Holly Get's It Right!

[RedRum]

But you see, that's the point. ALPA should remain a neutral third party because they have a merger policy. The policy should set the ground rules for how the merger should be accomplished but why in the hell should the ALPA leadership decide who is entitled to what?

Thanks for the comment. In theory, yes, ALPA should not be deciding which party to favor. We have a merger policy that allows for binding arbitration if both sides cannot come up with a negotiated settlement. (DAL / NWA) This was the end game from the start.

I agree with FDJ2 about the fact that we would not have our JPWA or the SLI delievered had we not agreed to binding arbitration. But here is the issue. If both pilot groups are going to go to binding arbitration and we cannot agree on a negotiated settlement, why have a friggin union? Why pay union dues?

I will gladly pay an assessment to pay for lawyers who will negotiate on my behalf. I am not trying to sound like one of those whiny bee atches at the teabagger party, all I am trying to say is I am tired of having my union dues syphoned away only to end up paying for more lawyers to do a job that ALPA cannot, and will not do.

We have a lot of talented volunteers here at ALPA that do good work. Take for instance the CIRP, Safety, and Security (if I left a few out, I apologize in advance) We could easily pool those resources with a pilot group of 12,000 pilots! I just can't be happy about the way our union dollar is working for us right now. Again, no leadership when it boils right down to it. A lot of guys on FPL who are greasing their skids and playing the political shell game.

I would say a group of 12,000 pilots is a darn good lobby. Even better, one set of goals and one agenda which includes furthering the careers of Delta Air Lines pilots. Period

 

[FDJ2]

I agree with FDJ2 about the fact that we would not have our JPWA or the SLI delievered had we not agreed to binding arbitration. But here is the issue. If both pilot groups are going to go to binding arbitration and we cannot agree on a negotiated settlement, why have a friggin union? Why pay union dues? /quote]

Redrum, I think the issue here is what is the role of ALPA national and what is the role of each individual MEC. There are issues that are national in scope and there are issues that are best handled by each individual MEC. Just like it wasn't our responsibility at DAL or NWA to fund the AWA/AAA seniority arbitration, it's not CAL's or UAL's responsibility to fund ours or any follow on arbitration from the award.

We wouldn't want other MEC's, through national, dictating our negotiating goals and strategies when it comes to collective bargaining, similarly, we wouldn't want others dictating our strategies in constructing our SLI strategies.

Put another way, if it comes to determining whether or not a 777-300 is a replacement aircraft for a retiring 747, who do you want to make the determination on whether or not to fight for the 777 for fNWA pilots, ALPA national or a member of the fNWA merger committee?

 

[Whine Lover]

"To be fair to the West pilots, how can there be unity when a larger pilot group decides to mug a smaller pilot group?

Until the east pilots honor their commitments there will be no unity at LCC."

True Dat....And, each side has it's own argument.

Those arguments, valid or not, have NO merit in the overall scope of things.

Until the two warring groups can come together, on ANY sort of strategy, right or wrong, fair or not....MANAGEMENT WINS.

Simple.

However, as Human Beings, emotion and a sense of what is "right and wrong" always prevail over simple Logic.

I believe the time worn truism takes effect here: " Cutting off one's nose to spite one's face."

That'll show 'em who's Boss, eh?


YKMKR

 

[eaglesview]

I just can't get enough of this stuff. Why don't we start three or four more threads to discuss the exact same crap that has been discussed for about a year now!!

 

[TWA Dude]

Why don't we start three or four more threads to discuss the exact same crap that has been discussed for about a year now!!

Lemme get this straight: you're complaining about excessive threads yet instead of simply ignoring them you feel the need to post on one. Real smart.

 

[eaglesview]

Lemme get this straight: you're complaining about excessive threads yet instead of simply ignoring them you feel the need to post on one. Real smart.

Lemme get this straight, after a year of the same old talk you have nothing new to say.

 

[captairbusbb]

I just can't get enough of this stuff. Why don't we start three or four more threads to discuss the exact same crap that has been discussed for about a year now!!

Ok eaglesview.......you just can't get enough of this stuff. Well, that being said, Holly, let's call her a neutral, sees thru all the BS that USAPA has propagated to the west for about a year now.

What has USAPA done in it's nearly one year of existence to change any argument of why they should even be here except to chant their DOH mantra. I can tell you that in ONE word....NOTHING.

They claimed they would have an industry leading contract within one month of their existence. Where's the contract??

They claimed that a DOH seniority list would be implimented because the NIC award was only a bargaining chip. I see no evidence of that.

The only thing they've accomplished in it's miserable life is paying mr. seeman exorbitant wages (at the expense of their membership) to pay for false lawsuits against it's west constituents which will be determined in it's DFR lawsuit against themselves in the next two weeks.

Holly knows when to call a spade a spade, and if I were a dues paying USAPA member, I would be SCARED.......VERY SCARED.

 

[FDJ2]

"Until the two warring groups can come together, on ANY sort of strategy, right or wrong, fair or not....MANAGEMENT WINS.

Well there's a problem. Coming together requires trust. How can the west pilots trust the east pilots? They had an agreement before. To be bound by the Nicolau award.

Until the Nicolau award is implemented, as it should be, it's hard to imagine how the the west pilots, or anyone else for that matter, can trust the east pilots, or their sham union USAPA. If there can't be trust, how can there be unity.

 

[eaglesview]

You got it, but these two parties don't get it.

 

[AutoBus]

Lemme get this straight, after a year of the same old talk you have nothing new to say.

OK genius, how would you fix it if you were the west?





The east?





Let's hear it.....

 

[BeCareful!]

This group was disfunctional before US Airways stained the building headquatered in Tempe. Former America West employees are now the target of their discontent.

Sorry Cowboy, but that's just stupid. AWA employees are not any kind of target. The target was ALPA, and on that one we hit a bull's eye. Next target: Nicolau Award, because it's a g'damn windfall and it was based on faulty seniority lists and because he's was obviously out of his 84-year-old mind. Haven't hit that target yet, a fact that all the West gets great pleasure of bragging about here on FlightNoRealInfo.com

As for the stain, that was the paint they applied to your building to re-name your little known regional airline so that the customers who bring in the revenue (you know, the people who fly all over the east coast) wouldn't jump ship.

Anyway, don't want to confuse the issues with any reality; I know you guys don't like that here on FI.com

 

[TWA Dude]

Lemme get this straight, after a year of the same old talk you have nothing new to say.

Need I point out the irony of you committing that which you complain about?

When I get sick of a topic I have no problem ignoring it and I don't feel the need to tell everybody about it. Why do you?

 

[TWA Dude]

AWA employees are not any kind of target.

Seems Judge Wake disagrees with you. We'll see how the jury feels. How do you feel about your chances?

The target was ALPA, and on that one we hit a bull's eye.

Howz that working out for y'all so far? Everything all better now? Lemme see: your reps are still lying to you and still leading you down the wrong path yet you still consider it an improvement. Gosh, you're easy to please.

Next target: Nicolau Award, because it's a g'damn windfall and it was based on faulty seniority lists and because he's was obviously out of his 84-year-old mind.

When Easties post drivel like this I know the West will prevail. Do you know what "ageism" is? I wonder how old Judge Wake is. I guess if and when you lose the trial you'll use him as another scapegoat. Always somebody else to blame for your problems...

 

[Cowboy75]

Next target: Nicolau Award, because it's a g'damn windfall and it was based on faulty seniority lists and because he's was obviously out of his 84-year-old mind. As for the stain, that was the paint they applied to your building to re-name your little known regional airline so that the customers who bring in the revenue (you know, the people who fly all over the east coast) wouldn't jump ship.

Doug Parker went to a garage sale and hung US Airways on the building. So much talk of a legacy carrier and we all know what the legacy is. A collection of regional airllines put together with a lousy safety record. All this chest thumping of such a great airline that was never in the ranks of respected airlines. ALPA, old men, regional pilots, keep adding to the list of scapegoats to justify your misery. Former AWA employees are not responsible for your discontent. How about looking in the mirror. You might not like what you see. One other thing, out of seniority furloughs are hardly a windfall. Dave is senior to Dean. You'll soon figure it out after a federal courthouse corrects that injustice!

 

[Axel]

I am really glad that I never applied to USAirways or America West. Hey, not that I would have been hired had I applied, but lordy I might have been.

The brass ring had a pin attached to it. Good thing I didn't try to grab it. Good luck to all of you.