How is this Fair!!!!!!

[skiddriver]

Ninepilot,

Actually, no. The regs prohibit providing money/tickets for travel to regular drills and ATP's. The only ticket that they are supposed to buy for you is the travel to annual training. That's why a lot of sites have multi-site pickup with transport A/C for regular drills.

Congress tried to vote in some relief on this issue last year in the form of a tax break or a direct stipend (around $50), never heard how it worked out.

And you know, before my last tour here as the active duty Marine site commander at a Joint Reserve Base, I used to think that the Guard/Reserve was the FFJC. You know what? I was wrong. Reserve pilots from my site regularly expend more funds than they make when they come in to drill (and I'm not talking lost wages here, I'm talking transportation - lodging - meal expenses exceeding military pay earned). Why would they do such a thing? Why would they lose money and spend time away from their families when they didn't have to? Maybe even get fully mobilized and go get shot at. Boy, it just doesn't make sense does it?

All the units here have been supporting real world ops. We just mobilized one AF res flying unit and deployed them to theater (public knowledge so no security breach posting it here). In the last couple of years I've been here, these guys have been doing Northern Watch, Southern Watch, JTF support, theater support and some other stuff best left out in this forum. Mucho time OConus and in country mobilization.

I'm sure ALPA can find a way to get this special treatment for those lazy weekend warriors turned off. Why don't you file a grievance?

 

[Clownpilot]

OKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK

Well, this is obviously just a way for the civilian guys to vent since this really benefits the military guys in no way other than letting them get to their units to drill. Reserve squadrons will ONLY buy tickets to and from duty stations for annual drill periods, not for regular drills. These guys are NOT going on vacation, to see family, or just getting free travel. If they happen to live near their reserve units they don't need this and CAN'T go anywhere. They are allowed to travel to/from ONE place and back. Forget the patriotism crap. Many of the furloughed pilots are counting on their reserve income to tide them over while they are waiting to get their jobs back at the airline. Apparently, you'd rather see them have to buy tickets to get there, when they can least afford them, or lose that income because they can't get to their units. That's a pretty messed up attitude. You might be angry that you're furloughed and want to take it out on somebody, but this issue doesn't seem unreasonable to me and I support the airline's position and am grateful that they have taken it. I don't drill in the reserves, but if that were my only source of income right now I'd be very happy if I had a way to get to that job.

What a bunch of bitter crybabies. Sickening.

 

[Clownpilot]

??????????

If you get another job flying then you get your travel back with that company. These guys have had their ability to get to their reserve jobs removed and could lose 2 jobs for the price of one when their furlough happens. Pretty sad to lose both your jobs because you lose one. You are talking about getting a NEW job and using your old company to get to your new one. Try this. Take a job you can get to. Now if you already worked that job and were being cut off by your furlough then maybe you'd have a point. Otherwise, it's just more civilian pilot inferiority rearing it's ugly head.

Waf39,
Thank you for your statement. That exactly what I'm trying to say. Why do I have to move for a job and military folks don't have to. I would love to be able to travel from my home of record to my new pilot base instead of moving. What gives? I'm not looking for pleasure travel folks, I'm looking to get to and from work without picking up my whole life again. I don't have anything against military folks but this is completely unfair! I yes, I am crying about it.

 

[Clownpilot]

Fine

I wil absolutely, completely support your right to ride back and forth with me to and from my reserve unit no matter how remote and ridiculous that may be. Just ride back and forth all day long and hopefully that will make you happy. I hope you really like the remote regions of eastern PA since that's where you're going...................you imbecile.

Albie15,

Nice speech but lay off the Kool-Aid dude. This is nothing more than the FFJC (Former Fighter Jock Club) taking care of their own and the patriotic spin isn't going to convince me otherwise. Every post I read on this board about the guard/reserve is more about how to get a slot and garner some income while on furlough than it is about 'defending freedom'.

UAL is being unfair about this. A pilot is a pilot is a pilot. I'm surprised that ALPA hasn't made a stink about this inequity. Either everyone rides or no one rides.

 

[Caveman]

I don't have a problem with UAL allowing furloughed pilots to keep pass benefits. In fact I think it's a good idea. I do think it's unfair to say that only the military pilots can have them and I think it's disingenuous to say it's for patriotic reasons when it clearly isn't. Furloughed civilian pilots may also have to travel to get to work. I don't want the military guys to lose the priviledge, I just think it should be offered to all the furloughed UAL pilots.

Mike,

For the last time, I'm a retired Marine. 20+ years. I earned it and I'm going to proudly display it. Get over it.

SkidDriver,

I agree with you on a couple of points. My last tour was with an I&I Staff. Initially I had the typical active duty negative attitude towards the reserves. It took me about 2 drill weekends to change my mind. In the Marine Corps reservists are expected to complete all the annual training that the regular Marine Corps does and they only have 11 weekends and one 2 week period to get it all done. They are also expected to be as proficient in all these areas as their active duty counterparts. They essentially don't have a single day off the first half of every month because they work all week, drill that weekend, and then work all the next week until their first day off. Anybody in any type of leadership position in the reserve unit also puts in many hours of 'off duty' time to prepare for the drill weekend. I am a big convert and big fan of the Marine Corps Reserve community and they are essential to our county's defense. One correction, reservists do not pay for their own lodging while drilling if they live outside the area. BTW, congrats on being hired at Comair.

 

[Seeniner]

Alright kids...you are all in timeout.

Yes, it is unfair what UAL is doing.

Yes, it is nice for those guard/reservists.

Yes, the right thing to do would be to extend these priveledges equally to everyone.

Yes, it should be taken up with UALALPA.

Yes, the civilian vs. military fued has really gotten old.

Yes, being on furlough bites...really bites.

Ok, you are all out of timeout.

See

 

[skiddriver]

Caveman,

Thanks, I did my retirement ceremony at the MAG last weekend, followed by beers with the troops, followed by a bash at the house. Ran the last guys out at 0100. Nice way to finish up 22 years.

I may not have been entirely clear. We (and all Marine Corps sites) pay for the reservist's lodging on scheduled drills if their residence is at least 50 miles (straight line) from the drilling site. For their ATP's and AFTP's (required participation if they wanted to stay in my unit), they pay for their own rooms. The Navy would often bump my guys out of the BOQ/BEQ (Navy SelRes have priority over everyone at NAS JRB New Orleans). My reservists would then be paying New Orleans hotel room rates out of pocket for the priviledge of drilling. Not every time, but enough times that it was and is a financial hardship on the guys. They still show up though...

We have one Huey pilot who works for Customs, and pays out of pocket to travel to and from El Paso to NOLA twice a month on average . Half the time he's paying for his room out of pocket as well, plus chow and all of the other expenses that you might expect. Hard chargin' guy. He isn't getting rich doing it, at least not monetarily.

I'm with you, the dedication these guys show to the Corps will bring a tear to your eye.

Semper fi,

Travis

 

[Dutch Ladybug]

The fact that good men stand ready to do violence on my behalf brings tears to my brown eyes.

I say help out the flyboys and grunts all we can given that the pay they receive for the job they do is near scandalous.

I say we give them all the help we can even though what UAL is doing may indeed be wrong; I’m not in a title to critic the UAL position or any US carrier for that matter.

The last time I was out Pendleton way and had a peek-a-boo at those tight pressed uniforms, those boys in blue can hang their boots on my doorstep anytime.

Helping the troopers as best I can.

Ladybug

 

[Boeingman]

I believe the airlines should offer ALL Reservists and Guardsman free SA travel privildges to/from their assignments.

We as a country owe these people a heavy debt for their sacrifices.

 

[Simon Says]

Hey Knight Rider.......

Canada? You gotta be kidding right. I did my 4 years as a 67N. My Father is retired Army. Military wasn'nt my gig because of the Egos. (The Military guys and Gals know what I am talking about) Now I am a bonified Civilian and proud of it. Doesn't make me any better or any worse. When Albeit wants to stand on a soap box and preach his patriotism because of his special missions makes me laugh. I bet next he is going to tell us he has a secret clearance.

All the other military folks out there God Bless you all and I do apreciate the dedication that you have defending freedom. I guess that is why I am able to write openly on a public forum.

 

[Eagleflip]

Two points, then I'll quit...

Simon, if you remember your military days (or took a poll of today's military folks) you would find that they quietly demur at the chance to wax patriotic. The military members I know just do their jobs, very well, usually without fanfare or posturing. Once in a while someone articulates the "why" part of service. That is not a crime.

Albie is simply voicing a sentiment that we don't often hear--that there are those among us who are going into harm's way in support of a sometimes ungrateful public. That's it...

Do I want to start another military vs. civilian flame war? Nope.

Second, Caveman and Skiddriver--watch out. Sounds like Dutch Ladybug is sweet on you guys! It's the uniform. It's gotta be the uniform...

Fly safe, ya'll...

 

[skiddriver]

Eagleflip,

You know, I got the same reaction from another Dutch girl in Amsterdam once...at least I thought she was a girl...

 

[#1 Windmilling]

Let's see, I have a friend who is on furlough from UAL and was sent by his Guard unit to the theater of operations in Nov '01. He just emailed me from his 110 degree oasis (at 9 AM) and said it looks like he will be back in October. Hmmm, almost a whole year deployed. I can send you his email. Maybe he will donate his pass travel privileges to you, pal! Get over it.
Wait a minute! Maybe he can use this privilege to go see his family! Nope, last I checked, UAL doesn't fly into sh&^%$Tvillistan. Unbelievable, "it's not fair, it's not fair...it's not.... (puke)

#1 W

 

[Caveman]

Mike,

No harm, no foul. I buy the next round.

Skiddriver,

Was that Amsterdam or Taiwan?

Dutch Ladybug,

Nevermind. I'll just get myself in trouble.

 

[Simon Says]

Fair enough....Well said Eagle Flip.