How senior is SLC for ASA?

[ratherbeflyen]

I got an interview at ASA, just wondering if SLC is junior or senior?

 

[Willy21]

All of the people that are holding lines, hard and relief, are July 2004 or higher. There are a few new hires, I think summer 05, that are holding reserve. There have not been any new openings in SLC lately but that could change. Best of luck on the interview.

 

[ratherbeflyen]

Great info, thanks

 

[IFlyFL410]

I've been here for 3+ years, and I would barely hold a hard line out there at #53 in base. MyASA.com announced yesterday several cities are going away from SLC in Dec. or Jan, I forget which, but nontheless, SLC is being downsized already. But yes, there are newhires out there sitting reserve as well. Good Luck.

 

[Willy21]

I will believe that downsizing is happening when the displacement bid comes out. Until then the flying reduction is the same type of thing that is going on at every DCI carrier.

 

[Bluto]

If I were an ASA guy, I'd be very hesitant to move to SLC. I can't imagine why SkyWest management would want to continue paying for mx and dealing with the nuisances of such a small domicile for ASA when they could easily transfer that flying to SkyWest and drastically reduce costs. I feel bad for the ASA guys that live in SLC, but if I were a SkyWest guy based in ATL right now, I'd be getting ready to move. There are numerous rumors floating around SkyWest that ASA will be leaving SLC.

 

[WestSide]

Anybody hear where there might be a new base if SLC closes?

 

[shamrock]

Anybody hear where there might be a new base if SLC closes?

Virtual basing, DFW, BTR, and PDX.

 

[Willy21]

Good point Bluto, but Delta still calls the shots and right now they are good at making the bad decisions. I agree that I wouldn't be buying a house or getting settled in SLC if you are with ASA.

 

[Plug]

Rock and a Hard place

If I were an ASA guy, I'd be very hesitant to move to SLC. I can't imagine why SkyWest management would want to continue paying for mx and dealing with the nuisances of such a small domicile for ASA when they could easily transfer that flying to SkyWest and drastically reduce costs. I feel bad for the ASA guys that live in SLC, but if I were a SkyWest guy based in ATL right now, I'd be getting ready to move. There are numerous rumors floating around SkyWest that ASA will be leaving SLC.

Great points Bluto, but a lot of money was spent to open SLC and a lot of money would have to be spent to close SLC. Moving costs alone would be a lot! Not to mention the fact that most of the folks in SLC are from the DFW closure and would probably riot should they close SLC 1 year later. I see them keeping it open for 2 reasons: Whipsaw and Whipsaw. Skywest pilots showed unity in saying "NO" to management's most recent pay proposal and they are hoping that they ASA pilots will "cave" and those 700's or 705's or 900's will come to us. (We'll be giving them the same middle finger you did by the way!) But there hope is so they can easily put those planes in the SLC system at either ASA or SKY, whomever will do it for less. JMO though.

 

[Bluto]

I agree. If either ASA or SkyWest agreed to the lower rates, mgmt would be able to say, to the other group, "We wanted to give you guys the flying, but in order to stay cost competetive, we had to give it to the other guys. Sorry!" Sending the clear message that the pilots are now expected to buy airplanes by sacrificing compensation.

Unfortunately, though, SkyWest 70-rates are already a substantial "bargain" by management standards. With all the negotiating clout we have now, we'll be lucky to keep what we have. Though you are correct that the cost of closing the domicile and paying to move however many pilots, FA's, and mechanics back to ATL, or wherever, would have to be mitigated somehow.

 

[OCP]

The base isn't that big. Do we need 3 chief pilots out there? Each making over $115k per year? That would be a pretty good cost saving for Skywest right there.

 

[Willy21]

Only two chiefs now. BD is the big guy in ATL

 

[Jungle Prop]

While the ASA guys in SLC would be pissed off about the base being shut down, alot of us former DFW guys thought these guys acted too quickly. They shut Dallas down in 3 months, it wouldnt take but a month to close SLC, we have no infastructure there. I would not have bought a house that quickly with such a new small base. Especially after we got bent over on our houses in Dallas. I would have preferred SLC over ATL also but I dont trust this company enough to have to move twice. I think its only a matter of time before SLC shut down.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Virtual basing, DFW, BTR, and PDX.

PDX? I kind of doubt it. Not much DCI flying in and out of PDX. SKYW already has a base there doing UAX in the mighty EMB and there is a little bit of DCI flying. Wouldn't make any sense to open an ASA crew base in PDX but I guess you can't rule anything out these days. I'd look for a HNL base before PDX if I was an ASA pilot.

 

[General Lee]

Great points Bluto, but a lot of money was spent to open SLC and a lot of money would have to be spent to close SLC. Moving costs alone would be a lot! Not to mention the fact that most of the folks in SLC are from the DFW closure and would probably riot should they close SLC 1 year later. I see them keeping it open for 2 reasons: Whipsaw and Whipsaw. Skywest pilots showed unity in saying "NO" to management's most recent pay proposal and they are hoping that they ASA pilots will "cave" and those 700's or 705's or 900's will come to us. (We'll be giving them the same middle finger you did by the way!) But there hope is so they can easily put those planes in the SLC system at either ASA or SKY, whomever will do it for less. JMO though.

Are you sure about SkyWest or ASA flying the CRJ-705s or -900s for Delta? Are you sure about that? The judge questioned the Delta lawyer about that last Wednesday. Nobody knows yet who will get what. We are trying to get the 79 seaters too. It will be interesting indeed....


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Grassstrippilot]

Net loss = 0

I've been here for 3+ years, and I would barely hold a hard line out there at #53 in base. MyASA.com announced yesterday several cities are going away from SLC in Dec. or Jan, I forget which, but nontheless, SLC is being downsized already. But yes, there are newhires out there sitting reserve as well. Good Luck.

Western cities lost was 6. Cities gained = 6. Although total flying may go down. Regardless, it's nice not having to commute. However, I saw 3 domiciles open and close in 5 years at ACA on the DCI side. I, for one, refuse to plan where I live based on this job. Of course, having a good commuter clause made that doable.

 

[BlackPilot628]

Are you sure about SkyWest or ASA flying the CRJ-705s or -900s for Delta? Are you sure about that? The judge questioned the Delta lawyer about that last Wednesday. Nobody knows yet who will get what. We are trying to get the 79 seaters too. It will be interesting indeed....


Bye Bye--General Lee

I hope you guys get that flying too.
I know they pay-rates won't be that good, but at least they will stay at mainline. It will give others a opportunity to fly for a major one day with possible advancement. Good Luck.

 

[blueridge71]

Are you sure about SkyWest or ASA flying the CRJ-705s or -900s for Delta? Are you sure about that? The judge questioned the Delta lawyer about that last Wednesday. Nobody knows yet who will get what. We are trying to get the 79 seaters too. It will be interesting indeed....


Bye Bye--General Lee

It will probably be an uphill fight. I think that the time to decide that you wanted RJs at mainline was 20 years ago. Do you think that DAL pilots would be willing to work for a regional pay scale?

 

[shamrock]

PDX? I kind of doubt it. Not much DCI flying in and out of PDX. SKYW already has a base there doing UAX in the mighty EMB and there is a little bit of DCI flying. Wouldn't make any sense to open an ASA crew base in PDX but I guess you can't rule anything out these days. I'd look for a HNL base before PDX if I was an ASA pilot.

I just heard the rumor from one of our more "imaginative" pilots and thought I'd throw it out there.

I don't pay much attention to what I hear until it's in a company memo or I see it in a press release but I thought the virtual basing idea was interesting.

 

[General Lee]

It will probably be an uphill fight. I think that the time to decide that you wanted RJs at mainline was 20 years ago. Do you think that DAL pilots would be willing to work for a regional pay scale?

Absolutely. How big are RJs in your book? A 79 seater is really a 90 seater with a first class, and it is as long as an MD80 almost. And, the judge is asking the same questions for us to the Delta lawyers. If we get them, they will pay more than your 70 seaters. Something has to replace the 737-200s, and if it is 200 79 seaters, then we would like them. That makes sense, right? Anyone can get a 100 seat pay rate, but then never see the 100 seaters. We want to see the new planes, and we still have 475 furloughs on the street. You want them to come back too, right? Maybe you want them to come back to YOUR right seat while you are in the left.......


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Bluto]

General, I think everyone hopes those airplanes go to Delta. I know I do. The more major jobs there are, the better it is for everyone.

 

[rjcap]

Absolutely. How big are RJs in your book? A 79 seater is really a 90 seater with a first class, and it is as long as an MD80 almost.
Bye Bye--General Lee

Whether its configured at 79 or 90 seats its a stretch CRJ 200.

General, the CRJ 900 is an RJ with the same cramped cockpit as a CRJ 200. If you get CRJ 900's you will have come full circle back to being regional pilots at regional pay rates.

Be careful what you wish for.

 

[General Lee]

Whether its configured at 79 or 90 seats its a stretch CRJ 200.

General, the CRJ 900 is an RJ with the same cramped cockpit as a CRJ 200. If you get CRJ 900's you will have come full circle back to being regional pilots at regional pay rates.

Be careful what you wish for.

Well, I am sure we would accept those rather than furlough more. All they said is 78 or 79 seaters, and the EMB 175 carries that many, and the E190 is the next step up. You and I both know that the E175 and up are really nice (and so is the E170). I would fly those. And, I would fly left seat in the CRJ 705 if it were the only Captain position out there. (heck, I would fly a mainline CRJ705 in the right seat too, although they would have to furlough a bunch for that to happen) That is the way it goes, and I know our MEC is in favor of that---anything more than 70 seats. A lot of this is to bring back the remaining furloughs, and that is a good thing all around. Those rates will be higher than the 70 seat rates regardless.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Russ]

"Do you think that DAL pilots would be willing to work for a regional pay scale?"

I'll ask the next furloughed United guy in the right seat of the RJ I fly with.
The larger iterations should remain at mainline.

 

[Erlanger]

There are two 705s sitting in the Skywest Tucson hangar. If you don't believe me check it out for yourself.

 

[Mookie]

Genral,

When is your Md-88 upgrade class? Shouldn't you be studdying for that yet?

Mookie

ERlanger,

Whose 705's are those in Tuscon. my fo the other day told me about those, but didn't know if they were ours or not.

 

[SPDBRD747400]

There are two 705s sitting in the Skywest Tucson hangar. If you don't believe me check it out for yourself.

That means nothing, they could be there for someone else like Air Canada Jazz.

 

[blueridge71]

Absolutely. How big are RJs in your book? A 79 seater is really a 90 seater with a first class, and it is as long as an MD80 almost. And, the judge is asking the same questions for us to the Delta lawyers. If we get them, they will pay more than your 70 seaters. Something has to replace the 737-200s, and if it is 200 79 seaters, then we would like them. That makes sense, right? Anyone can get a 100 seat pay rate, but then never see the 100 seaters. We want to see the new planes, and we still have 475 furloughs on the street. You want them to come back too, right? Maybe you want them to come back to YOUR right seat while you are in the left.......


Bye Bye--General Lee

These days RJ is a very loose term. A "regional jet" can fly from the east coast to Kansas or Colorado, making the "region" basically North America. As to seats, the Embraer 190 seats 98 and that is still considered a regional jet. Numerous carriers are flying 70 seat RJs.

My point was this. According to airlinepilotcentral.com, a 3 year DAL FO on the MD80 or 737 makes around $90 per hour. Contrast that to the approximately $40 per hour that a CRJ 700 FO makes at ASA. Add to the mix that the mainline pilot gets a pension, more days off, shorter work days and you get a lopsided cost advantage for the regional side. Is that good? Heck no, but it's reality.

The regional genie is out of the bottle and it will be extremely hard to put it back in, especially with the parent company in bankruptcy. IMHO the time to fight this fight was 20 years ago when RJs first started appearing, but we can't turn back the clock.

I feel for your furloughed pilots, since I am also a furloughee. However, I know of very few mainline furloughees who chose to go back to the regionals. Most choose to go into outside businesses instead. If a furloughee doesn't want to take a 50% paycut, why would someone want to take that big a cut to keep working? Some would, but my guess is that more would not.

I hope that you are correct because that will mean good times ahead for both of us. If the mainline is healthy, then the regionals will have plenty of flying and regional pilots will have plenty of chances to upgrade. However, I would be surprised to see DALPA take anything close to what regional pilots would find attractive.

 

[Bluto]

Actually the EMB-170/190 family was carefully not marketed as an "RJ". I think Embraer saw the writing on the wall in terms of customer dissatisfaction and economic short-falls of the RJ and avoided that moniker, though many media sources use that term in error when referencing these aircraft.