How can I drink the Brown Kool-aid if I cant hold my food down

[JT12345]

car,

don't talk about what u r willing to give up. Geezh, look where this is right now.

 

[JT12345]

I repost for your convenience my previous comment on the reality of today, not last Sep 2010:

Score,

The only realities are what the arbitrators would do to you and what they have done to others recently.

Stop making up a reality that does not exist and has no recent historical data to back it up.

 

[scoreboardII]

Please turn down the more than fair offer from SWA, good luck with that. I wish you nothing but the best in your future endevours.

 

[JT12345]

Please turn down the more than fair offer from SWA, good luck with that. I wish you nothing but the best in your future endevours.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tf3416Y4pwc

 

[PapaWoody]

Islandhoper is right on!! There is no reason that a SWA fo that was hired in 04 have 1400-1500 AAI guys behind them. SWA fos are stealing a seniority number that doesn't belong to them in the first place. They have no more worth than any other AAI guy! I think that most if not all AAI guys would be willing to give some just to keep the good relations going, but clearly SWAPA Doesn't feel the same way. SWA was flatlined with no growth! They had to buy an airline that showed promise or remain stagnate.

Dude, I was hired at SWA in early 2001, and with this deal I only have 1450 AAI guys behind me. Just one example of how far from reality your perceptions are. Let me know when you catch up.

PapaWoody

 

[desolo]

Why I'm Voting no!

This "deal" takes my seniority back from 44% to 75%. Even though I hold my capt's seat, my life becomes completely unknown for the next 10+ yrs. I will not accrue any seniority and move around "the most" junior bases and schedules since I probably won't hold ATL anymore. I guess I could downgrade (Wouldn't you like that huh?) This deal short of puts a gun in my head to do just that. The southwest pilot that takes my slot wouldn't have to deal with the 10+ years that I would have to. He/she would immediately have a descent seniority.

Pay is a perk (even though it starts in almost a year from now), but I do not think is worth the dramatic changes in commuting and scheduling for such a long time. It is really like the Devil making me rich in exchange for my soul and peace... I vote no to that. Voting yes, potentially commits 15 years of the 29 I have left to being "the junior guy". I refuse to forget that I chose AirTran because I believed my upgrade would come quickly, that we would grow at a fast pace, that we would go international and keep on expanding. I have never applied at SW. Many of you don't know AirTran, don't under-estimate it. It was a good Airline, with a good product, with customers that appreciated it. With pilots that had as much experience as ANY southwest pilot except for the shuttle commander you guys had... (Hugh Gibbs I think?)

I understand we are being acquired. But I also understand it is a necessity. If not, GK would have invested those 3.4 Bills. on internal growth. But he chose to acquire a good, profitable airline. That was the way to go. And this acquisition/merger will create the opportunities that southwest alone did not have. No matter how much money it had in the bank... So I vote no. Voting yes would mean forgetting all this things and accepting that my career has a lower value than any Southwest Captains career.

I respect and truly appreciate all the pay increases that the SW contract would afford me; but have this clear guys: Everything I gain in this merger is not taken and subtracted from a Southwest guy. Not the pay, not the seat. The gains you are expecting to have, are taken directly from an AirTran pilot: Seniority, job security, quality of life and capt seats... Not fair, not equitable.

I also fear this: If we accept this deal and live with it, who is to say that in 5 years from now GK will merge with Alaska... will those pilots forget their balls too? Or will they fight to be on top of my 75% at SW? Will swapa have a little more respect for them? Agree to take less or allow arbitration? This is my fight today! I will hold my cojones and vote no.

What do I think is fair in a nutshell: -Relative seniority (With a slight loss at the AirTran side due to SW top seniority protection (Those hired before AT existed), and a slight loss to offset a 3 year fence in ATL. Not more than 10-15% loss.
-Captains keep the seats period. (Bid per master seniority list.)
-Pay bonus for SW fo's that fly with a junior capt. (This is a great idea to reduce friction in the cockpit.)
-SW upgrade protection on sw retirements. Every time a SW guy retires, the slot is taken by the next SW guy down the list. End this rule sometime down a 5 year limit or so?
-At upgrade protection for our guys for the same amount of time...

OK, this is my yearly post. Flame away and explain me why this is not fair and equitable. Or how my thinking is of the planet.


Islanhoper[/QUote



Why don't we make you #1 in the combined list and forget about everybody else....

 

[jonjuan]

I also fear this: If we accept this deal and live with it, who is to say that in 5 years from now GK will merge with Alaska... will those pilots forget their balls too? Or will they fight to be on top of my 75% at SW?

Consolidation is far from over in the industry. Your point is glossed over by most.

 

[-9Capt]

Dude, I was hired at SWA in early 2001, and with this deal I only have 1450 AAI guys behind me.

PapaWoody

We have 1700 pilots and 1450 are junior to a 2001 hire. What a joke. This HAS to go to arbitration.

 

[400ADude]

We have 1700 pilots and 1450 are junior to a 2001 hire. What a joke. This HAS to go to arbitration.

Agree 1000% my friend.

 

[jball2]

Personally, I feel just as backed into a corner as anyone. I have the added bonus of living in Atlanta where my life could become complete hell if this goes bad. I have been a loyal and dedicated FO at SWA for 10 years and would be forced to commute for what appears to be another 9 years from ATL on my own airline who has a base there. I do enjoy a seniority bump in 9 years but other than that, I get zilch.

If I take whats behind door #2, I could be put junior to someone who hasn't put the time or the effort into this that I have (read less longevity) and be "roadblocked" for the rest of my career. I don't think that's fair either.

I busted my a$$ to get to SWA and to have someone tell me they deserve to be senior to me because they passed a captain check at 6 years is as insulting as anything some of our jewels have said. We ALL passed a captain checkride as a prerequisite to SWA so pardon us if we feel entitled to be senior to a junior AT pilot.

It is not about skill or professionalism. I ride on you guys just about every week and with about 2 exceptions in as many years, I think you guys are FANTASTIC. I just hate being told by a 33 year old captain that just upgraded that he fully expects to be ahead of me.

I hope this works out as I have tons of friends over there. I refuse to let bad blood come between us. I am giving it to God at this point! I have said my peace.