How Northwest took over Delta

[General Lee]

So GL - how equal are things really? Common, I know you're all into the always positive for Mother D spin and all, and I respect that, but were you out on extended sick leave from eating bad food at one of those swinging 5 star African resorts when 4Q financials came out?

Delta - 1.4B 4Q loss, 340 M operating loss or 50c/share, much worse than analyst forecast of 34c/share.

SWA - 56M 4Q loss, 61M operating profit or 8c/share, beating analyst forecast or 5c/share.

I'm those facts are quite easily reformatted in the GL spin machine though ...

Ben,

Don't tell me you haven't seen a major shift in profitability here...... Your hedge advantage--GONE. Your FIXED COSTS--(employee costs, airplane costs etc) UP. Your consequtive quarterly profits---GONE. Come on now. Yes, when we lose money over here it generally is a LARGER number than yours, but then again we have a lot more money in the bank than you do. I hope we don't lose it all, but we do have costs with merging airlines (you may have those same costs someday too), and we also had a bad experience with some hedges (like you). Our hedge problem goes away as this year progresses, but your whole deal was to have the hedge advantage and prey on other airlines with lower cost tickets when we were struggling with higher fuel. That advantage is GONE. Time for a rematch.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

So, Zero guys at Delta are getting the PBGC guarantee? PBGC guarantee is how much? And what % of NWA pilots have a frozen pension that exceeds the PBGC guarantee? And you got Nothing from DAL for terminating the A-Plan?

Maybe you're Still not talkin slow enough.

Yes, we did get compensated for the loss of our plan, and it was TAXED. What wasn't put into the 06 and 07 401K kettle was taxed at a high rate. And what about those 401Ks? How are they doing these days? I think we would rather of had a monthly check--even a frozen pension. But, we did save our work rules, which you have now too. So, to sum it up, you still have some sort of frozen pension, our work rules, and higher pay. You're welcome. Welcome to LGA.

Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[DTW320]

Yes, we did get compensated for the loss of our plan, and it was TAXED. What wasn't put into the 06 and 07 401K kettle was taxed at a high rate. And what about those 401Ks? How are they doing these days? I think we would rather of had a monthly check--even a frozen pension. But, we did save our work rules, which you have now too. So, to sum it up, you still have some sort of frozen pension, our work rules, and higher pay. You're welcome. Welcome to LGA.

Bye Bye---General Lee

Ahhh.....So..it's NOT true that ZERO Dal guys have at least $1785 month....but then again, YOU did not answer the question about PGBC guarantee did you? You're talking about the pension note.

BTW, my 401k has been in cash for some time now and is doing just fine through all of this. If yours is not, whose fault is that?

Oh, and I would thank you for the work rules if I had them, such as the trip rig that was never intended to be BP5, AND if you had anything to do with me getting them. Since I don't, and you didn't.....

Anyway, happy to be here, even though I'm 10 pounds heavier after picking up my Bag-O-Bling for the Russian zoot suit today.

LGA? Don't get it.

 

[crj567]

read the 8K. You will see a lot different picture.
6.1 BILLION in unrestricted cash to start with.

We will also post horrible numbers next week. Look at the 8K once again.

About 1.221. billion pre tax profit for 09. Base on only a 10% drop in revenue.

Pre-Tax Profit?

Ever take an accounting class? If so, then you know that pre-tax means nothing. Besides, when DAL misses that estimate, the stock will be punished. You can already pick up a share for less than a happy meal. It is gonna look like a steal when it costs less than a gumball. What was the IPO price $20 or so? Happy days-indeed.

What do you really think the 2009 bottom line will look like? Do you think it will beat SWA? If so, you need to seek counseling.

Consider how those INTL routes (which DAL doubled-down on) are tanking very hard right now... There is no way those routes will contribute anything to the bottom line until this recession is over (which will be well after the next election.) Now-who do you think will do worse? SWA or DAL?

Heavy exposure to INTL means heavy expense in exchange for expectations of heavy loads and the associated revenue. At least SWA was smart enough to extend their exposure only to a code-share. Both Europe and Asia are cratering in epic manner, domestic looks bad, but certainly better than INTL now.

There is no question INTL is far more expensive than domestic-a year or two ago, it looked more profitable, but that ain't so anymore.

-Keep whisting past the graveyard..... Check out that canary in the coal mine-looks a little feeble, don't he? Those rose-colored glasses you are sharing with the General will not change the facts.

-Fact is, you are now run by morons-they put too many eggs in the INTL basket, and now they think they can gain ground by destroying AirTran.
-Fact is, these fools on DAL's board are taking a baseball bat to a hornet's nest, and every single one of them on the board will be set for life.
-Fact is every employee at DAL better be worried, because SWA is coming, and no matter what you misinterpret some 8-K to read, SWA will come in and wax your ass.

 

[General Lee]

Ahhh.....So..it's NOT true that ZERO Dal guys have at least $1785 month....but then again, YOU did not answer the question about PGBC guarantee did you? You're talking about the pension note.

BTW, my 401k has been in cash for some time now and is doing just fine through all of this. If yours is not, whose fault is that?

Oh, and I would thank you for the work rules if I had them, such as the trip rig that was never intended to be BP5, AND if you had anything to do with me getting them. Since I don't, and you didn't.....

Anyway, happy to be here, even though I'm 10 pounds heavier after picking up my Bag-O-Bling for the Russian zoot suit today.]



Sounds like you are the next KRAMER from CNBC. Good for you then. I am still in it for the "long term" as Obama says, so it hopefully will all equal out in the end. I did fill my 401K to the max for 06-08, so we'll see how that all pans out.

And, somehow you will be helped out by some of our work rules, like 2 Captains and 2 FOs for ULH flying. We are still getting more widebodies, so you might see that benefit someday.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Pre-Tax Profit?

Ever take an accounting class? If so, then you know that pre-tax means nothing. Besides, when DAL misses that estimate, the stock will be punished. You can already pick up a share for less than a happy meal. It is gonna look like a steal when it costs less than a gumball. What was the IPO price $20 or so? Happy days-indeed.

What do you really think the 2009 bottom line will look like? Do you think it will beat SWA? If so, you need to seek counseling.

Consider how those INTL routes (which DAL doubled-down on) are tanking very hard right now... There is no way those routes will contribute anything to the bottom line until this recession is over (which will be well after the next election.) Now-who do you think will do worse? SWA or DAL?

Heavy exposure to INTL means heavy expense in exchange for expectations of heavy loads and the associated revenue. At least SWA was smart enough to extend their exposure only to a code-share. Both Europe and Asia are cratering in epic manner, domestic looks bad, but certainly better than INTL now.

There is no question INTL is far more expensive than domestic-a year or two ago, it looked more profitable, but that ain't so anymore.

-Keep whisting past the graveyard..... Check out that canary in the coal mine-looks a little feeble, don't he? Those rose-colored glasses you are sharing with the General will not change the facts.

-Fact is, you are now run by morons-they put too many eggs in the INTL basket, and now they think they can gain ground by destroying AirTran.
-Fact is, these fools on DAL's board are taking a baseball bat to a hornet's nest, and every single one of them on the board will be set for life.
-Fact is every employee at DAL better be worried, because SWA is coming, and no matter what you misinterpret some 8-K to read, SWA will come in and wax your ass.

With all of this terrible news coming up, how does it make you feel to work for one of our feeders? You must be pooping your pants daily....

As far as Southwest coming, well, there aint a lot of room to expand at ATL. Even if we gave up NWA's old gates at ATL, there wouldn't be much room to compete. Sure, they could add some flights, but with their lack of a fuel hedge advantage, they would probably charge about the same fares. Now if they add nonstops to Lubbock, Midland, and Harlingen, well, we would lose on those routes.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[crj567]

With all of this terrible news coming up, how does it make you feel to work for one of our feeders? You must be pooping your pants daily....

As far as Southwest coming, well, there aint a lot of room to expand at ATL. Even if we gave up NWA's old gates at ATL, there wouldn't be much room to compete. Sure, they could add some flights, but with their lack of a fuel hedge advantage, they would probably charge about the same fares. Now if they add nonstops to Lubbock, Midland, and Harlingen, well, we would lose on those routes.


Bye Bye--General Lee

I suffer no illusions on this one, General... I can find another job, but you should be very concerned about your own well-being.... I have never defined my self worth by my job, and honestly, I think that is one of the saddest things anyone could ever do.

For someone who gets up and toots his own horn all day long and attempts to denegrate everyone and everything that is not Delta Air Lines-you should really prepare.

This is gonna be a tough ride for everyone in an airplane. Obama will wreck our economy, and the survivors will be the ones with the most staying power. In this game, staying power is known as money-and SWA has a lot. DAL does not, especially as fast as those famous INTL routes are burning through the cash.

You better get some perspective, General. Without that big plane and penguin suit, you are going to be in for one hell of an adjustment.

-Don't say you weren't warned, oh master of the fleet.

 

[General Lee]

I suffer no illusions on this one, General... I can find another job, but you should be very concerned about your own well-being.... I have never defined my self worth by my job, and honestly, I think that is one of the saddest things anyone could ever do.

For someone who gets up and toots his own horn all day long and attempts to denegrate everyone and everything that is not Delta Air Lines-you should really prepare.

This is gonna be a tough ride for everyone in an airplane. Obama will wreck our economy, and the survivors will be the ones with the most staying power. In this game, staying power is known as money-and SWA has a lot. DAL does not, especially as fast as those famous INTL routes are burning through the cash.

You better get some perspective, General. Without that big plane and penguin suit, you are going to be in for one hell of an adjustment.

-Don't say you weren't warned, oh master of the fleet.

Sure you can find another job, McD's is around the corner for you. You may not think a flying job defines you, but being a fry cook will "land you the ladies..."

You really think Delta is doomed? Wait, Obama is dooming us? Thanks Rush Limbaugh. This slump in the economy started on Bush's watch. Are you nuts? (sorry, let me retract that since we all already know the answer) I am not saying Delta could NEVER go away, but I think we are in better shape and have more money on hand than anyone else. We have the best routes with the most variety, a vast fleet with different types of planes for flexibility, and we have both been through Chap 11 recently, cleaning out the cobb webs and at least one airline's pilot pension, which unfortunately was lost during the BK process. All of that is cleaned out, along with expensive leases, expensive gates, and other one time charges. I think most anal-cysts out there think you are wrong, and think DL and CAL are probably the best positioned Legacies, with Southwest being the best positioned LCC. Those are two different things, with different missions, and if you think INTL traffic will slump for decades (and domestic only will not??), then you are wrong. Oh wait, Southwest has a HUGE codeshare with Westjet (they go to less than 10 common cities with Southwest) and Volaris (a newcomer to the Mexican LCCs, and still doesn't even go to a US city). Wow, we better hurry up and change all of our plans.....

You need to realize that you are out matched here. Your proficies of the future are way out of line with what almost everyone else "in the business" thinks. Recent stock slumps are common at all the airlines, not just DL, and just take a look at the cargo carriers. Well wait a minute, how about you raise the fries out of the vat of oil first.....and say hi to Sean Hanity for me too...


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[ACL65PILOT]

I am just posting the published facts.

I am glad to see that we will have a profitable year. Our loads are better than expected. A few more services are going to be by a fee now, so we will be generating more revenue. That is all good news to us Supreme Sub Commanders.

 

[crj567]

I am just posting the published facts.

I am glad to see that we will have a profitable year. Our loads are better than expected. A few more services are going to be by a fee now, so we will be generating more revenue. That is all good news to us Supreme Sub Commanders.

You still think that a pre-tax profit is a real profit? How much do you think a company that size might pay in taxes?

Dang.....

-That sub might have a bit bigger leak than you think.

 

[Schwanker]

-Fact is every employee at DAL better be worried, because SWA is coming, and no matter what you misinterpret some 8-K to read, SWA will come in and wax your ass.

Now I'm getting excited!!!! I never knew switching to the Russian uniform would come with these fringe bennies!!!
Schwanker

 

[crj567]

Now I'm getting excited!!!! I never knew switching to the Russian uniform would come with these fringe bennies!!!
Schwanker

Now that's a good sense of humor-

-I like the cut of your jib.

 

[johnsonrod]

Now that's a good sense of humor-

-I like the cut of your jib.

Could you cut us some McRib sandwiches? (that was for you G. Lee)

 

[ACL65PILOT]

You still think that a pre-tax profit is a real profit? How much do you think a company that size might pay in taxes?

Dang.....

-That sub might have a bit bigger leak than you think.

Operational pretax profit is not overall profit. :laugh:

We will have a ton of one time expenditures with the merger and what not to mitigate most of our tax burden.

 

[dtfl]

Now I'm getting excited!!!! I never knew switching to the Russian uniform would come with these fringe bennies!!!
Schwanker

Well if yall are going to make fun of your new threads..yall should get the jokes correct.

GERMAN..not Russian..

http://www.theuboatsociety.com/uniformrequirements.html

 

[scarlet]

yeah a manager at MCDs. makes more than the first and second year F.O.s at most airlines= SAD!!

How any airline can loss Billions every quarter for years on in, and STILL in business? It is all about cooking the books. Just like the banks. Just like the car makers. BUT it wil all catch up one day!

Obama=biggest JOKE of all time. You people fell for that. over 8000 pork projects in the budget?? what 125 million to a lab in Iowa to research the smell of the air.??? That is real smart. Did some Delta Management folks go to DC? He is a politician/Liar!!
He just fooled 54% of Americans. I believe the troops are to be home in 12 months...that is what he promised?

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Now that's a good sense of humor-

-I like the cut of your jib.

That's great. Now can you get back to making the fries. There's a long line of people waiting junior.

 

[clippyrip]

Obama=biggest JOKE of all time. You people fell for that. over 8000 pork projects in the budget?? what 125 million to a lab in Iowa to research the smell of the air.??? That is real smart. Did some Delta Management folks go to DC? He is a politician/Liar!!
He just fooled 54% of Americans. I believe the troops are to be home in 12 months...that is what he promised?

Its better to keep your mouth shut and be thought of as a clown than to open your mouth and prove it.

 

[crj567]

Its better to keep your mouth shut and be thought of as a clown than to open your mouth and prove it.

You are correct, sir. Obama has proven that he is quite the clown.... A scary sort of clown (one that literally utters "uh, umm, ahh" every third or forth word,) but a clown, nonetheless....

-A marxist clown is still a clown-he steals all the candy and "redistributes" it... You see-spreading the candy around is "just good for everyone" (as long as you have enough damn candy.)

-Judging by his effect on the economy so far, Obama's candy collection is looking pretty sparse. Can't blame this havoc on Bush anymore-Obama's gonna own this mess.

-I guess General Lee will just have to settle for a lousy Blow-Pop.... Ironic.

 

[Griswold]

You are correct, sir. Obama has proven that he is quite the clown.... A scary sort of clown (one that literally utters "uh, umm, ahh" every third or forth word,) but a clown, nonetheless....

-A marxist clown is still a clown-he steals all the candy and "redistributes" it... You see-spreading the candy around is "just good for everyone" (as long as you have enough damn candy.)

-Judging by his effect on the economy so far, Obama's candy collection is looking pretty sparse. Can't blame this havoc on Bush anymore-Obama's gonna own this mess.

-I guess General Lee will just have to settle for a lousy Blow-Pop.... Ironic.

Obama has only been in office for 2 months. Can't blame it on Bush, his whole job is to fix what Bush did.

 

[BLUE BAYOU]

Sure you can find another job, McD's is around the corner for you. You may not think a flying job defines you, but being a fry cook will "land you the ladies..."

You really think Delta is doomed? Wait, Obama is dooming us? Thanks Rush Limbaugh. This slump in the economy started on Bush's watch. Are you nuts? (sorry, let me retract that since we all already know the answer) I am not saying Delta could NEVER go away, but I think we are in better shape and have more money on hand than anyone else. We have the best routes with the most variety, a vast fleet with different types of planes for flexibility, and we have both been through Chap 11 recently, cleaning out the cobb webs and at least one airline's pilot pension, which unfortunately was lost during the BK process. All of that is cleaned out, along with expensive leases, expensive gates, and other one time charges. I think most anal-cysts out there think you are wrong, and think DL and CAL are probably the best positioned Legacies, with Southwest being the best positioned LCC. Those are two different things, with different missions, and if you think INTL traffic will slump for decades (and domestic only will not??), then you are wrong. Oh wait, Southwest has a HUGE codeshare with Westjet (they go to less than 10 common cities with Southwest) and Volaris (a newcomer to the Mexican LCCs, and still doesn't even go to a US city). Wow, we better hurry up and change all of our plans.....

You need to realize that you are out matched here. Your proficies of the future are way out of line with what almost everyone else "in the business" thinks. Recent stock slumps are common at all the airlines, not just DL, and just take a look at the cargo carriers. Well wait a minute, how about you raise the fries out of the vat of oil first.....and say hi to Sean Hanity for me too...


Bye Bye--General Lee

Actually, this financial mess started under the Clinton Administration for making housing loans feasible for those who shouldn't own homes...

Don't be worried by the General, folks. He's really just a 13 year old kid with a big, big heart for Delta and the Dukes of Hazard. Y'all should look at some of his posts on how SONG was going to put the lights out of Jetblue, or how the international flying was going to reap DAL millions-- well, a Bankruptcy and Merger later, things are looking up again for the Big Delta. I wish you the very best of luck.

So, General, time to go to bed, you've got school tomorrow!

 

[BLUE BAYOU]

Obama has only been in office for 2 months. Can't blame it on Bush, his whole job is to fix what Bush did.

It's an interesting world we live in. When oil was near $150/bbl the likes of Putin, Chavez and Ahmadinejad were looking like kings, they could do no wrong and were out-- wielding the power of money; and winning the hearts and minds of the poor countrymen seeking their "share" of the wealth.

Now, President Obama follows in the path of appeasing these currently weaker individuals-- the countries of Russia, Venezuela, and Iran are in turmoil with 20%+ inflation, dropping oil revenues, and a much more agitated public support. It's very similar to how Wall Street is reacting to Obama-- NO CONFIDENCE... People are selling out to save themselves because they know what's coming-- higher taxes, a redistribution of wealth...

In the end, Obama got voted into office on the pretense of a real Liberal Democrat, giving to the poor-- well, guess what, nothing is adding up in the stimulus package and, most people aren't that dumb Mr. President. When you announce all those programs without a realistic pricetag; who's paying for their free ride? Not me.

 

[crj567]

Obama has only been in office for 2 months. Can't blame it on Bush, his whole job is to fix what Bush did.

Interesting Freudian slip, there champ.....

-Can't blame it on Bush indeed. Remember when Bush tried several times to reform Fannie and Freddie, and he couldn't get anywhere because of idiots like Barney Frank and Chris Dodd-who run powerful house and senate banking and finance committees. I guess you must not read the papers much.

Obama's abilty to "fix" things is indeed impressive. The Dow is now almost 2,000 points lower than the day the man took office (a little over a month ago,) and he has done nothing but bash every aspect of business-he still apparently does not realize that his rhetoric has consequences (if you doubt this, just check out your next 401K statement.) Every time Obama or one of his idiot officials makes a speech, markets around the world nosedive.

-That clown will make sure our country is completely bankrupt before he leaves office.

 

[Flyprdu]

Interesting Freudian slip, there champ.....

-Can't blame it on Bush indeed. Remember when Bush tried several times to reform Fannie and Freddie, and he couldn't get anywhere because of idiots like Barney Frank and Chris Dodd-who run powerful house and senate banking and finance committees. I guess you must not read the papers much.

Obama's abilty to "fix" things is indeed impressive. The Dow is now almost 2,000 points lower than the day the man took office (a little over a month ago,) and he has done nothing but bash every aspect of business-he still apparently does not realize that his rhetoric has consequences (if you doubt this, just check out your next 401K statement.) Every time Obama or one of his idiot officials makes a speech, markets around the world nosedive.

-That clown will make sure our country is completely bankrupt before he leaves office.

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You're an idiot.

 

[QOL_is_great:)]

Ur Rite!!!

Excellent article.....

I have been telling people this would happen since the meger was first speculated on. DAL is gone now, and this new airline (800 lb gorilla) will work hard to piss off customers and passengers alike. They have done that with charging extra for a window seat, isle seat and EVERY piece of checked luggage. Not to mention the rule change in a pax using their mileage account. It is truly a shame. DAL used to be a great company.

The new DAL (NWA) still has absolutely no idea how the traveling public thinks-there is no brand loalty anymore. Hit that one on the head. Just listen to people talk in the airports. You piss enough people off, and they will give you a collective kick to the nuts. Many here scoffed my past assertions which were all validated by this article.

Let me be clear in what I am asserting now: DAL (NWA) will now try and destroy AirTran. If they succeed, DAL will get SWA into Atlanta faster than you can drop a hot coal. That would be a match to watch. I'd have to pull out a chair, popcorn and a Coke (support the hometown drink) and enjoy the show. At that point, DAL (NWA) will get the living hell kicked out of it, and will soon be bankrupt again. -Doubt me again? Go ahead if you wish-Gen., but time will prove me correct again.

I think it's great how the author ended the article. General Lee better watch his pompus butt. Apparently, he doesn't understand how big a bunch of scumbags used to run NWA. That brass ring the General has been chasing will suddenly morph into brass knuckes, indeed......

-Turn the other cheek, Gen.... Steenland's got a little somthin' fo' yo' punk ass!

The crews on NorDelta are still giving a service with a smile. I don't fault them at all. They just keep doing their jobs. Thanks! I hope it all works out and maybe the leadership riding upon that high horse falls and never gets back on. Only time will tell if this turns into another TransAmericanWorld mess. I hope it doesn't because it would be another black eye on the industry (TWA/AAL first one) and it's the only eye left.
Left out the Airways/America West deal since that is turning into something like a Big Redneck Wedding.

 

[Speedbird34]

yeah a manager at MCDs. makes more than the first and second year F.O.s at most airlines= SAD!!

How any airline can loss Billions every quarter for years on in, and STILL in business? It is all about cooking the books. Just like the banks. Just like the car makers. BUT it wil all catch up one day!

Obama=biggest JOKE of all time. You people fell for that. over 8000 pork projects in the budget?? what 125 million to a lab in Iowa to research the smell of the air.??? That is real smart. Did some Delta Management folks go to DC? He is a politician/Liar!!
He just fooled 54% of Americans. I believe the troops are to be home in 12 months...that is what he promised?

I am happy to see a worm like you writhing, barking, cringing in your hole. Scum like you who seek to distroy the USA deserve to be in misery. You lost thank God. May your evil follow you to the gates of hell were you will no doubt one day meet your master the devil. What a scumbag

 

[Speedbird34]

Interesting Freudian slip, there champ.....

-Can't blame it on Bush indeed. Remember when Bush tried several times to reform Fannie and Freddie, and he couldn't get anywhere because of idiots like Barney Frank and Chris Dodd-who run powerful house and senate banking and finance committees. I guess you must not read the papers much.

Obama's abilty to "fix" things is indeed impressive. The Dow is now almost 2,000 points lower than the day the man took office (a little over a month ago,) and he has done nothing but bash every aspect of business-he still apparently does not realize that his rhetoric has consequences (if you doubt this, just check out your next 401K statement.) Every time Obama or one of his idiot officials makes a speech, markets around the world nosedive.

-That clown will make sure our country is completely bankrupt before he leaves office.

It is President Obama to you scumbag. Show some respect to the will of the American people. But what does a retarded unpatroitic racist like you know about citizenship. Your dumbass wandered into it. Brainwashed from birth into your stupidity with your only acievement that you managed to learn to fly an airplane.
An Idoit like you who does not have the ability to inspire a collection of scum like yourself much less any group of decent men and women dares to call the President of the United States a clown. The joke is on you clown.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Speedbird.
Don't hold back, just tell it how it is!

 

[767/757]

-Judging by his effect on the economy so far, Obama's candy collection is looking pretty sparse. Can't blame this havoc on Bush anymore-Obama's gonna own this mess.

Please - take a step away from Rush, Fox, or Drudge and do some independent research. 2 month to fix 8 years of greed and corruption...not going to happen that fast.

 

[767/757]

Actually, this financial mess started under the Clinton Administration for making housing loans feasible for those who shouldn't own homes...

No, it goes back further to the failure of Reaganomics. This mess started when banks stopped doing mortgages. It has more to do with packaging toxic paper as a tradeable fund with a high beta then with giving loans to people that were unable to afford the said load. If there was no market for subprime loans, the loans would not have been made.