How do I find a good corporate job?

[LegacyDriver]

Are averages "Average Starting Salary" or is that a CAREER AVERAGE?

A lot of guys at Corporate gigs have been there 20 years. With longevity pay steps they're going to push the average numbers up.

This is why it is important to know the Median and the Mode salary for each equipment type as well.

 

[HMR]

Legacy- I have most of the new salary surveys. Your pay is way below average.

Try to remember that your owner is probably paying $200,000 per month just in loan payments on your jet. At some point, somebody sat down with him and made a conscious decision to low-ball the pilots. Not cool.

What kind of salary is your CP bringing in?
-If it's less than $150K, I'll bet he's an ex-regional guy who's just giddy to be making the "big bucks".
-If it's more than $150K, I'll bet he told the boss, "You know what? There's a bunch of Regional guys we could hire to fly this thing for peanuts".

Either way there's something wrong.

 

[HMR]

Are averages "Average Starting Salary" or is that a CAREER AVERAGE?

Our dept. takes the "Average" NBAA figure and adds 15% for location. This is considered "starting pay" for a new PIC. If you had previous experience, your salary would be figured accordingly. A number of the senior pilots in our area are "off the chart".

 

[LegacyDriver]

Dude no way!

Well, I try to look at the bright side: I make $140/flight hour. At the Regional I was making $47 as a Captain on bigger equipment. Can you say "Arse rape" ?

I know we are low-balled. Legacy pilots should make $90K a year. But I also assume that is on-call 24/7 pilots and at least I am not in *that* boat. I'd kill myself.



But...again, is the *AVERAGE* based on *all* pilots of *all* experience levels and *all* longevity numbers for that equipment?

If you have 3 guys with 20 years and one guy with 4 years you might get an average of $120,000 a year. But if you reversed it and had 3 guys with 4 years and one guy with 20 you might only see $80,000 for an average.

See what I mean?

I guess it would help to know what the NBAA survey is measuring.

 

[g159av8tor]

Another vote for the kids...I mean look at my frigg'n avatar!!!

But as far as World is concerned, I have two friend that currently fly there. FWIW, one is a divirced father of two and the other is a bachelor. I can tell you that long trips away from his boy are not reconciled by the time at home. The single dude loves it for all the reasons a single guy would.

Tailwinds...

 

[HMR]

Legacy- It's a little troubling how you're justifying your wages. "$140/Flight Hour"? That sounds like my regional buddies who include per-diem when figuring their salaries. I guess it's a PT121 thing.

 

[Lear70]

Yes, I don't much care for the lower salary justification that it's an "average" salary so new people start lower?

The h*ll with that. NBAA average salaries should be what you require to fly the aircraft. Let's not turn the LAST, BEST vestige of good flying jobs into regional paying equivalents.

 

[HMR]

Yes, I don't much care for the lower salary justification that it's an "average" salary so new people start lower?

The h*ll with that. NBAA average salaries should be what you require to fly the aircraft. Let's not turn the LAST, BEST vestige of good flying jobs into regional paying equivalents.

That's what I was trying to say. You just said it better.

 

[501261]

Well, I try to look at the bright side: I make $140/flight hour

A couple of years a go I was around $550 an hour, now I'm down to $350 an hour....... frigging work !!!!!

I betcha HMR is around $1000 an hour, unless that 1 trip a month is a round the world tour !

Bottomline the airline per hour stuff doesn't work all that well with the corporate salary structure.

 

[501261]

A number of the senior pilots in our area are "off the chart".

Exactly a lot of us believe the NBAA numbers are skewered way too low. I look at NBAA 90% percentile as the "realistic salary".

 

[iflyabeech]

I am currently working for an airline and want out. What is the best way to go about finding a good corporate job? Any help would be appreciated

without reading the other replies. . . MAKE FRIENDS!!

 

[LegacyDriver]

Legacy- It's a little troubling how you're justifying your wages. "$140/Flight Hour"? That sounds like my regional buddies who include per-diem when figuring their salaries. I guess it's a PT121 thing.

There is no real justification for it... Honestly. I came into the job *WITH* a type. But again, I get 2 days off for every day I work. Basically it's a vacation every time I come home. That you CANNOT BEAT anywhere.

I *KNOW* I am underpaid. But if I quit then I am out of a job and ten people will jump over themselves to take my spot.

This is the most pressure-free job I have ever had. My CHQ experience was a living nightmare. That probably clouds my vision some.

 

[HMR]

Exactly a lot of us believe the NBAA numbers are skewered way too low. I look at NBAA 90% percentile as the "realistic salary".

That's what most of my "seasoned" PT91 buddies say. I never hear any complaints from them (other than golf scores, poor sailing conditions, etc.).

I betcha HMR is around $1000 an hour, unless that 1 trip a month is a round the world tour !

Oh c'mon, nobody takes an Astra around the world.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Man you guys are making me depressed. I am so far in debt and this is why I'll never get out of it. I keep finding these low-ball jobs!

 

[semperfido]

Man you guys are making me depressed. I am so far in debt and this is why I'll never get out of it. I keep finding these low-ball jobs!

Hey....if you enjoy your job the way you say you do --then just enjoy it! life's too short and this ain't no dress rehersal. quit listening to all this stuff. sometimes it takes years with a particular company to get the pay where it should be. just enjoy and the rest takes care of itself.

 

[inthewind]

Whoaaa, wait a second. Good Corporate Gig + good pay + BBJ, G-IV, CL-65 (all large cabin class jets) = $40,000 to start, $70,000 as Captain?

No offense, but those are some of the worst pay rates for those classes of aircraft I have ever seen in my life. Am I missing something? Those aren't even CLOSE to NBAA numbers for those aircraft.

Should be closer to $60-75k for a starting F/O, $95-125k for Captain (both categories depending on region), plus benefits such as full medical, dental, 401k with a good employer match, vacation, and sick leave.

Wouldn't leave my regional job for anything less... which is probably why I'm still here. Sure as h*ll wouldn't take a pay CUT (from my $75k 5th year Regional Capt pay averaging 13 days of a month) to $40k for an F/O? On a Gulfstream?

There must be something I'm missing here...

Oh yeah, another vote for "stay with the kids". My wife was divorced with a 9 year old little girl and I wouldn't ask her to move for anything in the world unless it was to somewhere within an hour's or so drive - that just wouldn't be fair to either the little girl, her dad, or my wife having to drive back and forth. Plus, it'd be just like commuting if you were swapping kids every weekend over 200 miles or more of road.

Man you got it backwards, 40,000 to start at World, $75k second year FO. $75K to start at the corporate outfit. Both places Captain pay ends up about the same.

 

[Lear70]

Yeah, someone else pointed that out. Thanks for the clarification, I knew that didn't sound right.

Good luck if you choose World... I've had friends of mine trying to get me to go to work for a lot of those freight guys and if I hadn't gotten married two years ago... Those guys have a LOT of fun overseas for two or three weeks at a time!

Oh, and if the corporate gig you're leaving is in the area of BNA, TYS, CHA, MEM, SDF, or ATL, I can forward you my resume to leave on their desk with your two week's notice...

Good luck with your decision!

 

[Peardc10]

Finding Corporate Jobs?

I started out flying corporate with a great company, then went to the airline side of this crazy business. Its been one hell of a roller coaster ride. Went back to corporate with another strong company, but left due to the fact I had to work with a complete idiot, either he was going to kill me or visa-versa, now I'm back at my old airline job and crossing my fingers.
My point is there is no guarantee in this industry of a secure job in anything you do! I know some friends working for fortune 100 companies and have downsized and are now looking for work. Network, Network! I see a lot of corporate flight departments changing in the near future. One company in the midwest will have a complete change-over due to retirements, so there are jobs out there to be found.
Jumping from the airline to corporate side can be tricky, depends on who is doing the hiring. Some Chief Pilots wont hire airline guys, why? who knows. Keep pounding the pavement, sooner or later, something will come along. Find a NBAA Member directory, its a great resource of information on who is flying what! If you know anybody in the corporate world, give them a call and network, network.
All this has been said numerous times, dont give up!

I should have written that number down - truck driving school years ago!!!

Good luck.......

we all need it in this F$#$#cked up industry!!!!

 

[LegacyDriver]

How much power do they need? My gawd the plane has FIVE generators that can put out 400A apiece(!). Seems like a lot.

Also you are talking about a base airplane that is roughly 30000 lbs BOW. MTOW is over 50000 lbs on the XR I believe. How heavy is all this stuff?

 

[LegacyDriver]

Wrong thread guys. Sorry.