Getting along well with others.

[Timebuilder]

Allright, you guys are right.....I mean privileged....oh heck, I give up!

Yes, I no doubt chose the wrong word at the head of this line. I worries me when a couple of pilots try to tell me that there is no problem with flying around near busy airspace with no radio, no transponder, and nothing but their eyes to protect themselves and unsuspecting jet traffic form a chance encounter. It's also legal to walk in a snowstorm in a T-shirt. Smart? Nope. Somehow, becuase I often burn Jet A, I have become a part of an "arrogant" group.

I just hope these guys are still around next week, following another round of exercising their "right".

 

[prodigal]

failure to communicate

Timebuilder mentioned that great line from Cool Hand Luke. It seems I read that the errant pilot in question was not talking to anyone. There's your failure to communicate. How smart is it to operate in that high density airspace even in good wx without at least being on flight following, let alone in bad wx. Bad decision making in my book.

 

[cvsfly]

I think the gist of Timebuilder's statement was to comment on those who propose the closed-minded view that they have a "right" to use any airspace that an anybody else. We proposed that one has to use discretion when operating in a complex, dynamic airspace. General Aviation has its back up against the wall. If we do not teach and demand professional precision, we will loose our "right" to fly where we want to - whether it be a C-182, LR-35, or B-737. Yes, I do have a "right" to comment on someones obvious errors as a taxpayer, citizen and as someone who may be called to comment on future regulations (thats going to effect my "rights" and my profession and employment). Mostly, I have the right to comment in the hopes that all of us can learn from this guys mistakes (the preferred way I like to learn vs learning through my errors). Those who want to debate the use of "right" or "priviledge" are welcome. Those who post a statement and disagree with the rebuttle are welcome. Those who respond with unproffessional name calling are welcome to .....well you know what. Well enough for this .... outta here....peace.

 

[jethro]

Get over it

Keep on sniffing the Jet-A guys - I'll fly in, around, and over your precious Class B airspace as I please. And for anyone who doesn't like it, when I'm flying over a busy bravo at 90 knots in my C172 and hear a controller stop a jet's climbout for me I'll take great satisfaction in knowing it could be you.

 

[bigD]

Ouch...fly where you want to, but that's a pretty poor attitude. Safety is safety - be it a 172 or Citation X. We're all in this together, man.

 

[Timebuilder]

Just hope that he stops me in time, Jethro.

Do you feel better now?

 

[Clownpilot]

COOL

LOL. We get paid by the minute. If you stop my climb and delay my flight five minutes I just made enough to buy 3 more beers at the bar when I get to the layover hotel. Forget that, I'll make the Captain buy 'em. He just made enough to buy 6.

Personally, I'm for eliminating all GA traffic around the busy airports and congested airspace. We'll get rid of you one way or another. As for your attitude, I hope you like your Cessna cuz thats about all you're ever gonna fly. But, hey an airplane can't pick it's pilot.

Keep on sniffing the Jet-A guys - I'll fly in, around, and over your precious Class B airspace as I please. And for anyone who doesn't like it, when I'm flying over a busy bravo at 90 knots in my C172 and hear a controller stop a jet's climbout for me I'll take great satisfaction in knowing it could be you.

 

[skytrucker]

What an a$$!

Hey Clownpilot-

Your handle say's it all.

Not everyone has a rich "Uncle" to pay for flight training and expensive turbine equipment to learn in. It was probly nice to have your "own" 400-500 square miles to practice in too. And radar, and a Controller to tell you where to go.

I don't condone or agree with the actions taken regarding this post; I don't have all the facts to make an intelligent decision on it.

Your comments show that you don't have a clue how the rest of the world lives.

 

[Austpilot]

Pull on the speed brake guys!

Talk about getting out of hand - we all have a responsibility when we fly to follow the books, thats all I was saying - whether you fly a 152 or 777, just try to be professioanl, it aint that hard. No ones having a go at GA pilots, thats where most of us came from, I don't forget my grass roots, neither do 99% of of the guys on this board.

Anybody who flies should be treated as an equal, we are all doing something we love and enjoy.

Timebuilder - glad you didn't take it personally. I wasn't even haven a go at your choice of words - then again, maybe I was you know what I meean.

 

[dlwdracos]

Re: Pull on the speed brake guys!

I don't forget my grass roots, neither do 99% of of the guys on this board.

Anybody who flies should be treated as an equal, we are all doing something we love and enjoy.

Here, here. About time somebody said that.

We are not advocating being unsafe. I personally never agreed with the idea of being close to or above busy class B or C airspace and leaving the radio off. It doesn't take much common sense to figure out that.

Additionally, my priviate certificate guarantees me the same privilege of airspace usage as you. Deal with it.

 

[Timebuilder]

>>Timebuilder - glad you didn't take it personally. I wasn't even haven a go at your choice of words - then again, maybe I was you know what I meean.

First, sorry about the Foster's. I'll defer to your choice of Crown Lager.

I try to take nothing personally here. Aside from our semantic digression of rights versus privilege, here is a capsule of my intention with this thread, which apparently was unclear:

Keeping OUR skies safe and free of further regulatory encroachment is a responsibility of every pilot, from the largest to the smallest aircraft flown. Simply flying in a manner which is permitted rather than optimal is unwise, and opens the door to bad press and more regulation of aviation at the least, and fatal accidents at the worst.

It was suggested that the turbine aircraft change their mode of operation to increase safety. The fact is that most turbine activity happens as a result of directives from ATC. Pilots make requests, certainly, but they are often turned down in order to fit the ATC agenda.

Some pilots will be unconvinced that there is any merit to what I have said. That's fine. The goal is to minimize the number of pilots who have a hazardous attitude(s) and to increase the number who look ahead to consider the consequences of their actions.

While it is a legal act to fly over and near busy airspace without remaining in contact with ATC, it isn't the safest course of action, for anyone. While it was legal for our wandering 182 to take off and fly VFR over the DC class B, the fact that he had to divert for weather while in a crossword puzzle of controlled airspace suggests that a more thorough preflight plan might have kept the entire incident from happening, and out of media attention. If he had filed IFR, he may still have had to take the same action to avoid the turbulence of the remaining buildups. Legal? Yes. Smart? Maybe delaying his takeoff would have been the best approach.

I'm just as happy on the days I burn 100LL. That's my "fun fuel". I don't want to lose the "privileges" I have because of a preventable event.

 

[IAHERJ]

I think all aircraft have a place in every kind of airspace. When I'm below 10,000 you can bet both the TCAS's in my ERJ are scanning for low level traffic. Once I climb above 10,000 and start accellerating to 320 IAS to climb, the chances of running into VFR traffic are a lot lower but we still keep an eye out. I hope when I'm running around at 6500 in the Bonanza on my days off that some airliner is scanning and looking out for me as I do on the job. Every pilot in my book must take all precautions available when operating in a mixed aircraft environment in busy airspace. We've all got stories of close calls and TCAS RA's we had to follow to miss aircraft never pointed out by ATC. That's my job to do so and I'm paid well to avoid those situations. Kikking certain aircraft out of public airspace is crazy. We should slow down the testacerone (sp?) contest and go back to just flying our own plane's and worrying about what we are supposed to be doing, not the other guy.