How do negotiations work at SKYW?

[WalterSobchak]

...this dispatcher, who routinely gives you release fuel that would make you fall out of the sky halfway to your destination...

I don't give two craps about who is representing who, who is union represented and who isn't, who is lowering the bar this week, etc. It ain't my workgroup, it ain't my business...I'll let you all hash out the accusations and the insults towards each other like a bunch of high school cheerleaders.

However, seeing how I actively ping the tanks of a certain percentage of my ACARS equipped flights at regular intervals (push, several times enroute, and landing) on a daily basis in order to find anomalies in our flight planning software...I'm gonna have to respectfully call you out on this one.

Only twice have I found anomalies on the selected flights I monitored that were beyond +/- 350 lbs of planned landing fuel on the CRJ2 . One of those times was a step-climb that was deeply hidden away in the expanded flight plan portion of the release that neither I, nor the captain found until long after the landing had been made, I had been accused of trying to kill everyone, and spent 2 hours after work investigating what happened. We learned something that day, fixed the problem, and moved on.

While I'm aware that 53 gallons of Jet A is a big deal, it is hardly the gross underfueling we are accused of releasing you guys and gals with. What I think you are confusing is the difference between release fuel and MINTO...and I readily admit, not enough of us plan as well as we'd like for long taxi delays and holding...but the majority of us try. That said, if you fly the profile planned on a normal day with no/limited holding, you will be damn close to estimated landing fuel when the wheels touch the ground.

I will always remember my first jumpseat as a new dispatcher. The captain tried to make a point to me how our enroute fuel burns are always wrong, so he added 500 extra lbs of fuel, stating that we would burn into of it because our fuel estimates are so wrong. He flew the profile and we landed with estimated landing fuel + 450 lbs. He was so pissed, he didn't speak to me and refused to shake my hand when I deplaned.

Finally, last I checked, when you sign off on a release, you are essentially signing your life away into a legal contract between you and your dispatcher...stating that you both concur that the information contained in that document has been checked and double checked by both of you and that you both agree that it is correct. If you feel like you're THAT underfueled, maybe a phone call is in order before signing off on that release.

Sorry for the thread hijack...get back to ripping each other to shreds. Just defending my people...even XPOO.

 

[Bako Cap]

I will always remember my first jumpseat as a new dispatcher. The captain tried to make a point to me how our enroute fuel burns are always wrong, so he added 500 extra lbs of fuel, stating that we would burn into of it because our fuel estimates are so wrong. He flew the profile and we landed with estimated landing fuel + 450 lbs. He was so pissed, he didn't speak to me and refused to shake my hand when I deplaned.

This always cracks me up. I know too many pilots who put on an extra 500#s EVERY flight like it is really going to save their bacon. 500#s in a really bad situation is still not enough. Like you said, if you don't like the fuel load then DO NOT SIGN OFF ON THE RELEASE and call your dispatcher.

 

[Nevets]

Newsflash....it already is, Steven. Thanks for your concern from your ExpressJet cockpit. What is going to happen when SkyWest takes your company's Delta flying out of LAX?

Newsflash...my name is not Steven.

I do have deep concerns. This affects us all. But you are welcome anyways.

NEWSFLASH
Our LAX flights do not belong to my company. They belong to Delta. But in any case, I wouldn't hold my breath either way.

 

[XPOO]

Nevets, steveN backwards. Whatever. Are you going to tell me that as long as the SkyWest pilots are the highest paid pilots in the regional industry that it will suddenly be ok as SkyWest continues to scoop up more of the other regional's flying? Rhetorical question, Woodcock. Set of ten.

 

[Nevets]

Nevets, steveN backwards. Whatever. Are you going to tell me that as long as the SkyWest pilots are the highest paid pilots in the regional industry that it will suddenly be ok as SkyWest continues to scoop up more of the other regional's flying? Rhetorical question, Woodcock. Set of ten.

Look underneath steven backwards and you just might figure out my real name.

My point is that Delta decides who does that flying seeing that its THEIR flying to give. You keep saying that its "other regional's flying" when in fact its not.

At this point, there is little I can do as a pilot to prevent Delta from giving ITS flying to whoever it wants (other than trying to improve our metrics) but it if at least goes to the highest paid pilots, that would be better than going to the lowest paid pilots, IMHO.

 

[Gnarloooo]

This always cracks me up. I know too many pilots who put on an extra 500#s EVERY flight like it is really going to save their bacon. 500#s in a really bad situation is still not enough. Like you said, if you don't like the fuel load then DO NOT SIGN OFF ON THE RELEASE and call your dispatcher.

There's probably alot of dead people who would have liked to have an extra 1/2 hour of gas. And if I don't like my fuel load, which I rarely do, then I will just put on more. Calling dispatch every time would ruin the all important MST.

 

[Tomct]

Negotiations....WHAT NEGOTIATIONS. Jerry say's JUMP and they all say....."...eehhhh....how high sir!..." Good job 67%er's!imp:

 

[10nCLR]

Negotiations....WHAT NEGOTIATIONS. Jerry say's JUMP and they all say....."...eehhhh....how high sir!..." Good job 67%er's!imp:

JUMP YOU FOOL, JUMP!!!!!! DAMN IT!!!

 

[XPOO]

There's probably alot of dead people who would have liked to have an extra 1/2 hour of gas. And if I don't like my fuel load, which I rarely do, then I will just put on more. Calling dispatch every time would ruin the all important MST.

Well, sh!t, son...Why don't you just fill the tanks up to full capacity for every flight then? Problem mother-f-in' solved. Hellz, you could go one better by just deicing before every take-off, whether it needs it or not. It's some radical thinking on your part, but I like it.

 

[Morning Wood]

At this point, there is little I can do as a pilot to prevent Delta from giving ITS flying to whoever it wants (other than trying to improve our metrics) but it if at least goes to the highest paid pilots, that would be better than going to the lowest paid pilots, IMHO.

Horizon isn't in the running for the flying.

 

[Morning Wood]

There's probably alot of dead people who would have liked to have an extra 1/2 hour of gas. And if I don't like my fuel load, which I rarely do, then I will just put on more. Calling dispatch every time would ruin the all important MST.

Other than the Avianca crash in JFK and the UA DC-8 that ran out of gas in PDX (in spite of the engineer's repeated prompts to the captain), how many airline crashes in the US have been attributed to running out of fuel?

P.S. Since calling anyone to up the fuel isn't required (see SP 3428), I'm not sure who you're trying to impress with your tough talk.

 

[Nevets]

Horizon isn't in the running for the flying.

No, what Im saying that I would rather it go to Horizon than someone on the lower end of the ladder. But I would be even more happy if DAL pilots did that flying than ANY regional!

 

[Morning Wood]

No, what Im saying that I would rather it go to Horizon than someone on the lower end of the ladder. But I would be even more happy if DAL pilots did that flying than ANY regional!

True, but why would Delta give flying to someone new that costs considerably more than anyone else, not just SkyWest, when SkyWest has been a Delta Connection Carrier for over 20 years?

 

[Bako Cap]

There's probably alot of dead people who would have liked to have an extra 1/2 hour of gas. And if I don't like my fuel load, which I rarely do, then I will just put on more. Calling dispatch every time would ruin the all important MST.

I was talking about EVERY flight. If you want 500#s more, be my guest. Good luck getting a half an hour out of 500#s. It's closer to 10-15 minutes, and if you are at that point, you have already F'd up, big time. I rarely slap on a couple of hundred #s because I'm scared of the unknown and have yet to land at min fuel in the past decade. I have diverted due to unforeseen issues, but never would a measly 500#s extra have changed my decision to divert.

 

[Nevets]

True, but why would Delta give flying to someone new that costs considerably more than anyone else, not just SkyWest, when SkyWest has been a Delta Connection Carrier for over 20 years?

Its not all about pilot costs.