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Great Article about United's "Drastic" Pay Cuts - Check It Out....

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"The government tries to keep the legacy carriers in business because their chances of long term survival is greater".

Or maybe they have more political clout. If the legacies are better, then were is Braniff, EAL, PAA. Perhaps keeping U alive is the worst thing possible, since it negates the laws of the market place and places a larger burden on all carriers. If U were to fail, DAL, AMR, UAL etc. would pick up the slack and we could well see an increase in farelevels with less capacity. Keeping capacity high, by propping up failing carriers is a recipe for disaster. Not only for the business, but also for the employees. Point in case, U cancelled the pension, now UAL seem poised to follow and AA has said they are watching UAL. Had U disappeared, that may perhaps not have happened.

"Re-regulation would not be bad. It would allow competition to increase, with fewer airlines theirs fewer sets, and supply and demand would raise prices.

Reregulation would not be bad for who, UAL, AMR? Oh, I am sure they are longing for the old days. I cannot believe, that you said reregulating the industry would increase competetion, since it would do exactly the opposite and hence is why the legacies wish for it to happen. Yes, it would raise fares, probably to the point that we would see a dramtic dcrease in passengers.

Reregulation ransk right up there with a wet dream, featuring Heidi, for the legacy execs.

"Don't kid youself about economics, people are wealthier now than every before".

Oh really, and pray tell, what do you base that on? W-2s or spendable income. If that truly was the case, then how come the elasticity of the market place, particularily airlines, says differently. Tell you what , since people have so much money, why are they not flying in business or first? Or could it be, that both discretiory consumer and business spending is down, which would indicate troubled financial times?
 
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Would you all just cut the crap about LCC's undercutting fares? My company puts us on the cheapest flights available. Who are we riding on? UAL.

Last week, I did LAX-JFK-WAW(Warsaw). We paid $2,000 for a business class, two-day advance purchase, refundable ticket. The JFK-WAW portion was on LOT but it was a UAL codeshare. Others are travelling this weekend(busiest of the year) and who are they flying? UAL again.

The closest we've gotten to a LCC is ATA... Once and that was for scheduling purposes.

The Ch. 11 dwellers are giving away tickets to generate cash flow. There would be a very different price structure if no one was in Ch. 11.TC
 
Dave Benjamin said:
UAL arguably has some of the best training and CRM programs in the industry. Wouldn't replacing the talented company instructors with contractors possibly alter their admirable safety record, potentially costing far more than it could save?

If done correctly, the pilots will not notice the difference. When hiring Contract Instructors, you can simply hire United Pilots that are over 60 years old & can not fly anymore. The problem with using Line Pilots for training is that it is very expensive, in fact, having a professional instructor in the simulator or in the classroom may actualy improve training.
 
Midnight Mike said:
If done correctly, the pilots will not notice the difference. When hiring Contract Instructors, you can simply hire United Pilots that are over 60 years old & can not fly anymore. The problem with using Line Pilots for training is that it is very expensive, in fact, having a professional instructor in the simulator or in the classroom may actualy improve training.
Yes, it is expensive to have line pilots training in the sim. However, I believe that it is well worth the money. I have been through many training programs at many different airlines. My training at UAL was, by far, the best training I have ever had. Having a line pilot in the sim also gives the instructor a better perspective and can bring some real world experience to the training environment.

I've flown with "professional" instructors at other companies. Some were over age 60 and some weren't. They didn't even come close to the level of an instructor at United.

United instructors go through a rigorous application process and then will be a prodigy for about a year before they can instruct on their own. It really didn't matter who was intstructing me, all the instructors expected the same result. There was a high degree of continuity between the instructors so I never feared getting stuck with some unfair jacka$$ in the sim.

I just don't see how having outside contractors instruct UAL pilots would improve training.

Cheers!

GP
 
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To keep it short and simple how can an airline make any money when the cost of a ticket is cheaper today then it was 20 years ago.!!!!!!!!! I cant think of any service ( ticket) that is the same or cheaper today than it was 20 years ago. How much did it cost to ride a train or greyhound 20 years ago? get your car fixed?The public has become to acustomed and expects a cheap airfare eveythime they fly. The truth is people will still fly in the same numbers if they had to pay more. A round trip ticket from ORD to LAX for 189 dollars would sell just as many seats as a 325-350 dollar fare would. Why becuase it still the cheapest way to travel for your time and money!!!!!! and if you lose the occasional vacation person or family because they thinks it to high the 150 dollars more each sold for will take care of that so you would have less passengers and making the same money.
 
Wrong dream

People will not fly in the same numbers if everyone raises prices, they will go back to driving and taking the Greyhound bus. Demand/Price is an elastic curve; prices go up riders go down.

 
Pilotyip,
pilotyip said:
People will not fly in the same numbers if everyone raises prices, they will go back to driving and taking the Greyhound bus. Demand/Price is an elastic curve; prices go up riders go down.

For arguments sake what would happen in the long run if firms exited the market and the incumbents cut capacity, reduced supply?
 
Vik said:
Heck, pilots will fly for nearly free. Just put an ad for a 744 FO, 500hrs TT / 100 ME, $17k/yr and you'll have a line 50 miles long.
I think many pilots, especially young or new ones, are blind optimists. They think that if they can just get their foot in the door that they will be one of the lucky ones. But in some ways maybe being an optimist is better than being jaded and bitter like some of the other pilots I see posting here. The best attitude is probably somewhere in-between
 
Fair enough. I am the one w/ the 744 avatar! ;)

Indigo said:
I think many pilots, especially young or new ones, are blind optimists. They think that if they can just get their foot in the door that they will be one of the lucky ones. But in some ways maybe being an optimist is better than being jaded and bitter like some of the other pilots I see posting here. The best attitude is probably somewhere in-between
 

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