Freight Flying and Job Security

[MarineGrunt]

Do freight pilots have better job security than airline pilots? I've heard rumors of furloughs on the frieght side, but there doesn't seem to be nearly as many.

Any advice on pursuing a freight dog career?

Thanks for any help!

 

[RUhiring?]

Last time I checked, FedEx, UPS, Airborne, Polar, Atlas, Capital Air, and the like were considered Airlines......

 

[nosewheel]

Freight Dog, Parcel Puppy, Whatever

Iv'e been a freight dog most of my 21 years in the buisiness and have gone thru several bankruptcy's and a couple of furloughs. I don't really see much difference between haulin people versus freight except freight dosn't care about level orange alerts, Sars and terrorist's. The freight buisiness appears to be going strong with our company but I heard a rumor that Fed Up is laying off 14,000. Not that I really care about them cause they cost me my last job. If I were you I'd concider the freight job. It's not a bad life if you find the right outfit to work for.

 

[HAZ-MAT]

I probably just wrote the best reply, better than any college paper i've done, and it was erased, a little pissed right now.. give me a few minutes and i'll retype

 

[HAZ-MAT]

(All my opinion)
You have two sides of cargo.. The "majors" like FedEx, UPS, DHL, ABEX, Polar and Atlas and you have "regionals" like Mountain Air Cargo, Baron, AirNet, Flight Express and Ameriflight. In the Past ABEX has furloughed and so has Polar. But to the best of my knowledge FedEx has not. UPS was threatining to earlier in the year, and that is normally a scare tactic used my management. UPS wanted an X% increase in pay, UPS management is saying we'll give you that but we'll furlough 100+. The "regional" 135/125 companies have been fairly secure, especially for your first step up. Baron and MAC have a nice security by being feeders for FedEx. They can use them to fly into smaller airports or airports where its not cost effective to fly a 727 into. FedEx also has security by the way of having a contract to fly the US mail. They are also the part of the english lingo... You dont say, i am going to overnight you a package, you say, i am going to FedEx you a package... same kind of thing like, how many people say tissues.. no, you say, hand me a Kleenex.
The check hauling companies like AirNet and Flight Express, have done really well in the past, and are currently still hiring. AirNet is projecting another 30 people for the year. These two companies have been sucessful thru the banks needing them, to deliver within a certain time period. But the future of check flying is changing. Quite a few banks, and customers do "online" banking. But even these companies have looked into other areas, breaking out into the Fractionals, doing isotope, or lab corp runs, or even doing charter work for electronic companies.
I have heard of flight express laying off a few people lately, and i think that was due to a base closure. The set back with a small 135 company is most of them dont have a furlough clause, so when they dont need you, they lay you off. For now, i chose, and was very lucky to become part of the cargo world. My opinion is when things go bad for a few years, it always seems that the cargo business bounces back quicker.

 

[metrodriver]

Second attempt. My first reply got lost when the computer decided to take a break.
In aug 2001 there were about 1500 cargo pilots out of a job because of the mail going to fedex. A few companies even closed the doors:Express one and Emery (coincidentally at the same time that the Faa was looking at them). Few of the companies that lost the mail have recalled people.
There is little difference between flying self loading cargo and the forklift loaded kind. The selfloading cargo want the stuff they ordered today to arrive yesterday so you fly mostly in the dark.
There are big differences in amenities though. I've seen 727's without lavs, little chemical camping things, the normal lavs, no crewmeals or coffee (depending on length of flight and company), no fancy electronic gadgets like tcas in the cockpit (if it's not required, you don't install it so when it breaks you don't have to fix it). And of course you park somewhere in a forgotten corner of the airport, where even the hoteldriver can't find the way to pick you up

Nosewheel, congrats on being unfurloughed, I hope that day will come for me too some day.

 

[nosewheel]

Thanks Alot Metrodriver. I know what your saying about the Lav's. On the DC-8 we used to use the Crack where the Cargo Door didn't quite seal near the floor. It was great cause it got sucked out immediately. The only problem was sometimes it would freeze and make opening the door a little sticky. It's been a rough few years and I sure hope this is my last job and I can start saving (once the bills are paid) for retirment.Thats the problem with most of the Non Sched Freight outfits, there are No retirement benifits other than a 401 K program. Thats why we see so many Captains retire at 60 then are pretty much forced to take the FE's seat just to pay the bills/ Medical.I know of several FE's 70+ years old just trying to make a living. I suggest to any young pilot that chooses the Non Sched freight job is to start saving for retirement early in your carreer so you dont have the worrys at age 60. I didn't do that, and with 9 years to go I'm really scrambling to get caught up so when that day comes, I will BE FREE!!!!! Then I would like to see the world again, this time from the GROUND.

 

[RockyMnt1]

FedEx furloughs

For the first time since I have been here, FedEx has offered VOLUNTARY severence/retirment packages. These packages were offered only to management/professionals (no pilots are included) employed by Fed Ex express. The reason for this move is that the express side of the house (as opposed to the freight or technical (computer) side) has had flat growth for a period of time. There are too many people supporting a business that isn't growing. Right now, the offer has been placed on the table for folks to review. Folks can then indcate their interest (or not) and obtain detailed personalized information (how much money and when). The actual execution will happen around September.

FedEx will see how many folks take advantage of this offer and then consider other options if needed.

 

[RockyMnt1]

One more thing

14,000 FedEx folks are eligiable (sp?) for the VOLUNTARY program. Not everyone will take advantage of the offer (and nobody has to do so). FedEx is NOT laying off 14,000 people as reported in our highly accurate media outlets.

 

[Airpiraterob]

job security?

flying the morning of 9/11.
and the first day they let commercial activity fly afterwards, well i was flying that night. a little different with how quiet it was.

the point is this. cargo dosent carry any passengers, it carries little and big packages. The packages still need to get there. They don't complain and they dont care weather or not they die along the way. they are inanimate objects. almost zero risk. so no matter the political climate, people still want THEIR STUFF to get there soon. theres always going to be cargo flying.

concerns? well mid-2000 there was the beginning of the cargo glut. the pre-Y2K jitters got everyone shipping everything stockpiling ahead of time in case something bad happened and at the end of 2000, ON DEMAND cargo was almost dried up. they phenominal ammounts of flying and outdid themselves. now with the warehouses full of product, noone needed anything flown. it took a year or so. by the middle of 2002 i started seeing the Convairs and 880's out and about again. Zantop was flying a bit and contract air was flying a bit. was hearing the 'kalitta' callsign again, seeing ameristar on a few ramps, even saw the Airbus Beluga (got awesome loseup picss too). these were good things to hear.

freight swings with the industrial economy only. banks always need things moved, small packages and letters need to be overnighted. but when the industrial goods (ie: auto parts and production materials needed) arent required cause their warehouses are full, well then your large Convairs and 737 cargos will sit. so the only consistent job security out there in caro is something SCHEDULED and under contract. Baron aviation, AirNet, MAC, Superior, Wiggins, Empire, anything else UPS/FedEx contracted, is the stability of work you seek.

freights still gotta get there.

 

[metrodriver]

On some other thread Pilotyip said that there was hardly any automotive stuff being flown, I've heard that from several people that hardly anything comes out of mexico and several of the autoparts carriers are furloughing:Cherry, Ameristar, USAjet, Grandaire (might not be flying at all), it's even impacting the UPS business a lot around the border. On some routes a 70% reduction compared to january or february. I guess everybody who could afford a new SUV or saturn in the driveway with 0% got it, and now the auto industry is falling flat on its face.

Nosewheel, the carrier I flew for also had quite a lot of ex Eastern and Branif guys who lost everything and are now operating the panel after age 60. I could be very close to recall if they all had gone home, but I do understand their situation and would do it myself too if I got burned like that. Some others went to work at the FAA just to get that retirement check. Of course if I get recalled it will be a shorter time to the right seat when there are a lot of very senior (on the seniority list) people occupying the fe seat but with no way up

 

[nosewheel]

metrodriver

It sounds like we may have something in common. I too know of ex Branif and Eastern guys however, I don't sympathize with those who moved to the back seat just to get away from there wives or because of shear boardom. I too, have been bumped on the seniority list a few times and in some cases as a result of these few people. Since my recall I've had one other recall and another offer so , things are looking up. I hope it get's better for you as well and your recall happens soon. Good Luck!!

 

[wingnutt]

im with y'all on everything. cargo rocks, but retirement is almost non-existent, unless of course you snag a seat with the big guys.

here is my only disagreement...

...it's even impacting the UPS business a lot around the border.

as a matter of fact, there are more routes springing up along the Texas/Mexico border (guessing that the border you were referring to)...no one is quite sure why on this end of things though.

 

[metrodriver]

I've only heard about the stuff going through SAT from the border, and it's way down. I know ups is looking at opening some other stations but that's more to cut down on driving times and some of the airports they are looking at can't be used under 135 for lack of required equipment.

Nosewheel, looking at your profile you must have flown (and been recalled) to fly the orange striped 747's. I know a few guys from there who went other places. Are they still hiring? and what requirements? could you pm me?

 

[Airpiraterob]

lack of required equipment? such as what? where i flew into they didnt have $hit....not even anything to take a $hit on....had to wander off into the trees. find the secret hidden key to get into the FAA shack (we had permission) and use the phone thats only there for the maintenance guys when theyre fixin the 8088-(turbo button to 10mhz) computer and the dot-matrix printer that takes WX readings.

 

[metrodriver]

uh, something like a weather source

sorry about this message, I tried to delete it after my computer told me this webpage could not be displayed after writing this message

 

[metrodriver]

uhh, something like a weather source.

Nosewheel , thanks for the pm. Luckily I've not had the problem you described, that's not very nice. I've been in touch with R but no luck there yet.
Do you happen to have the right contacts at T for the 727? I've also tried that company you got on with now, but I don't know what they are looking for, and I wonder if there is a something against certain people. If I could pm you or send an e-mail I would elaborate a little more, but you might guess what I'm talking about

 

[metrodriver]

nosewheel, did you get my message?

 

[nosewheel]

metrodriver

Sure did, sent you one back. Did you not get it?