Good…embarrassing…or just plain out of touch?

[tomgoodman]

To give credit to Bubba, even though he promised higher taxes, he did help kill the insane luxury tax.

It also helped that many of the yachts were built in Maine, home state of the Senate Majority Leader.

 

[OHGOON]

the deaf ears of the moocher class.

satisfying the emotional needs of the moocher class.

Most Democrat leaders (other than the Choomster) know that raising taxes during a recession will drive the economy deeper into the ditch, they don't care.

Senior Democrats will still get rich. They'll get jobs as 7 figure 'coordinators' in non-profits, subsidized green energy firms, or lobbying firms.

It's only the proles like you and me who will suffer.

Not a bad post if you could have only avoided your baser prejudices and borderline racist remarks about our current president.

References to the so called "Moocher class" really worked out well in the current economic climate, just ask the latest classless disaster that ran on the Republican ticket. Almost made one miss the Alaskan Christian Dominatrix...she was at least something to look at as long as you turned off the sound completely.

Just to set the record straight. No new luxury tax is being considered and the rich might only be asked to pay what they paid during bubba's days when the US enjoyed the longest economic expansion in it's entire history. Hardly an insurmountable tax burden set to destroy it all.

Give it a rest already, the rich have had an incredible run. From another perspective, they are the actual moochers, living ever larger while the rest of us suck wind. All that is actually happening is the pendulum has begun to swing back for the first time since 1980. Most people in the US (except for white anglo saxon males) seem no longer so easily convinced that "feeding the rich" at all costs to themselves, is such a great recipe for a brighter future.

BTW: Are you part of the "moocher class" if you get a nice fat Home Owner deduction? How about you will probably enjoy a nice cushy military pension while still young enough to continue flying somewhere else? (You will have earned it, I'm sure, but it still comes out of our collective pockets last I checked.) Not to mention that this whole thread is about justifying another tax break for the rich so we can keep our jobs. In other words the rest of the country should pony up whatever it takes for you and I to keep flying that cushy million dollar jet?? Me thinks most folks would call this something much worse than a moocher, a hypo......

 

[JimNtexas]

borderline racist remarks about our current president

So now it's racist to quote from one of the many autobiographies that our President has written?

You know what is really racist? Saying that because the President is part African-American means he can't handle criticism.

the rich might only be asked to pay what they paid during bubba's days when the US enjoyed the longest economic expansion in it's entire history.

OK fine, let's put taxes back where they were during the 90s.

BUT let's reduce government spending to 19% of GDP as it was back then.

Currently the government is consuming 25% of GDP, and projected to go over 40% in the near term.

Oh, and of course to get back to the Clinton economy we have to cancel Obamacare for the same reason Clinton dropped Hillarycare. And we have to roll back regulations to the level of the Clinton era.

No new luxury tax is being considered

.

I hope you're right about that, but plenty of new taxes are being considered, and each new tax inhibits economic growth. The luxury tax fiasco was a teachable moment about the huge unintended consequence of tax increases.

Too bad Obama voters can't learn from the past.

 

[OHGOON]

JimNtexas,

I didn't mean the term you used was racist but your underlying vitriol. What I mean is, there is just no way, Obama would inspire this kind of open disrespect and hatred if it was just about how he conducts himself or his record. Secondly, he handles criticism better than anyone I have ever met, certainly better than most folk on this board.

I'm fine with everything else you suggest and I would go further. Let's cut back the ridiculously bloated defense budget which has nothing to do with actual National Security anymore and everything to do with greedy government funded corporations who cannot produce anything of value other than overpriced & over budget weapons systems designed for the Cold War era. I agree with cancelling Obama Care too. Let's get rid of that compromised mess and have a nice clean, efficient single payer plan (Universal Health Care) and kill off these stupidly greedy health insurance companies in the process. How about that for cost savings? Look at most of Europe, their economies may not be what you would like but most countries provide way better healthcare services at a much reduced cost both to consumers and their government. The argument that people have to wait for stuff sometimes is just so much overwrought BS. People wait here too, some even die when their medically untrained private for profit HMO "claims specialist" decides they don't qualify for a procedure. Or how about the 50 million without any kind of insurance, how long do you think they have to wait in their local emergency rooms? Do you think they are able to immediately run out and get an MRI whenever their Docs (who they don't actually have) prescribe one?

Oh and yes, let's roll back regulations. That's worked out splendidly in the not so recent past, i.e. Enron, Lehman Brothers, and the whole 2008 crash. Man were you in a coma when all that happened?

Obama voters actually have learned from the past, it's why the Dinosaur Party got it's ass kicked despite the economy still being in the dumpster! Just in case you haven't noticed, we are in the majority despite what Mr. Rove and Mr. Morris so hilariously tried to spin away on election eve. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8ugUhWIpwQ

Most folks, who are paying attention, have long since realized that the trickle down theory or rather the tinkle on theory (as in getting pissed on) did not and will not work for them in the future. Good luck with continuing on selling stale old discredited ideas. Maybe secession could be an option for you?

The point is that in the real world, outside of the Republican bubble, there are no clear black and white ideological answers. There really is only boring, down the middle compromise and that includes the rich paying a little more. The free ride is over; if that costs a few jets, then maybe those shouldn't be flying around in the first place. After all wasn't the mess the fracs are in caused mostly by overselling the product to people who ultimately couldn't afford it long term?

 

[JimNtexas]

JimNtexas,

I didn't mean the term you used was racist but your underlying vitriol. What I mean is, there is just no way, Obama would inspire this kind of open disrespect and hatred if it was just about how he conducts himself or his record. Secondly, he handles criticism better than anyone I have ever met, certainly better than most folk on this board.

That's pretty funny considering how much naked hatred your party showered on President Bush for 8 years. And President Bush never suggested that anyone take 'revenge' on anyone because of it.

Let's cut back the ridiculously bloated defense budget which has nothing to do with actual National Security anymore and everything to do with greedy government funded corporations who cannot produce anything of value other than overpriced & over budget weapons systems designed for the Cold War era.

So your solution for greedy government is more government? And defense is the only area that is going to be cut.

I agree with cancelling Obama Care too. Let's get rid of that compromised mess and have a nice clean, efficient single payer plan (Universal Health Care) and kill off these stupidly greedy health insurance companies in the process. How about that for cost savings? Look at most of Europe, their economies may not be what you would like but most countries provide way better healthcare services at a much reduced cost both to consumers and their government.

Oh yes, let's be more like Greece or France. What could go wrong? Obamacare seems to be designed by someone who took all the worst features of every other national health plan and rolled it into one horrible ugly ball of special interest favors.

The argument that people have to wait for stuff sometimes is just so much overwrought BS. People wait here too, some even die when their medically untrained private for profit HMO "claims specialist" decides they don't qualify for a procedure.

Google UK national health service 'pathway to death'.

Or how about the 15 million without any kind of insurance, how long do you think they have to wait in their local emergency rooms?

Fixed it for you.

Oh and yes, let's roll back regulations. That's worked out splendidly in the not so recent past, i.e. Enron, Lehman Brothers, and the whole 2008 crash.

Yes, lets roll back regulations that let people buy houses they could not possibly afford. Good idea. Let's roll back Fannie and Freddie. President Bush begged the democrats to get the mortgage industry under control, and the Democrats said he hated poor people.

Man were you in a coma when all that happened?

No, in fact I understand that corrupt democrats and regulators were at the heart of the crash.

Obama voters actually have learned from the past, it's why the Dinosaur Party got it's *** kicked despite the economy still being in the dumpster!

The Dinosaur party lost because the government schooling system has produced enough people who cannot handle even simple numbers.

 

[OHGOON]

1)I don't have a party but if you mean progressive, liberal thinkers, then their hatred came about because "W" was an unqualified imbecile completely out of his league who tried unsuccessfully to cover that up with boundless arrogance. The crash happened on his watch and was brought on by grossly inadequate financial regulation. I guess you just don't want to see that.

Obama on the other hand, is at the very least intelligent and tries to build bipartisan consensus when and wherever possible. How's it his fault that he was confronted at every turn by a rabid GOP which made it their expressed and seemingly only goal to unelect him. I guess that brilliant strategy backfired...:laugh:

2)My solution is effective government, you know the kind that pays and trains its pilots & navigators to be the best in the world. Judging from your profile one would have thought you would know that by now. I never said other things should not be cut, you assumed that. I said, I would go further...You know what they say about assuming, it makes an a$$ out of...you know, right?

3) Having a little trouble with your geography, how did that go over in the backseat? Greece and France are all over the news and especially vilified by the Fixed News crowd, however there are others. Ever look into Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Germany, Britain, and yes even France? They all provide better healthcare. Your favorite, France, is actually ranked #1 while the US, "THE BEST IN THE WORLD AT EVERYTHING", is ranked between Costa Rica and Slovenia at #37. :0

Take a look for yourself..

http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html


http://www.businessinsider.com/best-healthcare-systems-in-the-world-2012-6?op=1

BTW: Why is Obamacare such an issue for you? I don't like it very much either but it's a step, albeit a small one, in the right direction. Universal Healthcare is what works best and has proven itself to be the most cost effective. Did you bother clicking on the links above? Secondly, if you are in the military you already have access to such a healthcare system, managed by your government from now until you expire. Why is it good enough for you but not the rest of us??

4) No earthly reason to google that. I can get the same hype from the the "Wrong" Media anywhere. I have actually lived abroad and have experienced Universal Healthcare including France. Have you? It seems you enjoy loosing yourself in propaganda and paranoia, I prefer numbers and facts.

5)Nope it's 50% +/-, you fixed nothing but tried to cloud the issue in your favor. Nice try but no cigar.

According to the United States Census Bureau, in 2009 there were 50.7 million people in the US (16.7% of the population)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_insurance_coverage_in_the_United_States

The number of people without health insurance coverage declined from 50.0 million in 2010 to 48.6 million in 2011, as did the percentage without coverage - from 16.3 percent in 2010 to 15.7 percent in 2011.

http://www.census.gov/newsroom/releases/archives/income_wealth/cb12-172.html

6) No let's actually not roll back regulations. Thanks for making my point here. The crash happened because of too little regulation and not because of too much! What happened in the Housing sector was pure BS and folks should have gone to jail. Didn't happen because the elite looks out for itself first and foremost. Bush never begged anyone and he caved to Wall Street like they all do because those boys have the cash to buy anyone they want in Washington. Grow up will ya.

7) You "understand" very little! If not a coma, then you must have been suffering from a serious psychotic delusional state to believe the crash happened because of Democrats and Regulators. The actual crash and subsequent TARP bailout happened under "W" and his Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson. Obama had not even been elected yet. Regulators are executive branch political appointees for the most part. So since Bush was GOP, it stands to reason they were GOP too.

8) Yes I agree that our Public Schools are an embarrassment for the most part. However the Dinosaur Party lost despite people being relative uneducated, not because of it. In other words the majority of people figured out that the GOP was not good for them despite not having very many intellectual tools at their disposal to arrive at that conclusion. Not even the massive amounts of private billionaire money spent to confuse and obfuscate the issues further could hide the ugly truth that Republicans are just out for themselves and the rich.

BTW, who de-funded the Federal School Budget on a massive scale first? Maybe you're to young to remember, but it was Ronny Reagan, that doddering old fool you "right" thinkers worship as a demigod now.

 

[gret]

Geez man...you used 80 lines of text, over 4,600 characters, 783 words. Way too much!

I made it thru high school and this is even tough for me to follow.

Any comments about-
The thread topic..unions...ooops sorry...taxes.
The bravery of the Michigan legislature and governor.
AIN Alerts today talking about frax activity for the month down 12.2% in 2012 versus 2011.

Argus: Business Aircraft Flying Slumps in November

After posting a gain in October, business aircraft flying hit a patch of turbulence last month, falling 2.3 percent year-over-year, according to TraqPak data released yesterday by aviation services company Argus. These results were partially weighed downed by the temporary shutdown of Avantair’s flight operations from late October to mid-November, Argus noted. But it wasn’t all bad news–Part 135 activity, which took a big hit over the past two years, logged a consecutive increase last month, rising 5.6 percent versus a year ago. (In October, this operational category climbed 9.7-percent year-over-year.) Part 91 flying last month slipped by 3.6 percent from November 2011, while activity at the fractional providers fell 12.2 percent. By aircraft categories, light jet activity rose 2 percent from a year ago, while midsize and large-cabin flying fell modestly, decreasing 0.8 percent and 0.3 percent, respectively. Turboprop flying dipped by 7.1 percent year-over-year, in large part due to Avantair. Looking at individual market segments, Part 135 light jets posted the biggest year-over-year increase, up 11 percent. Fractional turboprops recorded the largest decline, dropping an astounding 40.6 percent from a year ago–again due to the voluntary grounding at Avantair. Argus TraqPak data provides “serial-number-specific aircraft arrival and departure information on all IFR flights in the U.S.”

 

[OHGOON]

Well Gret,

at least it proves you can count. Good for you.

Short enough for ya??

 

[gret]

Yup...

Smart man once told me...you can't make a mistake by listening...

He also said...The supreme being gave us two ears and only one mouth for a reason...

Also...nothing is as good as it seems or as bad...

He just wouldn't stop with the pearls of wisdom...he eventually got fired because he drove the boss batty...

 

[HalinTexas]

Interesting that we can blame "selective-regulation" for the '08 crash, but not the many years of solid growth under the same.

Don't get me started on the FED.

W. passed TARP, not BO.

Don't forget the 1986 Tax Reform Act that almost killed off GA as well as yacht building. I fear we may be repeating ourselves. Don't worry, some Chinese government sponsored group will come and save the day like Cirrus Aircraft.

 

[gret]

또는 한국인들...

 

[HalinTexas]

또는 한국인들...

I'd be surprised if they have any effect on commercial aviation.

 

[gret]

Agreed, but they're everywhere...they're smart and have a lot of dough. China is much more likely...

 

[OHGOON]

5)Nope it's 50% +/-....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_insurance_coverage_in_the_United_States
http://www.census.gov/newsroom/releases/archives/income_wealth/cb12-172.html

ooops I made a booboo here.

I meant to use "million" rather than % here. Sorry! It's 50,000,000 +/- people without any healthcare coverage at all in the USA, not 15,000,000 people like JimNtexas tried to claim.

I also apologize for quoting myself but this site doesn't allow any editing of your own posts after one hour of initially posting it, so this is the only way.

 

[JimNtexas]

1)I don't have a party but if you mean progressive, liberal thinkers, then their hatred came about because "W" was an unqualified imbecile completely out of his league who tried unsuccessfully to cover that up with boundless arrogance. The crash happened on his watch and was brought on by grossly inadequate financial regulation. I guess you just don't want to see that.

Obama on the other hand, is at the very least intelligent and tries to build bipartisan consensus

Good example of the kind of irrational hate-speech that spews from Obama's herd like followers.

Here's a good article on Obama's negotiating skills compared to real Presidents.

Unlike his predecessors, President Obama has not achieved any positive-sum legislative compromises with the other party. His only major deals with Republicans were the extension of all tax rates two years ago and the summer 2011 budget deal. The President now defines both of those laws as mistakes and losses rather than as honorable compromises. He sees and frames them as the results of zero-sum negotiations in which Republicans forced him to accept bad policy outcomes. And now when he has leverage, he thinks and hopes he can turn the tables, not recognizing that he still needs Speaker Boehner and House Republican votes.

President Reagan did Social Security and tax reform deals with Democrats. President Bush 41 did a budget deal and the Americans with Disabilities Act with Democrats. President Clinton did NATFA, and welfare reform, and a balanced budget with Republicans. President Bush did the 2001 tax cut, No Child Left Behind, Medicare, two energy bills, and TARP with Democrats. Each President defined these deals as success, as principled compromises, and both parties shared the credit.

President Obama has not negotiated a single win-win middle ground legislative compromise with the other political party.

2)My solution is effective government [snip]
BTW: Why is Obamacare such an issue for you? I don't like it very much either but it's a step, albeit a small one, in the right direction....

Like all Democrats, when confronted with the many failures of socialism your argument boils down to 'they didn't do it right, but when I'm in charge socialism will finally work'.

There is not enough storage on this server to related all the disastrous effects that Obamacare is going to inflict on this country. One current Obamacare fiasco is an exact analog to the luxury tax on boats we discussed earlier.

Obamacare taxes medical devices. This of course means that there will be fewer medical devices, that many people who make medical devices will lose their jobs, and that medical care will be both more expensive and less effective than it would have been without Obamacare.

Like most of Obamacare, it starts kicking in right after the election. Having voted for Obama, Democrats are now scrambling to avoid blame for this Obamacare disaster.

A group of 17 Democratic U.S. senators and senators-elect have signed a letter urging for a delay in implementing a tax on the medical-device industry that is scheduled to go into effect Jan. 1.”

5)Nope it's 50% +/-, you fixed nothing but tried to cloud the issue in your favor.

You're right, it's 15 percent of the population (including I think non-citizens), not 15 million as I incorrectly stated. The sad thing is that these 15%, along with people with prior existing condition issues, could have been easily covered a combination of allowing interstate competition in medical insurance, high deductible medical plans combined with medical savings accounts designed to encourage people to buy them before they get sick and some reform of regulations concerning pre-existing conditions.

Its sad that neither Bush nor Clinton elected to pursue such a simple course that would not have involved creation the gigantic Frankenstein monster that is Obamacare.

6) No let's actually not roll back regulations. Thanks for making my point here. The crash happened because of too little regulation and not because of too much!

There was more regulation under Bush than under Clinton. Had we not had Barney Frank then the crash would have been much softer had Bush been allowed to change regulations on mortages to allow banks to not give loans to people for houses that they couldn't afford.

The crash was caused by regulations.

8) Yes I agree that our Public Schools are an embarrassment for the most part.

We agree on this, but why do you think more government will fix this problem?

BTW, who de-funded the Federal School Budget on a massive scale first?

That's a good one for mythbusters.

District of Columbia schools have some of the highest spending per student in the country, and Washington DC is the richest city in the country. By your logic, they should therefore have the best schools. In fact, DC schools are among the worst in the country.

Pumping money into government monopoly schools does nothing to help students.

President Bush sent his kids to public schools here in Austin. Where do Obama's kids go to school?

 

[OHGOON]

Ok, JimNtexas,

(lacing on the gloves...)
:beer:

Good example of the kind of irrational hate-speech that spews from Obama's herd like followers.

What's irrational? Bush was definitely sharp as a bowling ball!

Sorry that you are having trouble with reality. Obama's "herd" won. "Dinosaurs" lost (Tit for Tat, can do that all day long). Keep up the good work, it will insure that in two years the House will be under Democratic control too...

Here's a good article on Obama's negotiating skills compared to real Presidents.

Oh boy, Keith Hennessey? Really??

Assistant to "W" for Economic Policy and Director of the U.S. National Economic Council from 2007 until the end of Bush's second term in office. That means he was there during the crash. If that is who you see as an expert, no wonder you're confused.

BTW: Obama is a real as it gets bro. Get used to it. As much as you would like to deny it, he is your President and in your case your Commander in Chief to boot!

I wonder... by your logic, was President Lincoln not a "real" President either because he freed the slaves? At the time that was not viewed by some as a very sound economic decision either.

Like all Democrats, when confronted with the many failures of socialism your argument boils down to 'they didn't do it right, but when I'm in charge socialism will finally work'.

There is not enough storage on this server to related all the disastrous effects that Obamacare is going to inflict on this country. One current Obamacare fiasco is an exact analog to the luxury tax on boats we discussed earlier.

Obamacare taxes medical devices. This of course means that there will be fewer medical devices, that many people who make medical devices will lose their jobs, and that medical care will be both more expensive and less effective than it would have been without Obamacare.

Like most of Obamacare, it starts kicking in right after the election. Having voted for Obama, Democrats are now scrambling to avoid blame for this Obamacare disaster.

A group of 17 Democratic U.S. senators and senators-elect have signed a letter urging for a delay in implementing a tax on the medical-device industry that is scheduled to go into effect Jan. 1.”

Obamacare hasn't even been fully implemented yet and already it's a complete failure? Please could you be any more dramatic?

I don't very much like it either because it still allows private interests (Health Insurance & Pharmaceutical Companies, etc) to make usury like profits from other human beings' illnesses, but it's not the end of the world.

Health Insurance will very soon be seen as a Human Right and not just a privilege arbitrarily determined by your economic status of the moment.

Single Payer Systems are the fairest way, both medically and economically, to take care of all borne out by statistics everywhere else on this planet. Please refer to my previous post because you must have missed my link.

http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html

Comparing medical devices to Luxury Yachts? Let's see more expensive yacht due to taxation, I think I'll by a row boat, but even rich people won't choose to die rather than go get a little more expensive x-ray or MRI. LOL

The only thing this tax will do is it may reduce some of the medically unnecessary and pure profit driven purchases of such devices. That will reduce overall costs for both the government and us, the consumer, because there will be less economic incentives to over-prescribe these types of procedures. It may hurt the profit margins of some medical device makers but they will adapt. They always do. They also have lots of lobby money to try to influence our politicians, hence your link.

Obamacare is no reason for panic, really. The sky will not fall unless of course the Mayans turn out to be right, in which case all of it and your concerns become truly irrelevant.

BTW: Why not apply your bias to another part of socialized US Federal Government by privatizing our single payer military? I would love to opt out and lobby for your immediate grounding. Who needs human Military Navs today when we have Drones and GPS??

You're right, it's 15 percent of the population (including I think non-citizens), not 15 million as I incorrectly stated. The sad thing is that these 15%, along with people with prior existing condition issues, could have been easily covered a combination of allowing interstate competition in medical insurance, high deductible medical plans combined with medical savings accounts designed to encourage people to buy them before they get sick and some reform of regulations concerning pre-existing conditions.

Its sad that neither Bush nor Clinton elected to pursue such a simple course that would not have involved creation the gigantic Frankenstein monster that is Obamacare.

The fact that you think there is anything simple about National Healthcare just illustrates how little you actually know and how biased you are about the rest. None of what you mention here resolves the basic problem that Healthcare in the US is not universally accessible and therefore is still a privilege determined by your income status. It also has very negative economic consequences, don't believe me? read what the Oracle of Omaha has to say about it:

" Impact on U.S. economic productivity
On March 1, 2010, billionaire investor Warren Buffett said that the high costs paid by U.S. companies for their employees' health care put them at a competitive disadvantage. He compared the roughly 17% of GDP spent by the U.S. on health care with the 9% of GDP spent by much of the rest of the world, noted that the U.S. has fewer doctors and nurses per person, and said, "[t]hat kind of a cost, compared with the rest of the world, is like a tapeworm eating at our economic body." "

There was more regulation under Bush than under Clinton. Had we not had Barney Frank then the crash would have been much softer had Bush been allowed to change regulations on mortages to allow banks to not give loans to people for houses that they couldn't afford.

The crash was caused by regulations.

Barney Frank is to blame?? LMFAO

One openly gay US Representative has that much power? No wonder you and your peeps don't want him to be able to marry.... Imagine they might make more then.... You are hilarious.. Best laugh of the day, thanks.

We agree on this, but why do you think more effective government will fix this problem?

There fixed it for ya.

That's a good one for mythbusters.

District of Columbia schools have some of the highest spending per student in the country, and Washington DC is the richest city in the country. By your logic, they should therefore have the best schools. In fact, DC schools are among the worst in the country.

Pumping money into government monopoly schools does nothing to help students.

What myth? President Reagan did gut the Federal Money spent on Education. The rest here I agree with. As I stated before, Public Education is an unmitigated disaster. Ever wonder if this is just an accident or maybe it's planned? Reduce people's ability to reason critically and then pump em full of "we are the greatest...blah blah blah," all day long. Perfect recipe to keep the public docile while you then proceed to rape them blind. Ooops did I just give away one of the prized secrets of the Skull and Bones Society? Sorry.

President Bush sent his kids to public schools here in Austin. Where do Obama's kids go to school?

????

Who cares? Looks like in both cases parents making smart choices for their families, what's the issue with that? In "W" case I'm actually surprised...must've been the wife.

oh almost forgot; gret, how many words is it this time?

 

[JimNtexas]

President Bush did the 2001 tax cut, No Child Left Behind, Medicare, two energy bills, and TARP with Democrats. Each President defined these deals as success, as principled compromises, and both parties shared the credit.

President Obama has not negotiated a single win-win middle ground legislative compromise with the other political party.

I'm glad we agree on these FACTS.

Obamacare hasn't even been fully implemented yet and already it's a complete failure?

It's worse than a failure , it a disaster. Just ask the Democrats who are scrambling to explain their voters why they are losing their jobs in the medical equipment industry. That's another FACT.

I keep hearing about how smart our President is, but I see no evidence of particular intelligence. In fact, he has the kind of detachment one often sees in current and former heavy drug abusers.

If he really is as smart as his worshipers keep telling me he is, then why after four years is the economy still in the tank, and probably going to get worse?

As near as I can tell Obama's talents are mainly in the area of name calling and dodging irresponsibility. Or, as babbling Joe would say, 'leading from behind'.

 

[OHGOON]

Quote:
President Bush did the 2001 tax cut, No Child Left Behind, Medicare, two energy bills, and TARP with Democrats. Each President defined these deals as success, as principled compromises, and both parties shared the credit.

President Obama has not negotiated a single win-win middle ground legislative compromise with the other political party.

I'm glad we agree on these FACTS.

No we don't.

You must suffer from some serious reading comprehension deficits. This quote of yours comes straight from a Bushy clone who sat around on his keaster pretending to be an Economic wizzard while the whole of the financial world was melting down around him and his Prez. It's just his partisan opinion, his take on things while still hermetically sealed inside the Republican bubble. No facts here in evidence at all, secondly by repeating Hennessey's nonsense, it still does not make it any more sensical, let alone fact.

It's worse than a failure , it a disaster. Just ask the Democrats who are scrambling to explain their voters why they are losing their jobs in the medical equipment industry. That's another FACT.

Again, you confuse opinion with fact. In order for it to be a fact, there has to be agreed upon evidence, not spin from dubious partisan sources. I'm beginning to think that you yourself have suffered irreversible damage under the poor Educational System that you so loudly bemoan.

I keep hearing about how smart our President is, but I see no evidence of particular intelligence. In fact, he has the kind of detachment one often sees in current and former heavy drug abusers.

Now this is not only nonsense, but borderline slander. Where is your evidence please? (Don't bother trotting out some obscure teabagger hate group's talking points either please. We already heard, according to your BFFs, that "Obummer" was born in Kenya and is the Anti-Christ,blah, blah, blah...uke: ).

If he really is as smart as his worshipers keep telling me he is, then why after four years is the economy still in the tank, and probably going to get worse?

Not much of a student of history are ya? Look up how long it took for the economy to recover after the Great Depression. It did not fully recover until the end of WWII. 1929 - 1945. The added bonus is today we have one party that doesn't even pay lip service any longer to the concept of "my country before my party." Obama is just one guy, and not God. He can't fix in a few years what took decades to be broken. Again, time to grow up and realize that the President is largely a figure head when it comes to dealing with the economy. His only real direct constitutional power (where he has direct and immediate control) is being Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces. (I'm beginning to wonder if your aircraft commander doesn't secretly bring a portable Garmin along just in case...)

As near as I can tell Obama's talents are mainly in the area of name calling and dodging irresponsibility. Or, as babbling Joe would say, 'leading from behind'.

Not even gonna justify this with a direct response other than to say that "Joe" here (if it's Scarborough that you mean) also said of his own party (he still identifies as GOP), that if it continues on its present course it is in danger of becoming "The Party of Stupid".

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/08/21/scarborough-im-tired-of-republicans-being-the-stupid-party/

 

[JimNtexas]

The list of bills above that Bush got bipartisan support on is an actual, easily verifiable fact.

The fact that Democrat Senators with medical equipment manufacturers are asking the IRS to suspend the 1 Jan 2013 tax on medical devices is an easily verifiable fact.

Obama's own autobiographies discuss his heavy drug use. Another fact.

Obama has created only one highly bipartisan vote since he's been in office. His last two budget bills were voted down in Congress by 610 to zero.

 

[OHGOON]

1)Yes Bush got more cooperation from the Dems than Obama is getting from the Republicans. Easy explanation really; Democrats did not then, nor do they now, ever practice the kind of lock step, slash and burn, party first country last, scorched earth tactics that are so in vogue with your crowd today. Of course if you willfully ignore that reality you can actually come to the conclusion you are trying so desperately to sell. Unfortunately for you, when you look at the bigger picture, the whole thing falls apart like a house of cards.

2) What a surprise that Senators and Congressmen, even of the Democratic variety act as shills for the medical device industry. I am shocked! So what else is new? You're just illustrating the whole problem with the "Do Nothing Congress". Nowadays corporations in this country own our governments lock stock and barrel and give each side about equal amounts of money? They call it lobbying, we really should call it what it actually is; Bribery and corruption. Nothing particularly newsworthy here.

3) Obama admitted to smoking weed and experimenting with some other things in College. You are trying to make it sound as if he was toking up all day long in the White House, that is BS and you know it. If you don't, then you are an even bigger fool than you continue to reveal yourself to be here on this board. At least Obama admitted it outright, while Bush lied about his Cocaine use and Bubba infamously admitted to "not inhaling". Again, lots of drama and hand wringing on your part but very little to no substance.

4)Ah yes, Obama's last Budget was indeed voted down 513 - 0 (414 in the House and 99 in the Senate) Not sure where you got all those extra votes from? Anyway, not really surprising. Most if not all Presidential budget proposals are dead on arrival. They are considered only as a starting point for subsequent negotiations, hardly a realistic barometer for Obama's bipartisan record. If you ask me, the man has tried and continues to try way too hard to win over a party whose sole purpose seems to be to get him out of the White House. Problem for you and all others like you is that this strategy obviously failed. Thankfully, a solid majority of Americans saw right through all that cr@p and reelected Obama for a second term! Maybe next time the GOP might attempt a new approach like actually standing for something rather than just exclusively focusing on vilifying their opposition. If they don't, they will find themselves left out in the cold again. I don't see it happening yet, so at the current moment, they firmly remain the "Party of Stupid" as your favorite conservative pointed out so eloquently on his morning show.

The few actual facts you present are pretty weak brother...