Clownpilot
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- Nov 27, 2001
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How is this Fair!!!!!!
- Thread starter Lifestyle
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Caveman
Grandpa
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Albie15,
Nice speech but lay off the Kool-Aid dude. This is nothing more than the FFJC (Former Fighter Jock Club) taking care of their own and the patriotic spin isn't going to convince me otherwise. Every post I read on this board about the guard/reserve is more about how to get a slot and garner some income while on furlough than it is about 'defending freedom'.
UAL is being unfair about this. A pilot is a pilot is a pilot. I'm surprised that ALPA hasn't made a stink about this inequity. Either everyone rides or no one rides.
Nice speech but lay off the Kool-Aid dude. This is nothing more than the FFJC (Former Fighter Jock Club) taking care of their own and the patriotic spin isn't going to convince me otherwise. Every post I read on this board about the guard/reserve is more about how to get a slot and garner some income while on furlough than it is about 'defending freedom'.
UAL is being unfair about this. A pilot is a pilot is a pilot. I'm surprised that ALPA hasn't made a stink about this inequity. Either everyone rides or no one rides.
Simon Says
New Airbus Regional Jet
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2001
- Posts
- 1,036
AlbieF15,
I just want to stand up and sing "I am proud to be an American". Get real. Quit trying to toot your own horn Mr. Nobleman. I thought Noblemen don't use the term "Crybaby"
If you think you are special because you fight for this country you are standing in a very long line. You are no better than any other human being from the local bum that hangs out on the RR tracks to the President of the United States. Stand Down Sir.
I just want to stand up and sing "I am proud to be an American". Get real. Quit trying to toot your own horn Mr. Nobleman. I thought Noblemen don't use the term "Crybaby"
If you think you are special because you fight for this country you are standing in a very long line. You are no better than any other human being from the local bum that hangs out on the RR tracks to the President of the United States. Stand Down Sir.
skiddriver
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 27, 2001
- Posts
- 405
Ninepilot,
Actually, no. The regs prohibit providing money/tickets for travel to regular drills and ATP's. The only ticket that they are supposed to buy for you is the travel to annual training. That's why a lot of sites have multi-site pickup with transport A/C for regular drills.
Congress tried to vote in some relief on this issue last year in the form of a tax break or a direct stipend (around $50), never heard how it worked out.
And you know, before my last tour here as the active duty Marine site commander at a Joint Reserve Base, I used to think that the Guard/Reserve was the FFJC. You know what? I was wrong. Reserve pilots from my site regularly expend more funds than they make when they come in to drill (and I'm not talking lost wages here, I'm talking transportation - lodging - meal expenses exceeding military pay earned). Why would they do such a thing? Why would they lose money and spend time away from their families when they didn't have to? Maybe even get fully mobilized and go get shot at. Boy, it just doesn't make sense does it?
All the units here have been supporting real world ops. We just mobilized one AF res flying unit and deployed them to theater (public knowledge so no security breach posting it here). In the last couple of years I've been here, these guys have been doing Northern Watch, Southern Watch, JTF support, theater support and some other stuff best left out in this forum. Mucho time OConus and in country mobilization.
I'm sure ALPA can find a way to get this special treatment for those lazy weekend warriors turned off. Why don't you file a grievance?
Actually, no. The regs prohibit providing money/tickets for travel to regular drills and ATP's. The only ticket that they are supposed to buy for you is the travel to annual training. That's why a lot of sites have multi-site pickup with transport A/C for regular drills.
Congress tried to vote in some relief on this issue last year in the form of a tax break or a direct stipend (around $50), never heard how it worked out.
And you know, before my last tour here as the active duty Marine site commander at a Joint Reserve Base, I used to think that the Guard/Reserve was the FFJC. You know what? I was wrong. Reserve pilots from my site regularly expend more funds than they make when they come in to drill (and I'm not talking lost wages here, I'm talking transportation - lodging - meal expenses exceeding military pay earned). Why would they do such a thing? Why would they lose money and spend time away from their families when they didn't have to? Maybe even get fully mobilized and go get shot at. Boy, it just doesn't make sense does it?
All the units here have been supporting real world ops. We just mobilized one AF res flying unit and deployed them to theater (public knowledge so no security breach posting it here). In the last couple of years I've been here, these guys have been doing Northern Watch, Southern Watch, JTF support, theater support and some other stuff best left out in this forum. Mucho time OConus and in country mobilization.
I'm sure ALPA can find a way to get this special treatment for those lazy weekend warriors turned off. Why don't you file a grievance?
Clownpilot
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 27, 2001
- Posts
- 166
OKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK
Well, this is obviously just a way for the civilian guys to vent since this really benefits the military guys in no way other than letting them get to their units to drill. Reserve squadrons will ONLY buy tickets to and from duty stations for annual drill periods, not for regular drills. These guys are NOT going on vacation, to see family, or just getting free travel. If they happen to live near their reserve units they don't need this and CAN'T go anywhere. They are allowed to travel to/from ONE place and back. Forget the patriotism crap. Many of the furloughed pilots are counting on their reserve income to tide them over while they are waiting to get their jobs back at the airline. Apparently, you'd rather see them have to buy tickets to get there, when they can least afford them, or lose that income because they can't get to their units. That's a pretty messed up attitude. You might be angry that you're furloughed and want to take it out on somebody, but this issue doesn't seem unreasonable to me and I support the airline's position and am grateful that they have taken it. I don't drill in the reserves, but if that were my only source of income right now I'd be very happy if I had a way to get to that job.
What a bunch of bitter crybabies. Sickening.
Well, this is obviously just a way for the civilian guys to vent since this really benefits the military guys in no way other than letting them get to their units to drill. Reserve squadrons will ONLY buy tickets to and from duty stations for annual drill periods, not for regular drills. These guys are NOT going on vacation, to see family, or just getting free travel. If they happen to live near their reserve units they don't need this and CAN'T go anywhere. They are allowed to travel to/from ONE place and back. Forget the patriotism crap. Many of the furloughed pilots are counting on their reserve income to tide them over while they are waiting to get their jobs back at the airline. Apparently, you'd rather see them have to buy tickets to get there, when they can least afford them, or lose that income because they can't get to their units. That's a pretty messed up attitude. You might be angry that you're furloughed and want to take it out on somebody, but this issue doesn't seem unreasonable to me and I support the airline's position and am grateful that they have taken it. I don't drill in the reserves, but if that were my only source of income right now I'd be very happy if I had a way to get to that job.
What a bunch of bitter crybabies. Sickening.
Clownpilot
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 27, 2001
- Posts
- 166
??????????
If you get another job flying then you get your travel back with that company. These guys have had their ability to get to their reserve jobs removed and could lose 2 jobs for the price of one when their furlough happens. Pretty sad to lose both your jobs because you lose one. You are talking about getting a NEW job and using your old company to get to your new one. Try this. Take a job you can get to. Now if you already worked that job and were being cut off by your furlough then maybe you'd have a point. Otherwise, it's just more civilian pilot inferiority rearing it's ugly head.
If you get another job flying then you get your travel back with that company. These guys have had their ability to get to their reserve jobs removed and could lose 2 jobs for the price of one when their furlough happens. Pretty sad to lose both your jobs because you lose one. You are talking about getting a NEW job and using your old company to get to your new one. Try this. Take a job you can get to. Now if you already worked that job and were being cut off by your furlough then maybe you'd have a point. Otherwise, it's just more civilian pilot inferiority rearing it's ugly head.
Lifestyle said:
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Clownpilot
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 27, 2001
- Posts
- 166
Fine
I wil absolutely, completely support your right to ride back and forth with me to and from my reserve unit no matter how remote and ridiculous that may be. Just ride back and forth all day long and hopefully that will make you happy. I hope you really like the remote regions of eastern PA since that's where you're going...................you imbecile.
I wil absolutely, completely support your right to ride back and forth with me to and from my reserve unit no matter how remote and ridiculous that may be. Just ride back and forth all day long and hopefully that will make you happy. I hope you really like the remote regions of eastern PA since that's where you're going...................you imbecile.
Caveman said:
Caveman
Grandpa
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2001
- Posts
- 1,580
I don't have a problem with UAL allowing furloughed pilots to keep pass benefits. In fact I think it's a good idea. I do think it's unfair to say that only the military pilots can have them and I think it's disingenuous to say it's for patriotic reasons when it clearly isn't. Furloughed civilian pilots may also have to travel to get to work. I don't want the military guys to lose the priviledge, I just think it should be offered to all the furloughed UAL pilots.
Mike,
For the last time, I'm a retired Marine. 20+ years. I earned it and I'm going to proudly display it. Get over it.
SkidDriver,
I agree with you on a couple of points. My last tour was with an I&I Staff. Initially I had the typical active duty negative attitude towards the reserves. It took me about 2 drill weekends to change my mind. In the Marine Corps reservists are expected to complete all the annual training that the regular Marine Corps does and they only have 11 weekends and one 2 week period to get it all done. They are also expected to be as proficient in all these areas as their active duty counterparts. They essentially don't have a single day off the first half of every month because they work all week, drill that weekend, and then work all the next week until their first day off. Anybody in any type of leadership position in the reserve unit also puts in many hours of 'off duty' time to prepare for the drill weekend. I am a big convert and big fan of the Marine Corps Reserve community and they are essential to our county's defense. One correction, reservists do not pay for their own lodging while drilling if they live outside the area. BTW, congrats on being hired at Comair.
Mike,
For the last time, I'm a retired Marine. 20+ years. I earned it and I'm going to proudly display it. Get over it.
SkidDriver,
I agree with you on a couple of points. My last tour was with an I&I Staff. Initially I had the typical active duty negative attitude towards the reserves. It took me about 2 drill weekends to change my mind. In the Marine Corps reservists are expected to complete all the annual training that the regular Marine Corps does and they only have 11 weekends and one 2 week period to get it all done. They are also expected to be as proficient in all these areas as their active duty counterparts. They essentially don't have a single day off the first half of every month because they work all week, drill that weekend, and then work all the next week until their first day off. Anybody in any type of leadership position in the reserve unit also puts in many hours of 'off duty' time to prepare for the drill weekend. I am a big convert and big fan of the Marine Corps Reserve community and they are essential to our county's defense. One correction, reservists do not pay for their own lodging while drilling if they live outside the area. BTW, congrats on being hired at Comair.
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