Guard vs Reserves

[khallen2754]

Just wanted to see if any of you guys who fly for the Air Force Reserves or the Air National Guard could shed some light on the fundamental differences in the two branches. Specifically, what are differences between:

1. the equipment you might fly
2. where you may get stationed
3. current and future needs for pilots
4. the assignments you receive
5. the application process
6. major documentation differences in a completed package
7. the time it takes to be selected and enter UPT after sending out your package.

I am interested in serving and have always leaned toward the Air National Guard. However, the more information I can get about the branches from current pilots before deciding one route over the other the better.

Thank you

 

[gderek]

1)Equipment will vary widely. But will generally be similar. Depends who owns the airplanes. Two types. Unit-equipped (own the airplanes) or Associate Unit or Wing (fly active duty airplanes on same base). This line is blurring and will continue to do so. Some guard units will now own their airplanes and active duty folks will also fly them.

2)Depends on the unit that hires you, where you want to work.

3)Always changing

4) See #2

5)Can't speak for the guard, but there are the same similarities, AFOQT, BAT test, Flying Class 1 Medical

6)Don't know, not much

7)Varies widely, just depends when they get training allotment. It can happen fast if you're lucky and the unit pushes your package through.


Bottom line, speaking as a Reservist. There are few differences. Major ones include that the Guard is controlled by the State. Guard tends to be much harder to get into, as far as I can tell. I believe they have less slots. not sure though. Reserves = more slots, but can be more active duty like if you're on the same base. From the Reservist perspective, the Guard has more fun and gets away with more.

I could go on and on but that's it in a nutshell.

Go to whoever will get you in the cockpit. I would focus on getting your testing and physical done first.

 

[Otto77]

1)Equipment will vary widely. But will generally be similar. Depends who owns the airplanes. Two types. Unit-equipped (own the airplanes) or Associate Unit or Wing (fly active duty airplanes on same base). This line is blurring and will continue to do so. Some guard units will now own their airplanes and active duty folks will also fly them.

2)Depends on the unit that hires you, where you want to work.

3)Always changing

4) See #2

5)Can't speak for the guard, but there are the same similarities, AFOQT, BAT test, Flying Class 1 Medical

6)Don't know, not much

7)Varies widely, just depends when they get training allotment. It can happen fast if you're lucky and the unit pushes your package through.


Bottom line, speaking as a Reservist. There are few differences. Major ones include that the Guard is controlled by the State. Guard tends to be much harder to get into, as far as I can tell. I believe they have less slots. not sure though. Reserves = more slots, but can be more active duty like if you're on the same base. From the Reservist perspective, the Guard has more fun and gets away with more.

I could go on and on but that's it in a nutshell.

Go to whoever will get you in the cockpit. I would focus on getting your testing and physical done first.

all his answers = shack! spot on

I am currently in the Guard and shortly about to head to UPT for the Reserves and both are all degrees of good. As mentioned above the Guard gets away with all the fun haha. Reserves often time depending on the unit are located on active duty bases making it a little more like active duty. Overall though, not too many differences between the 2..it boils down to where you want to fly...where slots are available etc. I had chance to fly Guard as well but turned it down to go Reserves..seems to be more steady flying right now going with the unit I got picked with. A lot of options to look at but basically you need to go visit some units near you or call and talk to the folks to get a feel for it. Finally, study up take your tests and then see where you stand. Good Scores, getting a passing FC1 physical, and setting up a strong package can really open up your options to what units you apply to and can realistically gain an interview.

Start networking..Guard/Reserves has a lot of politics and its to your advantage to work the system.

 

[CFIIer]

I'll tell you this from experience. Your #1 priority is getting those physicals done. You've gotta get a MEPS physical, and a FC1 physical. A LOT of people get screwed somewhere in the process of those two.
Getting that FC1 cleared by AETC will take FOREVER!!. That alone, knocked me back a year, because it wasn't cleared within the first 6 months that i got it, so I missed the first board. Reserve Boards only happen twice a year.
I probably can't stress this enough, but get in contact with a recruiter...quick, and have that FC1 scheduled. The brooks physical is another disqualifying factor. That's where you go right before you go to UPT, and they check your eyes, heart, and body measurements one more time. I personally know people that got all the way there and got the boot. So, as you can see, the AFOQT and that BAT test are really the least of your worries. Make sure you can get medically cleared....

Good Luck

 

[cargoflyr69]

I'd recommend the Air National Guard if you dont want to get shot at when you go to work. However, our administration views them at the Air "Inter-national" Guard. Good luck whatever branch you decide on.

 

[RedDogC130]

What the hell does that mean? You won't get shot at when you go to work. Last time I was in the desert they were still shooting at guys.

 

[cargoflyr69]

Just sayin that the National Guard was designed to be the National Guard and not to be deployed to far off foreign lands. The Guard is supposed to be "The Governor's Army" and be in the states ready to be deployed in floods, earthquakes, tornadoes, and other natural disasters.

Many Many people who signed up to be in the Guard were told not to worry about getting deployed Iraqi-kurdi-durka-durkastan, and now they are there fighting for what our government says is the right war. I wish no ill against any of our deployed servicemen, I'm just venting on our curent state of political affairs. sorry if I confused you or pissed you off in the earlier post.

 

[SnackPak]

Hey Cindy,
Keep your political opinions to yourself. This guy was looking for flying advice, not your personal view of international current affairs.

 

[PureMuscle]

What would happen if you did go through the whole process and your about the go to UPT, then don't pass the brooks health evaluation. Would you still have to serve in the military under contact for a cetain amount of time?

 

[CFIIer]

What would happen if you did go through the whole process and your about the go to UPT, then don't pass the brooks health evaluation. Would you still have to serve in the military under contact for a cetain amount of time?

If you were in the guard/reserves you would most likely be released with a general discharge.

 

[bssthound]

I've spent about 10 years in the Air Guard and 10 in the AF Reserve. 20 years goes by very quickly.

In the Reserves there are more opportunities to move around. Different wings fall under numbered Air Forces, like Active Duty. It's much easier for people to move from wing to wing; wing to #ed AF, etc. If you want to stay at one base, no problem. We've had several guys retire at Keesler after being here 25+ years.

One equipment difference is that, to my knowledge, there are no F-15 units in the AF Reserve. There might be an associate wing; I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm pulling a DaveGriffin and just shooting off my piehole without checking facts.

A big difference in the long run is that the Guard's annual training is comprised of "State Mandays." A manday is an active duty day. I don't know the official name for them. You can perform as many as they'll give you; unfortunately, after the first 15 they no longer count as retirement points. Every manday in the Reserves is a federal retirement point. Period. Trust me, it adds up in the long run. It's never too soon to think about retirement.

That being said, be grateful for whatever slot you get. Any flying job in the military is a great job. You will see some great places and work with the best people on this planet. I wish you the best of luck.

 

[pkober]

Cargo FLyer,

Pull your head out ....

Plenty of Guradsmen have died over the past 4 years. As far as the ANG not deploying. We were deployed on March 1, 2003 for six fun filled months in the dessert. After the first two months when ALL the AD Hercs left, the only Hercs in theater were ANG, plus one reserve unit. I'm talking slick Hercs only.

The ANG deploys. Anyone who signs up thinking we don't deploy is smoking a crack pipe. We are part of the military. Most of us serve proudly, regardless of what people like you think.

BTW, the government wasn't "designed" to give welfare, but they do. Does that bother you also?

Go vent somewhere else.

CLAMBAKE

Khallen,

Either ANG or Reserves are good. Just stay away from Active Duty if you can. You can get a civilian career started sooner than if you had the 10 year AD commitment. Also the ANG and Reserves allow you to make your own schedule.

Good Luck.

 

[dtfl]

One other point to bring up - a buddy in the reserves was going to move to an AG unit - he spoke with quite a few folks at 22AF, etc about getting MPA tours, etc. They told him the Reserves get first pick at those - then the guard. So, if you are worried about bumming and picking up tours to Germany, CONAR, C Springs Space Com exec type stuff, etc, C Oak, the reserves give you a better shot.
That's from a # AF person. Not me.

 

[Don Q]

Quoted from: cargoflyr
"Just sayin that the National Guard was designed to be the National Guard and not to be deployed to far off foreign lands. The Guard is supposed to be "The Governor's Army" and be in the states ready to be deployed in floods, earthquakes, tornadoes, and other natural disasters.

Many Many people who signed up to be in the Guard were told not to worry about getting deployed Iraqi-kurdi-durka-durkastan, and now they are there fighting for what our government says is the right war. I wish no ill against any of our deployed servicemen, I'm just venting on our curent state of political affairs. sorry if I confused you or pissed you off in the earlier post."

---
I wish you knew what you were talking about. In my short ANG career I have deployed numerous times to the desert. I have seen many things that you wouldn't even imagine, nor I care to tell you about, to include flying over Iraq and Afghanistan. In addittion, we are getting ready to deploy again to the desert, while our Active Duty counterparts will be going to nicer places (non-combat).
After 9/11 we flew numerous Noble Eagle missions, mainly flown by ANG airplanes all over the US.

Khallen:

Gderek gave you a lot of good info. In my guard unit, there have been recruits that have waited anywhere from 6 months to 2 years to go to UPT. The process is not an easy one, and the competition is very hard. Is better if you know someone in the unit that will guide you to the lenghty process.
Remember, even in the guard, you will be an Officer first, and then a pilot.

With lack of funding, is hard to get a full-time job in the guard. Most of the young guys/gals in my squadron have to find jobs doing something else. By the time the get done with their training and become part-timers (guardsmen) the would not have enough hours to apply for a major airline.

There's a guy in my unit that after getting selected to go to UPT, he didn't pass the Brooks physical due to some lack of "color deficiency" (I believe he couldn't distinguish from some shades of green), he wanted to stay, and now he is an Intelligence Officer.

I have been in the Guard for 10 years, I have enjoyed every minute of it. Now I'm looking for a job, applying for FedEx, UPS, Southwest. I will continue in the guard for various reasons. I love serving my country, while flying airplanes you wouldn't be able to fly anywhere else.

Go with the one that hires you first.
I belive I have given you more than my .02 cents.

Cheers...

Don Q

 

[duece123]

Hey Don,

You say that after FTU, seasoning and a few deployments that guys don’t have enough time to go to the majors. Seeing that it is nearly impossible to land a AGR/TECH job as a 2nd/1st LT, what do the guys in your squadron do that are trying to establish a civilian career? Regionals I guess?

 

[Don Q]

Deuce 123,

One of the guys just started American Eagle training. Another guy with an engineer background, just started a job with a local company. He is inexperience, so he is having a hard time getting his min RAP (sorties) a month. Some other guys/gals have had contracting jobs (from simulators pilots - engineer to lawyers and real estate). There are a couple of guys working for Lockheed-Martin.
I was very lucky to obtain 8 years of Active Duty out of the guard, with a total of 10 yrs of service. Now I'm in a job search mode.
Time in a fighter unit is obtained at 1.0 - 1.2 at a time, and flying at about 8 times per month (on average). So if you do the math, at the 2-3 year point you won't have enough hours to apply to a major airline. Most of the guys go to the Regionals/Commuters to build time fast.

Cheers,
Don Q

 

[psysicx]

How were you able to get 8 yrs AD with the Guard? And is it even possible to bum in a fighter unit?

 

[NWA-AirGuard]

Orginally posted by Bssthound:

"A big difference in the long run is that the Guard's annual training is comprised of "State Mandays." A manday is an active duty day. I don't know the official name for them. You can perform as many as they'll give you; unfortunately, after the first 15 they no longer count as retirement points. Every manday in the Reserves is a federal retirement point. Period. Trust me, it adds up in the long run. It's never too soon to think about retirement."

In the Guard all active duty days (Title 32 or Title 10) count towards retirement. I guard bummed for 4 years. Every year that I bummed I had well over 15 days of Title 32 (State) mandays and they all counted. Both our annual training days and our guard support (we call them Guardlifts) are Title 32. The big problem with Title 32 time is that you can't buy back that time to count towards a civil service retirement, whereas you can buy back all Title 10 time. One more point, all of our AGR's are Title 32.

 

[Don Q]

Maybe Luck

How were you able to get 8 yrs AD with the Guard? And is it even possible to bum in a fighter unit?

For a long time, any pilot candidate that was coming back to the unit, for some reason didn't make it. Some of them didn't get fighter qualified, others didn't even make it to pilot training. So I believe, every fighter squadron needs LTs to make popcorn and stock the bar (I ment Heritage Room), we can say bar anymore, nor we have alcoholic beverages for after a long debrief after a short 1.2 flight.
Seriously now, we deplyed quiet a few times and pre 9/11 we had tons of days in the guards (BTW,Mandays = AT Days which stands for Annual Training). Airlines were doing great, an most of the guys didn's want to drop trips to make 1/8 of what they were making in the airlines. Post 9/11 we (me and another dude) got activated for a year, plus deployments again, and alert missions.
Well, I end up with 8 yrs of AD.

IMO Tittle 32 vs Tittle 10, there's no difference in pay, but it affects you when you are trying to get health benefits, and or education benefits like GI Bill. Therefore the "B-Scale Air Force" we work for. No regrets on what I do though. It's just frustrating trying to get some help from the VA to get a type rating.

Cheers

 

[psysicx]

So I take it your not going to get 8 yrs of AD unless the airlines change? And they don't allow any kind of alcohal anymore?