Part 91.3 applies:

Sec. 91.3

Responsibility and authority of the pilot in command.

(a) The pilot in command of an aircraft is directly responsible for, and is the final authority as to, the operation of that aircraft.

 

[JimG]

Every big airport has an FBO. And every big airport FBO has a set of stairs. If the station won't bring you some, call the FBO on unicom (I've actually done this at Gemini), and get them to bring the stairs over. This captain would have been treated like a hero.

It was an MD80 according to the article, and passengers were out walking their dogs anyway....they didn't need stairs brought to them.

 

[80drvr]

2 reasons...

1. Ops probably kept telling the crew, "it'll be just another 15 to 20 minutes".

2.The crew is getting paid by the hour. The crew probably didnt "push" for a gate too hard.

The ground stops to DFW that day were hour to hour. When you neared your expected release time, they'd update it and tack on another hour. We went through that for about 3:30 after pushback in STL and finally threw in the towel.

The big problem with an exit strategy in this situation is getting a get and a ground crew (ramp and agents) to work the off schedule aircraft. AA has cut station manning to the bone based normal operations on a CAVU day. Throw in some nasty weather and numerous diversions and the result is pretty predictable. If AA had a plan to handle this, it wasn't a very good one and it appeared to be non standard station to station. After all, winter weather isn't exactly a new unpredictable phenomenon that you can't prepare for.

In regards to pay, I don't think many crews would sit in an MD-80 cockpit for 15 hours under those conditions, paid or unpaid. The truth is that to get paid for ground time during a divert, the Capt must petition his chief pilot for the time less 20 minutes for refueling. Additionally, most crews that day pushed some FAA legality that resulted in them being unable to finish their sequence as scheduled and would lose significant time as a result.

 

[Flopgut]

I guess I started a flame war here, when all I wanted to know is how in the hell can there be a situation where someone allows a plane to sit out on the tarmac that long before even the captain gets sick and tired of waiting and does something about it.

I told my wife when I was watching the show yesterday that even the $500/ea wouldn't have been enough compensation for that.

I can understand and appreciate the deviation due to Wx, but the disregard of people out in those conditions FOR NINE HOURS is pretty thoughtless, and deserving of more than an anonymous "sorry.... and here's $500 to fly with US again".

Wait, why really did the airline owe them anything? You and I didn't get that tank of gas for $1.25 per gallon after the gulf coast storms, we had to pay more, right? Someone else was willing to pay more for it and that's the same thing here really. It was economically more important to take care of normal ops. If the customers wanted a gate quicker they should have pooled their credit cards, called AA customer service on a cell phone and offered 15 or 20 grand for quicker gate. That would have probably worked quicker than just sitting there waiting. AA is a business just like energy, money talks.

I'm exagerating of course, but I think it's a somewhat valid point. I mean everyone is safe and secure and eventually got where they needed to be. The wx was bad, that's all.

 

[NuGuy]

Heyas,

It is stuff like this, not financial shenanegans, that will eventually re-regulate the industry...

Nu

 

[8vATE]

If I have paid for a ticket, and complied with the contract of carriage, then flying is very much a right. If on the other hand, the airline has contracted to provide services, which it then does not deliver, then I am entitled to some sort of compensation for the breach of contract. .

Read the fine print in an airline's contract of carriage.

There is absolutely NO guarantee that you will arrive as scheduled. Or even on the airline you bought the ticket from.