embdrvr said:
I am tired of rampers that they think they know more about my job than I do. I've taken a delay because a dum$hit ramper kept telling me that I should kick out the jumpseater and not ask him to pull bags. Obviously it was a CG not a weight issue but he kept going on and on about how it was BS for us to keep the jumpseater on board. Trying to make him understand that if we kicked the jumpseater off would cause even more bags to be pulled was next to impossible.
My advice to rampers is to not challenge the Captain's authority because you may not have the whole picture. Instead do the job you're paid to do and talk to a ramp supervisor after the plane is on its way. If a Captain is indeed giving bogus bag limits the ramp supervisor is the one that needs to forward that concern to flight ops.
I know what you mean about challenging authority when you don't have the big picture. But the big picture goes both ways, and the CA ain't god. He's far from it, and they make mistakes. I won't take any cheap shots here, so I won't say what's on my mind.
Somebody bothered to quote Part 91 around here. And now you are going to accuse me of being a know it all just because I have a PPL and am a ramper. Well, the regs read that the PIC has the "final authority." It doesn't mean he has the only authority, it doesn't mean that he is always right, it doesn't mean he never makes mistakes, it means that he has the last word and it's his *ss. I will speak up when I think you've left something out or overlooked something. It's my job, and I take it seriously because I have an ethical problem letting you take the heat for something I know I could have prevented it. There is a difference between bringing something to someone's attention and accusing them of screwing up. I know as PIC, there is no such thing as "too much information." Finally, wrt "captain's authority," I'd like to touch on a word you used in your last post. "Inconvenience." If you don't give a rat's patooty about making more work for something else, I fail to see why you get upset if a ramper "incoveniences" you. After all, your authority can only be challenged by somebody in a position of power over you, right? Like management? I fail to see why you let a little ramper bother you.
As far as the supposed chain of command goes, it's fine when it works. You don't want to get me started on low-level ACA management however and the supervisors that get promoted. If a pilot has accused a ramper of something, you can pretty much be assured that the ramper is already convicted (no union ya know). I'd much rather have a quick conversation with a CA if he thinks I screwed up and deal with it on the spot than have to deal with management later. I've been on the receiving end of that (mgmt) and it's not pleasant (again, no union). Wouldn't you rather tell a ramper to shut the f*ck instead of having to explain yourself to the chief pilot? And if in the situation I described earlier, if the supervisor loaded the aft beyond structural limitation and swore up and down he was right, what are you supposed to say to him? Chain of command works when people are trained well and on the same page.
Ziggy, at ACA anybody has the authority to hold a flight. I've never seen a brawl over a pax/bags/jumpseater W&B issue, but I really wonder how it would play out if an agent held a flight because the CA wanted a loading that was contrary to company policy.
Terry, what is "the face" that you are referring to? 9 times out of 10, crews would start both engines at the gate, so I'm not sure what would make the ramper get upset. It's not like you're doing something that was strange.
Emb, I too am not trying to start a fight, but I just want to point out that not all rampers are stupid, not all rampers are always wrong, and maybe, just maybe, once in awhile they spot some things that will save everybody a little work if the situation is addressed before it progresses.
