General I have some Quotes for you

[joevollers]

Joe

You make it sound like DP can and will get anything he wants. In my opinion the one who is going to be caught with it out and blowing in the cold wind is DP. Do you think DAL management is going to allow DP to take over? Before that happens, I see NWA hooking up with DAL. That combination has A LOT more to offer than DP's plan.
This is the way I see mergers happen(Just my 2 cents).
UAL/CAL. UAL pays NWA 1 Billion for golden share and buys CAL.
NWA/DAL. Some kind of a buyout/merger.
AA. Buys divested assets from both mergers.
LCC. Jetblue/Frontier/USAir/Airtran/MDWST Join and give SWA headaches.

My meaning was this... this deal will happen or not because of the likes of DP, the creditors, the Judge, and the Government... Not the Pilots....I'm not making predictions about whether or not it will..Just warning against Pilots believing that they have more power than they actually do. Maybe the DAL guys have enough stones to actually in fact have this type of power----I'm just not sure that even a high level of resolve actually matters when it comes to stopping this deal

 

[GOTAFLY]

Very well put Mr. Joevollers

 

[AvJunke]

Sorry to dissapoint you 400ahole/chuck/einstein/lawman. I only need one screen name. You see, I'm not a little child like you hiding behind your daddys keyboard. Idon't get banned after 2-3 weeks, and start my trends of slamming the same people over and over again. Now time to go get stapled by the Air Tran boys!

737pylt (the only screen name I use)

You sure about that?

 

[General Lee]

My meaning was this... this deal will happen or not because of the likes of DP, the creditors, the Judge, and the Government... Not the Pilots....I'm not making predictions about whether or not it will..Just warning against Pilots believing that they have more power than they actually do. Maybe the DAL guys have enough stones to actually in fact have this type of power----I'm just not sure that even a high level of resolve actually matters when it comes to stopping this deal

But wait, we are the creditors (Dalpa), and we are on the actual creditor committee. And, you seem to have forgotten the letter MOAK sent out, regarding our PWA approved by the BK judge already. You must have not seen the first bullet, the one that stated we can approve or disapprove any codeshare, and at first (since we would still have seperate certificates) we would have to codeshare. Sorry. Did you not see that? even Kirby admitted that they would have to use our PWA, except the fact that we would try to kill the deal from the START. And, regardless, the DOJ would kill this deal anyway.


By James Amend, AP Business Writer US Airways Says Delta Deal Would Preserve Pilots' Contract; Predicts 6-Month Takeover Process

NEW YORK (AP) -- US Airways said Thursday the airline has every intention of seeing its $8.6 billion buyout of Delta Air Lines through, despite strong objections yesterday from the takeover target's pilots and questions about whether regulators would permit the merger.
Delta Air Lines' pilots union said Wednesday it plans to rally on Dec. 13 to show its opposition to the hostile bid, and will lobby members of Congress to block the deal. The union's governing body passed a resolution Tuesday night opposing the buyout, saying it would violate their contract.
US Airways Chief Operating Officer J. Scott Kirby told analysts at Calyon Securities' industry conference in New York that the takeover would see Delta's pilot contract through, although he did not elaborate further.



The best part is the last part of the title of that article......Predicts 6 monthg takeover process??? The DOJ took 14 months to turn DOWN the US/UA deal. And, you haven't even finished your own integration yet. Gimme a break....


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Very well put Mr. Joevollers

Seriously, you need to back up your statements with facts or atleast articles. I do every time. And, did you see our web site and all of the politicians lining up in our favor? How many are in favor of the US/DL deal? None. I haven't seen any, have you? If you have, please post it.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

My meaning was this... this deal will happen or not because of the likes of DP, the creditors, the Judge, and the Government... Not the Pilots....I'm not making predictions about whether or not it will..Just warning against Pilots believing that they have more power than they actually do. Maybe the DAL guys have enough stones to actually in fact have this type of power----I'm just not sure that even a high level of resolve actually matters when it comes to stopping this deal

From Moak to Dalpa pilots:


Parker mistakenly believes that he can somehow magically overcome the scope protections built into our contract and to date refuses to discuss the contract in anything other than superficial terms. The Delta PWA is a part of Delta's Plan of Reorganization and must be a part of any such plan of reorganization. Parker, however, simply ignores the implications of our contract. For example, in response to just a single issue, he has been quoted as saying, "We don't know enough about the contract and how this clause came to be." Pilot contract issues will not go away regardless of how much money Parker throws at this merger. For example, our contract:

o Prohibits a "code-sharing" relationship between Delta and US Airways that is critical to the success of the merger plan.
o Dictates that, in the event of a merger, our contract is the controlling document and all provisions remain in force, provisions which prevent many planned US Airways synergies.
o Provides that the amount of Delta flying cannot decrease during a merger transition period until full operational integration, a period that would take years.
o States that Delta pilots must fly any aircraft configured for over 76 seats. US Airways would be prohibited from operating an entire portion of their fleet of aircraft as a result of this provision.
o Most importantly, the Delta pilot contract is binding on any successor or affiliate, including a transaction where Delta is bought by another carrier or holding company subject to the provisions of Letter of Agreement 7, Bankruptcy Protection Covenant.

The Delta pilots will not change any provision of our contract in order to facilitate the hostile takeover of our company.




Read that first bullet point again, and the last one. No, they can't do an 1113c unless DL or the owner cannot get DIP financing. Well, anyone trying to buy us would certainly have financing available. And, the BK judge did approve that.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[xanderman]

...

I tell ya if this deal does go down (which I don't think will happen) I'm gonna love to see what the deltoids post. GL, 737 Pylt, and FDJ2 what are you gonna say IF this deal goes down?

Andy

 

[General Lee]

I tell ya if this deal does go down (which I don't think will happen) I'm gonna love to see what the deltoids post. GL, 737 Pylt, and FDJ2 what are you gonna say IF this deal goes down?

Andy

If this deal goes down, I think I will rant for 3 straight years, nonstop. I don't think any of us would be happy at all... you included.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[xanderman]

...

If this deal goes down, I think I will rant for 3 straight years, nonstop. I don't think any of us would be happy at all... you included.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Indeed sir, indeed.

 

[737 Pylt]

You sure about that?

AV Jerk:
Yeah, I'm pretty sure.
But thanks for caring!

737

 

[737 Pylt]

I tell ya if this deal does go down (which I don't think will happen) I'm gonna love to see what the deltoids post. GL, 737 Pylt, and FDJ2 what are you gonna say IF this deal goes down?

Andy

I'm gonna say, the deal went down, nothing I can do about it. That being said the only thing remaining the same is your pathetic hatret for our airline, and still being a complete toolbox!

737

 

[joevollers]

But wait, we are the creditors (Dalpa), and we are on the actual creditor committee. And, you seem to have forgotten the letter MOAK sent out, regarding our PWA approved by the BK judge already. You must have not seen the first bullet,

Bye Bye--General Lee

You are on the creditors committee...so you have a vote... not final say... you are in BK...so your contract is changable...ask any BK lawyer...

Once again... I am not wishing this on you...Just make sure you don't over play your hand early!

I guarantee you that your scope clause will have nothing to do with whether or not this deal goes through.....Many other factors will, as you have pointed out.....But I will bet you anything that your scope won't....

I seem to have heard someone say that this deal would not have the value that it has now if it were to happen after BK...Why? you can change contracts.


Fondly,
---- General Sherman
(I couldn't resist the FLAME)



Get it?

 

[General Lee]

Joevollers---the next Nancy Grace

You are on the creditors committee...so you have a vote... not final say... you are in BK...so your contract is changable...ask any BK lawyer...

Once again... I am not wishing this on you...Just make sure you don't over play your hand early!

I guarantee you that your scope clause will have nothing to do with whether or not this deal goes through.....Many other factors will, as you have pointed out.....But I will bet you anything that your scope won't....

I seem to have heard someone say that this deal would not have the value that it has now if it were to happen after BK...Why? you can change contracts.


Fondly,
---- General Sherman
(I couldn't resist the FLAME)



Get it?

Oh, wait, we needed to have a BK lawyer going through this process? What? Why didn't someone tell Dalpa? Oh, what a huge mistake..... We must have done this all by ourselves...what a bunch of dumb pilots....


Hello? Are you really serious? You don't think we have good representation? You don't think we have consulted with many people, paid millions of dollars, and gotten everything approved through the BK judge? You don't? Are you Johnie Cochran? Wait, he is dead. Read this again, and then KNOW we had it approved by the BK judge first, and he would deal with any possible suitor that got by our creditor committee, then through the DOJ...... You must watch a lot of Court TV....


From Moak:

Parker mistakenly believes that he can somehow magically overcome the scope protections built into our contract and to date refuses to discuss the contract in anything other than superficial terms. The Delta PWA is a part of Delta's Plan of Reorganization and must be a part of any such plan of reorganization. Parker, however, simply ignores the implications of our contract. For example, in response to just a single issue, he has been quoted as saying, "We don't know enough about the contract and how this clause came to be." Pilot contract issues will not go away regardless of how much money Parker throws at this merger. For example, our contract:

o Prohibits a "code-sharing" relationship between Delta and US Airways that is critical to the success of the merger plan.
o Dictates that, in the event of a merger, our contract is the controlling document and all provisions remain in force, provisions which prevent many planned US Airways synergies.
o Provides that the amount of Delta flying cannot decrease during a merger transition period until full operational integration, a period that would take years.
o States that Delta pilots must fly any aircraft configured for over 76 seats. US Airways would be prohibited from operating an entire portion of their fleet of aircraft as a result of this provision.
o Most importantly, the Delta pilot contract is binding on any successor or affiliate, including a transaction where Delta is bought by another carrier or holding company subject to the provisions of Letter of Agreement 7, Bankruptcy Protection Covenant.

The Delta pilots will not change any provision of our contract in order to facilitate the hostile takeover of our company.





Tell me again General Sherman (wow, that was a good one), where a BK lawyer could pick through this above......I guess the LETTER OF AGREEMENT 7, BK Protection Covenant could easily be broken.. Yeah, that's the ticket..


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Joevollers---the next Nancy Grace

You are right, normally BK is where raiders come in to buy companies and change things (contracts) prior to coming out. But, Parker underestimated our Pilot contract, approved already by the judge. At first his own lawyers thought our contract had "technicalities." Then, after we showed him what it said, those same lawyers stated they were "unexpected items." Even Kirby, the President of USAir, stated they would have to follow the Delta pilot contract if they took us over, except he still doesn't know that initially, since we have seperate certificates and it takes awhile to incorporate them, we would have to be a code-share. Well, Dalpa has the right to veto any code share. (look at first bullet)

Unexpected items---what a bia-tch.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[400ADude]

:beer:

Sorry to dissapoint you 400ahole/chuck/einstein/lawman. I only need one screen name. You see, I'm not a little child like you hiding behind your daddys keyboard. I don't get banned after 2-3 weeks, and start my trends of slamming the same people over and over again. Now time to go get stapled by the Air Tran boys!

737pylt (the only screen name I use)

It so obvious and funny.

 

[joevollers]

Tell me again General Sherman (wow, that was a good one), where a BK lawyer could pick through this above......I guess the LETTER OF AGREEMENT 7, BK Protection Covenant could easily be broken.. Yeah, that's the ticket..


Bye Bye---General Lee

Thanks.... I thought so too..

Yes... I believe it could easily be broken... That was not an agreement between DALPA and the BK judge... It was an Agreement between DALPA and DAL Mgmnt... I Guarantee you that your pilot contract will not be the reason this deal does not go through... This deal may not go through, true... So the BK judge approved the agreement... He could just as easily change it if a critical mass of the creditors wanted the deal. I won't speculate as to whether or not they will. But believe me.. I wish Unions were as powerful as you think they are. But they're not. Johnnie Cochran? Maybe... Do you think DP Didn't think to analyze your contract before he upped his offer? Or sought this w/o counsel on your scope clause?? Don't underestimate Doogie; he may be a lot of things, but stoopid ain't one of 'em.

 

[General Lee]

Thanks.... I thought so too..

Yes... I believe it could easily be broken... That was not an agreement between DALPA and the BK judge... It was an Agreement between DALPA and DAL Mgmnt... I Guarantee you that your pilot contract will not be the reason this deal does not go through... This deal may not go through, true... So the BK judge approved the agreement... He could just as easily change it if a critical mass of the creditors wanted the deal. I won't speculate as to whether or not they will. But believe me.. I wish Unions were as powerful as you think they are. But they're not. Johnnie Cochran? Maybe... Do you think DP Didn't think to analyze your contract before he upped his offer? Or sought this w/o counsel on your scope clause?? Don't underestimate Doogie; he may be a lot of things, but stoopid ain't one of 'em.

Thanks Judge Judy for that guarantee. Did you know that USAir COO J. Scott Kirby already admitted that the DL pilot contract would have to be used. Why would he admit that if the pilot contract could not be enforced? Did he back down? Here is the article:

AP
US Airways Would Keep Delta Labor Deal
Thursday December 7, 11:18 am ET
By James Amend, AP Business Writer US Airways Says Delta Deal Would Preserve Pilots' Contract; Predicts 6-Month Takeover Process

NEW YORK (AP) -- US Airways said Thursday the airline has every intention of seeing its $8.6 billion buyout of Delta Air Lines through, despite strong objections yesterday from the takeover target's pilots and questions about whether regulators would permit the merger.
Delta Air Lines' pilots union said Wednesday it plans to rally on Dec. 13 to show its opposition to the hostile bid, and will lobby members of Congress to block the deal. The union's governing body passed a resolution Tuesday night opposing the buyout, saying it would violate their contract.
US Airways Chief Operating Officer J. Scott Kirby told analysts at Calyon Securities' industry conference in New York that the takeover would see Delta's pilot contract through, although he did not elaborate further. (Because he could not, he was still choking the USAir lawyers throats...)



Please explain why Kirby would do that above. And no "guarantees" you can not back up. The reason Dougie didn't realize this beforehand is because his lawyers told him initially that the pilot contract was a "technicality." (true story) Then, after he and the lawyers realized their mistake, they called it an "unexpected item." Doesn't that sound legal to you? It is legalese for "ooops."

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[xanderman]

Wow!

I'm gonna say, the deal went down, nothing I can do about it. That being said the only thing remaining the same is your pathetic hatret for our airline, and still being a complete toolbox!

737

That's a pretty sensitive spot there little man. I never insulted you! Okay maybe the "deltoids" comment but c'mon man your panties are seriously bunched. It was just a question! By the way I don't hate DL but I do hate pilots who think they are the neatest thing to come along since sliced bread. You are no better than any other pilot out there trying to make ends meet. People like you cant seem to realize that when you take away the double-breasted suit and the fancy hat you still just have a puckerin' brown eye staring you in the face. I think you and your DL cronies on this board are seriously immature when it comes to this potential merger. GL can't stop quoting Oberstar. You can't stop insulting anyone and everyone when they disagree with your point of view. And FDJ2 seems to regurgitate everything you two say. So I wondered... Is that so bad?

Andy

 

[Wiskey Driver]

From Moak:

Parker mistakenly believes that he can somehow magically overcome the scope protections built into our contract and to date refuses to discuss the contract in anything other than superficial terms. The Delta PWA is a part of Delta's Plan of Reorganization and must be a part of any such plan of reorganization. Parker, however, simply ignores the implications of our contract. For example, in response to just a single issue, he has been quoted as saying, "We don't know enough about the contract and how this clause came to be." Pilot contract issues will not go away regardless of how much money Parker throws at this merger. For example, our contract:

OH Please give me a break!!! All kidding aside is Moak for real??? Does actually believe this crap?? It's called bankruptcy and your scope and contract mean NOTHING and can be broken without so much as a sweat. In bankruptcy the company can do what ever it needs in order to survive and will have the BK Judge void labor contracts if necessary. Think someone needs let Lee knows this little fact...

WD.

 

[General Lee]

From Moak:

Parker mistakenly believes that he can somehow magically overcome the scope protections built into our contract and to date refuses to discuss the contract in anything other than superficial terms. The Delta PWA is a part of Delta's Plan of Reorganization and must be a part of any such plan of reorganization. Parker, however, simply ignores the implications of our contract. For example, in response to just a single issue, he has been quoted as saying, "We don't know enough about the contract and how this clause came to be." Pilot contract issues will not go away regardless of how much money Parker throws at this merger. For example, our contract:

OH Please give me a break!!! All kidding aside is Moak for real??? Does actually believe this crap?? It's called bankruptcy and your scope and contract mean NOTHING and can be broken without so much as a sweat. In bankruptcy the company can do what ever it needs in order to survive and will have the BK Judge void labor contracts if necessary. Think someone needs let Lee knows this little fact...

WD.

WD,

Thanks Judge Joe Brown. Anyone who is able to actually buy us and then actually get past the DOJ, would then have to talk to our BK judge, who actually approved our contract and those provisions. But hey, you will easily change his mind.....riiiiight. Call Nancy Grace, Johnie Cochran is still alive in Whiskey Driver.....(you give no actual proof of what you say, but do watch a lot of Court TV...good for you) What does "binding" mean to you, other than what your sister used to do to you to keep you in line?


o Most importantly, the Delta pilot contract is binding on any successor or affiliate, including a transaction where Delta is bought by another carrier or holding company subject to the provisions of Letter of Agreement 7, Bankruptcy Protection Covenant.


Bye Bye--General Lee