Has anyone here ever rolled an airplane???

[ATRedneck]

(deleted)

 

[RefugePilot]

Most of the basic aerobatic mnvrs are sub 3-g, Loops and rolls being amongst them, as long as you do them right. If you make a mistake it could exceed the normal category g-loading. You should rent an aerobic airplane and instructor to see what can really be done and maybe get some upset training as well.

I have heard of a loop being done in a C152, it was very easy, from what I have heard.

Have Fun

 

[RefugePilot]

Kershners Book

To get a feel for whats involved in the manuevers check out William Kershners aerobatic book at http://www.kershnerflightmanuals.com/. I used to have it on the shelf and learned a lot about many of the basic maneuvers. Unfortunatly, I have only been able to test them out on X-plane flight sim.

 

[The_Russian]

You know what?

If you can't roll it properly.....you should not be flying it. Anyone that needs aerobatic lessons to roll an aircraft lacks basic manuevering knowledge and should not be flying aircraft. Period. They all fly the same anyway. If for some reason you find yourself inverted, you had better be able to get out of it.

 

[NoPax]

You know what?

If you can't roll it properly.....you should not be flying it. Anyone that needs aerobatic lessons to roll an aircraft lacks basic manuevering knowledge and should not be flying aircraft. Period. They all fly the same anyway. If for some reason you find yourself inverted, you had better be able to get out of it.

Most non-aerobatic pilots will instinctively pull when 'finding themselves inverted'...not roll - it's refered to as a 'panic pull'. Also, when two airplanes get close to each other, same thing - people instinctively pull.

It is the safe thing to do - aerobatic instruction for an aerobatic maneuver.

You need aerobatic instruction because that's what the aerobatics instructor does all day long - rolls, loops, spins, and combinations of them. Also, by practicing with an aerobatics instructor you are practicing with someone who's body is used to +3gs, and is conditioned for the mistakes you will invariably make, while others will fade to black.

I have not flown with any pilot that handles the airplane the same as one that has an aerobatics background - they are a class apart.

If you pull 3g with no roll, that is one thing, but go ahead and pull 3gs then initiate a roll and watch your wings crinkle before your eyes. You have increased the dynamic forces created by the ailerons on the wing, and will overstress most normal, commuter and transport category airplanes.

The reason people need instruction, is to avoid the 'trial and error' of your moronic suggestion.

 

[pilotyip]

Nopax, that explains my experience when I unsuccessfully attempted my first roll on my second solo flight. Thanks goodness I had a 6G capable airplane and 5000 of air below me. Never again.

 

[The_Russian]

The reason people need instruction, is to avoid the 'trial and error' of your moronic suggestion.

I learned by trial and error. I did it because I knew that I needed the ability. Most airline pilots today have never even been past 60 degrees in an airplane. Do you think that it is safe to have someone in the front of an airliner that cannot successfully right an aircraft? I hate to sound like pilotyip like I "know it all". But, I think it is very important to know this stuff.

 

[Superpilot92]

Never in a 152 or a Mooney!!!

 

[Fugawe]

Roll your Pitts.

Take your girl to lunch in your Mooney.

Know what you are doing, or don't do either.



Fugawe

 

[Fugawe]

You know what?

If you can't roll it properly.....you should not be flying it. Anyone that needs aerobatic lessons to roll an aircraft lacks basic manuevering knowledge and should not be flying aircraft. Period. They all fly the same anyway. If for some reason you find yourself inverted, you had better be able to get out of it.

I can snow ski a little, and have basic knowledge of skiing, and watched the Olympics. Should I jump on the double diamond?

 

[Lear Wanna Be]

A C-310R doesn't roll nicely. THEY don't ROLL NICELY.

I beg to differ on this! Right JT? I mean, no it doesn't roll very nicely. I mean, no it doesn't roll at all. In fact, more than 35 degrees of bank and it falls out of the sky. LMAO

I happen to know a guy (I really do and it is not me) that had 4 C-310Rs that they used for check hauling. On occasion he would talk about how he and another pilot would go out and dogfight in them. Said they had some interesting experiences doing that. He also mentioned how quiet it gets when you loop one and feather both engines at the top. This guy was pretty crazy. Well I never knew if I really believed his fishing stories or not. Then one day I see one of their birds layed-up in the hangar with the wing all torn apart. Guess they found several cracks in the spar, spent $60K and several months getting the thing repaired. The FAA had to do a field approval and were asking a lot of questions about how this kind of thing could have happened. Well they ended up not having enough airplanes to cover their runs for all these months and had to use other operators. By the time they were up and running with all 4, they were so far in the hole that they had to sell out. Sure doesn't seem worth it, now does it? Oh, this is the same guy that I found out never took a 135 check and had also been busted when they purchased an MU-2 (never added) and were doing an illegal trip for FedEx.

 

[DrewBlows]

If you feel the need to roll a normal category airplane please don't do it in a rental plane or company plane that others will fly. If you want to bend your own airplane, that's between you and your maker (and the FAA). Nothing makes me cringe more than when someone boasts about rolling an airplane that I fly. Feel free to kill yourself, but leave me out of it.

That said, a little aerobatic training can be very beneficial for your skills and confidence. Aerobatics are fun, just do it in an airplane approved to do so. There are a lot of instructors out there with Decatholons, Citabrias, and Extras who are more than willing to help you out.

 

[Spooky 2]

I have never rolled a Sabre 40 or 60 or 80 or a 65. Or a jet Commander, or Westwind. I never rolled a Falcon 50.

But I can assure you that I never rolled a 727 or a DC-3, trust me on that!

(Talked about rolling the 72, but none of us had enough guts, you never can tell if you can trust the FE.)

Back in the every early 70's there was a CAL Capt that rolled one of their B727's on more than one occasion during ferry flights, with the FA's onboard. Well as you can imagine the word finally leaked out at a party one night down in Mahattan Beach. Also attending party was a local FAA inspector and the rest was as they say "history." The guy tried to defend himself by saying that CAL supervisory pilots rolled their Sabre 60 routinely and since it was certified the same as the Boeing, there was nothing wrong with this type of activity. Back in those days CAL used the Sabre as a pre-employment evaluation airplane so yes there probaly was a lot stuff going on that was above an beyond the normal. Coincidently CAL lost this Sabreliner in an accident, killing both pilots but no pax after dropping off the then COB, Bob Six in Longmont, CO. One of the reversers deployed during takeoff and they lost control of the airplane, but that's another story.

So the guy that rolls the airplane gets fired. Both the F/O and S/O got some serious time off for not reporting the aberent behavior. I had met the S/O once and recall him telling the story of one of the rolls. At night no less, the guy rolls the airplane and the S/O is looking back in the dimly lit cabin as all the F/A's are sleeping. Not one of the woke up! This guy was stupd, but he must of had great hands. Don't know what ever happend to the Capt but I'll bet money that he went on to another flying job after the FAA reinstated his certificates.

From what I understand the best way to roll the 727 was to pop about 1/3 to 1/2 spoilers, get it going slightly down hill at about 280 kts and smoothly roll while leveling out. Works for me. Try it in the sim sometime. Slicker'n snot.

 

[erj-145mech]

Thats a load of bull. I happen to know that a 310R rolls better than an AT-6. That 600 lbs of gas in the wingtips wants to go around. There's nothing wrong with the maneuver as long as you don't exceed the G loading, and I can routinely roll without exceeding 1.75G. I'll lose some altitude to keep the speed up, but its not much, but then this isn't competition.

 

[FlyingFisherman]

Never worked for a check hauling business. C-310 was owned by a world class aerobatic pilot who allowed me to experience first hand a scene from Cloud Dancer in his Pitts.

"Well you're flyin' one now!"

Later that night I watched the movie for the first time.

 

[garf12]

We just had a member terminated from our flyng club for rolling an arrow. Idiot didnt tell anyone but the fact that the battery had come out of the casing and threw acid all over the fire wall was a little clue. Few other things gave it away.

 

[icefr8dawg]

Thats a load of bull. I happen to know that a 310R rolls better than an AT-6. That 600 lbs of gas in the wingtips wants to go around. There's nothing wrong with the maneuver as long as you don't exceed the G loading, and I can routinely roll without exceeding 1.75G. I'll lose some altitude to keep the speed up, but its not much, but then this isn't competition.

Agree, except the twisting moments tend to work the outboard flush rivets harder than normal. Nothing some cherry's and PRC won't fix tho

 

[FL420]

We just had a member terminated from our flyng club for rolling an arrow. Idiot didnt tell anyone but the fact that the battery had come out of the casing and threw acid all over the fire wall was a little clue. Few other things gave it away.

Good point about the battery. Damage to engines with wet sump oil systems is another possibility. Another is possible damage to conventional gyros when they hit the stops.

If you do aerobatics in someone elses airplane that is not designed and certificated for aerobatics, you are abusing the aircraft and the trust of the owner and subsequent pilots who fly that aircraft.