Great lakes furloughs.... $ for approach charts

[Vavso]

Light hearted turned sour

all that aside forget knocking me on a personal level. Why do you take the no chart issue so personally . Your position from the beginning aside from the slothe ( wow such a bold criticism ) issue has been very defensive of your employer . I understand they gave you a job .I am very pleased you are employed . I would suggest we end this discussion because its not getting us any place. YOU have everything on the line . Like "big brother " I do not so do yourself a favor and belittle someone else. Dont crap where you eat or the sloth might be done with you .

I hope all your dreams come true and you fix your labor issues the guys ( and girls ) deserve better . In the meantime I will have another sip of my umbrella drink. Its obvious you are a company man .... Hey is that chief pilot job still open ??



"Oh the anonymity of the internet you get to reach out and touch someone without them touching you back "

 

[moonship]

Well back on subject. I too am a Lakes CA and I do not mind a bit that we only have one set of plates. Beyond the fact that it is not realistic to think that we have the room for more binders up front, the fact that we are backed up by no automation means that the pilot flying IMO should not be taking away from their scan on an approach to reference a plate. No matter how short a time they look away the airplane can get away from you on an approach very quickly and I personally don't want the PF doing anything but just being the PF! I understand how some could think that this is a major issue however I comfortably can say that a through approach briefing by the PF followed by solid CRM with good communication and situational awareness mitigates any issues with only having one plate. Per my logbook I did 22 approaches last month, 16 of them non-p wihtout vectors and not once did, nor have I every, said that they would have been safer with a second plate.

If the intent of this threat was to have a discussion about the practicality or safety of only have one set of plates that message was lost but the implication that furloughing here has anything to do with FO's not having plates. This has been the practice here since the days of old so to put the two together in the same sentence is starting to become Micheal Moore logic.

 

[Freebrd]

If the intent of this threat was to have a discussion about the practicality or safety of only have one set of plates that message was lost but the implication that furloughing here has anything to do with FO's not having plates. This has been the practice here since the days of old so to put the two together in the same sentence is starting to become Micheal Moore logic.

As it was in the earlier mentioned GP Express crash. They didn't make the turn as called for in the missed appr & hit that mountain by flying straight. It can be done w/out both seats having charts, but much safer if both have them. That's why the NTSB mentioned it.

 

[JohnnyP]

.....

I am currently immersed in the "only one set of plates" arrangement now in my 2 crew plane.

I would much rather go with my previous 121 norm, to having both guys have a plate attached to the yoke to look at, but what are ya gonna do I guess?...when in rome......

Once you leave most of the 121 op's, it becomes what I like to call "crazy town"....I wish the only complaint I had was our lack of a current set of second plates.

On the safety side, I do think it is less safe having only one set of plates while the other guy goes off memory, DA scribbled on his yoke paper, etc...

Just wait until you run across hand-made "Jungle Jepps" to obscure remote strips......Then its gnarly time, game on!!.....

 

[Trogdor]

The only thing preventing me from career progression is the economy . Plain and simple .

Perhaps the only thing preventing you from career progression is the fact that you only have 1400 hours. Do you think with your vast experience you should be in the left seat of a 777? I've got some bad news for you sunshine, when the hiring resumes, chumps like you will be sitting right seat in an RJ for a LONG LONG time, enjoy it.

 

[CopilotDoug]

Perhaps the only thing preventing you from career progression is the fact that you only have 1400 hours. Do you think with your vast experience you should be in the left seat of a 777? I've got some bad news for you sunshine, when the hiring resumes, chumps like you will be sitting right seat in an RJ for a LONG LONG time, enjoy it.

Chumps like "him"??? You're waiting to go back to your RJ, dude! You already know the pot and kettle thing...

 

[moonship]

RJ? E-190 is US Airways MAINLINE and that's the seat he is going to go back to... Yeah you sure showed him.

 

[CopilotDoug]

RJ? E-190 is US Airways MAINLINE and that's the seat he is going to go back to... Yeah you sure showed him.

So AAA flies RJ's. I hear their pay could use improvements too.

 

[Crash Pad]

So I went from Lakes to another airline that has one of these alternate bricks. So there I am diverting to ORD in IMC. I crack open the brick to discover... wait for it... Only one set of charts. It gets worse. The charts are only the approach plates. No arrivals, departures, taxi diagrams, etc...

Guess what we somehow managed to get the plane on the ground. I didn't write to congress about the reduced safety of an alternate brick. We don't even train single plate approaches in training.

While everyone is screaming on this site how many dual plate airlines have done a runway incursion. I will shock the world and tell you that a lot of times both pilots don't have the taxi diagram out!

Note: I have restrained from any of the macho stuff. I still think that lakes washes a load of pilots in training. Many of those pilots go on to great careers in jets, etc... As a former laker I can say it's not for everyone. That said it was the most fun and best time many of us have had in aviation. RICKSHAW!

 

[Vavso]

Thanks guys

"Chumps like me" Another one that knows me and my circumstances . To those who post to this thread civily thanks . To others who decided to begin character assasination and name calling ...if thats what you have to do to feel better about yourself I am sorry.
Unfortunately in this industry filled with young aspiring airline pilots and the cut throat business the lines get blurry . Not everyone aspires to be an airline captain or fly f-16's .

Now that this thread is suffering from agonal respiration lets just let it die already . Thanks " two time loser + chump" signing off