Freedom Air and new hires

[Kingairrick]

mdog

I'm in a simlar situation. I need a flying job, badly... However, I fly (part time) for a company that has a King Air, 2 BE400s and a CitationX. Your basic part 91 operator.

The retired part 91 guys who fly for this company still carry their little "black list." Any time someone approaches us for a job, they check it. If it turns out that Freedom guys are labeled as scabs by ALPA, weather or not it is just, your career is over if you fly for them.

That's the reality, and I agree that it sucks. Bartend if you have to. Preserve your future, and lets change the system when we are part of it.

Just my 2cents.

 

[Kingairrick]

correction

I meant to say retired part 121 guys who fly for us (3 of them)

 

[Jetsnake]

I'm not sure how people feel about freedom air, but I do know the basics. If this is your first airline job, I would go to freedom air w/o hesitation if certain circumstances are met. Now, if current pilots at Mesa are refusing to move to the freedom side, then I would not go. Take a very good look at what ALPA is saying about freedom air, and make your decision based on the facts. Again, I'm not sure exactly what's going on, just my opinion.

Let me quote you;

"I do know the basics"

Grow up "KNOB LIPS" and get a clue, I'll send you box for
X-mas.

"Again, I'm not sure exactly what's going on"

Your right about that one, you have know idea, when you
do, make a intelligent decision and speak properly,
you sound like a Democrat that has never served his
country.

As far as ALPA, what do they have to do with it!

A Freedom Air Pilot will never be allowed on my
aircraft...


Jetsnake

 

[Flydaplane]

Your throwing the scab word around too vaguely. A scab is not someone who flies for Freedom Air.
In the future your saying that if Freedom picks up flying for Amwest or Mesa and if they strike (a lot of ifs here) and if ALPA brands the routes as being struck work, then they would be scabs? Boy if that's the case then the Skywest pilots had better be carefull since they are now flying out of DFW. Isn't Comair doing that too? When ASA goes on strike you can guarantee that Delta will give their routes to Skywest and Comair. Comair's pilots union may be able to get them out of flying the struck work routes, but Skywest's (non-union) pilots won't be able to.
So you guys may as well add the Skywest pilots to your list and maybe even the Comair pilots. Or maybe you should quit threatening people with your black lists and wait and see what happens. In my opinion, which isn't that important anyway, I think JO is an ass, but the argument that anyone who flies for Freedom is a scab just doesn't make sense.
If I was the dude who had just finished the MAPD course I'd take it and then keep applying to other airlines. Ask yourself would I fly for Skywest? Then flying for Freedom (other than the crappy pay, work rules, management, and schedules) would be no different scab wise.

 

[crj579]

Maybe some folks don't realize what just happened at CCAIR. Over 70% of the pilots voted for a contract that contained 900 rates and ALPA national refused to sign it. They are now going to be out of business on Nov. 3rd. I think it could be a preview to what might happen at Mesa. I wouldn't be surprised if ALPA national might just want Mesa and their 900 rates to "go away". Could be why Freedom is getting started.

 

[jetdriven]

I'll tell you why Woerth would not sign the CCAIR TA.
The TA was modified from one that failed earlier by 75%. It was modified in the fact it deleted the no'furlough clause and the stock options plan. It also added an 85,000 LB GTOW jet limit. This includes the CRJ-900.

Here's the ugly part. Their JET rates were LOWER than mesa'a current jet rates (which are already lowest in the industry). Lorger than 50-seat planes carried a 7.5% override.

Ask yourself this, would you ratify an agreement that was FORCED to the CCAIR pilots, having been read the WARN act and recieved furlough notices? Not to mention the MESA DHC-8 PARKED IN THE RAMP DURING VOTING. Also, ratifying a contract that would have CCA pilots making about what mesa pays 50-seats for flying a 90 seater??

folks, the show at CCAIR is far from over. ALPA won the NMB petition for single carrier and they will be integrated into MESA. Why sign a piece of garbage contract forced down your pilots throats when you can get them wrapped into mesa with single-carrier??


Would you sign a contract that has a 10 year CCA pilot making 60$ per hour flying a 900??

 

[bobbysamd]

Hey, Mdog

I suspect, too, that you are an MAPD grad by the type aircraft listed in your profile. I worked at your school years ago and I'm not a real fan of Mesa Airlines. Therefore, I suspect that you're correct that the callback list is worthless. Maybe you've been placed in some kind of a (cess)pool.

I've been pondering this Freedom Air conumdrum. It's plain as day that this is Ornstein's attempt to circumvent the union. On the other hand, are people scabs if they're hired into a non-union shop? I worked in a non-union radio station with someone who was an AFTRA (radio union) member. His previous job was in a union shop. He was regarded as being on on honorable leave because he was now working in a non-union shop. So, you can't say that he was a scab.

A lot of it is perception. People who hear Mr. O's siren song of an "airline job" with Freedom might argue logically that they are not scabs because there is no union, although the rest of Mesa is unionized. However, their logical argument might fall on deaf ears of their peers. That is something to consider for the long run.

If I were you, I'd put Mesa aside for the time being and find some work with which you can build hours. The ten hours of 1900 time means little to the rest of the aviation world. I'd suggest that you get your Commercial Single, if you don't have it already, get your CFI, and instruct. If Mesa calls, fine. You can think about it at that time. In the meantime, get some experience.

Good luck with your plans.