Ground the Q400

[172driver]

Hey dude,isn't this a bit of a drastic action that you are in favor of???This aircraft,(Dash-8Q400). had a good record up until now!!
Perhaps the problem lies with TRAINING & PROCEDURES???

Any pilot that KNOWS anything knows that you cannot get LOW & SLOW when on an instrument approach in icing conditions!!

And if you knew anything, you would know that the faster you go, the closer you are to a tailplane stall. Extra speed is bad news with ice on the tail.

 

[captain007]

My thoughts go out to the families involved in this horrible accident.

If it is a tail stall that occured, recovery at low altitudes is almost impossible. The Beech Jet has a problem with tail stalls and at netjets we see them every 6 months in training. Pulling back on the yoke, pulling the flaps up, and decreasing thrust (until control is back), is the recovery methods I have been shown. This is a violent act and very difficult to handle.

We will have to wait to see what the NTSB rules as the cause.

Once again this is a sad event in aviation and I wish the best to the families involved.

 

[say again]

Originally Posted by Flyprdu...
You're just a f*ckin idiot. Period.
There should be a minimum IQ required to start a thread.



This coming from the moron that started this thread. You are the f***ckin' idiot. Period.uke:

 

[CheeseDick]

the beechjet had huge tail stall issues.

the heat on it still sucks, but at least you get to try tail stalling in the sim

it still flies

edit: i should've looked two posts above mine. or maybe read the thread first

 

[boilerflyer]

Can someone who flies/flew the Q400 describe the de-icing system on that aircraft? Are there boots on the H and V Stab? Is it automatic? Is there an ice-detection system?

Thanks.

 

[ReverseSensing]

Boots on horizontal and vertical stabs, leading edges, engine inlets, electical props and windows.. can select fast mode, auto/ normal..

Just to be clear, you can select slow or fast auto mode or manual mode. Manual mode is (obviously) manual and not generally used for normal ops; auto mode used for all normal ops. Auto slow is a 3-minute cycle for all six boot sets; auto fast is a 1-minute cycle for all six boot sets. Slow or fast, the cycle is self-homing and will complete one full cycle before turning off, even if selected to off or manual.

There is an ice detection system, with 2 independent ice detection probes. When either probe detects ice, a message flashes on the engine display until the ref speeds switch is selected to INCR, which causes the message to stop flashing. It goes away when ice is no longer detected. Once the ref speeds switch is in the INCR position, the low speed cue, stick shaker and stick pusher calculations are modified accordingly.

 

[NEDude]

How DARE you ruin my hyperbole with facts...

I didn't even look to see who posted it. If I did, I NEVER would have taken you seriously!

How's life treating you these days buddy?

 

[BoilerUP]

Things are good, still holding in there with US3K?

 

[FO 4 Life]

I am still amused that I don't have the facts straight. I said in my first post the ATR was kicked out of the North. I guess if being grounded by the FAA where you could get ice is not being kicked out, well..

From Dec 10, 1994.

"The Federal Aviation Administration yesterday banned two models of propeller-driven commuter planes from flying in conditions when ice is likely to build up on their wings, the first time the agency has issued such an order.

The F.A.A. made the decision after conducting wind tunnel tests in recent weeks on the ATR-72 aircraft, the type of plane that crashed in Roselawn, Ind., in late October, killing all 68 people on board. The plane was operated by American Eagle, a commuter division of American Airlines.

The order affects both the ATR-72 and the ATR-42, a similar but smaller aircraft made by Avions de Transport Regional, a French-Italian consortium formed in 1981. Altogether, there are 153 ATR planes in use in the United States, operated by commuter divisions of Delta Air Lines, Continental Airlines and Trans World Airlines, in addition to American.

Airlines that operate the aircraft said they would move the planes to warmer parts of the country where icing was less likely to occur, a shift that is likely to disrupt air travel for thousands of passengers in coming days. Although these aircraft represent only about 7 percent of this country's commuter airline fleet, they are among the largest commercial propeller-driven aircraft in use."

Did I ever say they never flew up North again? I know ASA flew them out of CVG, in what 2002? They were forced to be moved or grounded until fixed. Still, nothing I said was incorrect. Better now?

 

[Captzaahlie]

Aerodynamic BURN!!!:angryfire

Perhaps the first aerodynamic burn in history?

I believe FI should shut down for a time (moment of posting silence) in honor of our fallen crew mates.

So sad, so tragic, and all we can do is bicker and point fingers.



W

Awesome idea!


flyprdu dork turn your computer off for a long moment of silence.... the longer the better.

A four puke salute goes out to you !
uke: uke: uke: uke: ​

 

[LongBoarder]

You ignorant fool!!

If what people are saying is true, then this airplane is unsafe and needs to be grounded immediately.

Flyprdu...

Please pull your head out... I hope...HOPE... that I am never on your plane in any kind of weather.



3407 Pilot Error Suspected: WSJ Report

Email this article |

Print this article​

By Mary Grady, Contributing Editor

Click for larger image

Investigators studying last week's fatal crash of a Continental Connection Dash 8 Q400 in Buffalo, N.Y., now have found evidence that pilot inputs to the controls may have contributed to the airplane's stall, The Wall Street Journal reported on Wednesday, citing sources close to the investigation. The flight data recorders show that the flight was routine until roughly a minute before impact, when the crew lowered the landing gear and extended the flaps, according to the WSJ sources. Almost immediately, the airspeed bled off and the stick-shaker activated, followed by a stick-pusher that automatically lowered the nose. It appears the captain pulled back on the stick with enough force to overpower the pusher and added power, causing a 31-degree pitch-up. The wings immediately stalled, and the airplane whipped to the left, then entered a steep right turn. The pilots continued to fight with the controls, and they were starting to recover when they "ran out of altitude," according to the WSJ source. NTSB member Steven Chealander, speaking to The New York Times earlier this week, urged "caution about jumping to conclusions that it might be an icing incident."

 

[mtsupilot376]

The Q400 still has a lesser fail rate than the space shuttle or your xbox 360. One tragedy out of how many million successful flights doesn't quite require us to throw the whole airplane away.

that made me chuckle a bit!