Good Luck to the AMR Folks

[Old School 737]

Aren't the pensions frozen? I don't think that getting out with a lump sum's an option anymore.

I think they can freeze them if they get down to a certain % of funding vs liabilities.. So they might not have reached that point yet .. I hope not and guys bail tomarrow.. With the lump.. Might not need to lay off if enough go!

 

[Abernathy]

Furloughing the age 60+ guys first would save the company the most money........

 

[waveflyer]

Furloughing the age 60+ guys first would save the company the most money........

APA should work with the company to mitigate this somehow-

 

[johnsonrod]

CNBC Saying 400 pilots to be furloughed ..... not good

Ouch! I am sure this is very upsetting to many AMR pilots - but if I were in the bottom 400 pilots, perhaps leaving and finding another gig at a faster-growing company (i.e., Spirit, JB, SWA, Emirates and even Delta in a year or two when it starts to hire) would be a much better bet. Nobody wants the stress of being on the bottom of a big, broken company like AMR - especially in this economy!

 

[outerlimits]

Furloughing the age 60+ guys first would save the company the most money........

This should be post of the year.

 

[rod farva]

And unfortunately, how much the regionals will grow?

Sad but true.

 

[brokedash]

Any word on if it will be actually fourloughs are will the let attrition run its course first. Any word on buyouts for the ultra senior guys?

 

[On Your Six]

Got this from another website. This is supposedly the term sheet from AMR to the APA. Not good.





Click here: http://www.restructuringamr.com/documents/APA%20Term%20Sheet%20Source%20Document_v10_FINAL_CLEAN.pdf





Godspeed!


The OYSter

 

[Ty Webb]

What is saddest is that all of these pilots were just recalled within the last year or so after nearly a decade on furlough. I know some of these pilots left other flying gigs to come back.....

Amen. Not to mention the TWA guys who have already been through the wringer . . . What absolute buffoonery.

 

[Abernathy]

APA should work with the company to mitigate this somehow-

The best the company would do is offer an early retirement package of which a very small percentage of these 60+ guys will take. AA could argue in court that the 60+ pilots are flying on borrowed time anyway and are the heaviest financial burden.

Don't think it will work. Though we all wish it would.

 

[AC560]

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=146472

Waveflyer has it spot on pilots gave up 35% why give up more and the pensions are protected! End of the day this is going to cost the employees of AMR a lot more than if they would have coughed out some concessions. It never was going to cost Executive Management whichever way the ball bounced but certainly will impact a lot of middle managers who have lead instead of golden parachutes. When is anyone going to figure out the C level guys don't lose, if you play chicken with them you will always lose.

Collective bargaining is more akin to collectively stupid these days.

 

[nwaf16dude]

AMR would have declared bankruptcy no matter what concessions the pilots gave them before hand. Now they would just be starting from a lower point.

 

[AC560]

AMR would have declared bankruptcy no matter what concessions the pilots gave them before hand. Now they would just be starting from a lower point.

Arpey was against bankruptcy and resigned as a result of it, it cost him money. What leads you to believe bankruptcy was inevitable? In either case you aren't negotiating with AMR anymore you are negotiating with a judge, the employees of AMR lose in this no matter how you slice it.

 

[nwaf16dude]

The financial data led me (and lots of smarter people) to that conclusion. This was more about long-term debt and lack of revenue that it was about employee cost. The run on the pensions in the last few months prior to the filing was the final nail. Of course all of the press releases blame it on employee cost, but that was only a small piece of the problem at AA. Yep, this will suck for the employees, no way around that. I have several friends there, and I wish them well. Been there, done that. It sucks.

 

[AC560]

This was more about long-term debt and lack of revenue that it was about employee cost.

Employee cost is about the only thing which you can consistently and rapidly control. During the recession most companies got by with flat or shrinking revenue, ebitda grew through shrinking costs. At an airline about the only cost you can shrink after removing a couple of olives off the salads is through shrinking employee cost.

I would be really surprised if any union outside the pilots union makes it through, the pensions are gone, and the lost wages on the pilot side (ignoring the furloughs) is going to take years for employees to recoup.

Your right the writing was on the wall and there was a choice to be made and everyone chose bankruptcy.