Fractionals and prior-121 applicants...

[X-rated]

From what I heard, XOJet doesn't care for 121 guys anymore.

You got some bad information. That is absolutely not true.

 

[ozpilot]

It's true brudda. Got my brief for next week Down Under. Can't help it if the gig is better than most.....

Have fun Down Under!

Remember theres no need to remember anyone's name - just call everybody "mate". And don't drink Fosters - theres a a reason that stuff is exported Plenty of other good beers available.

And don't go into a pub and order a cold Bloke. Only in the Outback Steakhouse is a beer called a Bloke. In Australian english a bloke is a guy. Could lead to a misunderstanding

Does NJI go to Australia often? Is it only in the V? Its almost enough to make me take a walk over to the dark side

 

[gutshotdraw]

Both airplanes do trips there but this will be my second in six months, both on the 550. I'll probably skip the beer and go straight to the very nice South Australian Cab/Shiraz. Still have to decide what to drink in Honolulu on the way over and in Auckland in between.....hmmm.

Come on over to the Dark Side....ask Diesel -- it doesn't suck.

 

[texman]

I am one of the 121 to frac transfers and haven't seen the discrimination of which you speak. As an earlier poster said, there are strong areas in both. Strong customer service, flexibility, and skills flying into smaller, uncontrolled and performance limited areas go to the frac or corporate/charter pilots. Rigid adherence to SOP and a safety culture unrivaled anywhere must go to the airlines. A combination of both cultures probably would be ideal.

Now I'm probably going to draw some fire but I'll venture a hypothesis regarding the age old corporate vs airline battle. YEARS ago, when the airlines were a great place to make a career, when hiring was competitive and most aviators aspired to fly the "heavy iron", those who could not get hired by the airlines often ended up flying private/corporate and eventually fractional jets. Those folks may have long-held bad feelings for the airline folks because of this. Perhaps those now in a position to hire into some corporate/ frac departments unknowingly bias against 121 pilots who now see the fracs ( as I do) as an equal if not better long term career path.

Once again, LONG TIME AGO vs Now. It's all


changed.

I have to agree with you. Both sides of flying is orange and apples. The only thing I try to break in with a former 121 guy is, hey it is ok to have a beer brother no one is going to rat you out. Some guys I have notice will slam click, but it is usually the old dudes that got laid off or missed the 60 rule. I think that both 91 and 121 dudes are a great combo. The frac world you need both sides of experience to get through 7 days of fun.

As far as SOP's. I think every professional pilot should follow them to the T.This is the only way you will survive the frac world.

The customer service side, treat them like family. Throw in a little yes m'am and yes sir you will be all set.

 

[ozpilot]

Come on over to the Dark Side....ask Diesel -- it doesn't suck.

Diesel's a good buddy. I've talked to him a lot about NJI. I tried to send you a PM but you have them blocked.

 

[Whale Rider]

Maybe this question has been asked many times. Why are fractionals (especially XOJET) not as interested, or "hate" 121-applicants applying to their company to fly a business jets?
For myself I always wanted to fly for the airlines and after being in the industry for 5 years; I realize its not for me. I frankly don't understand why a company would discriminate on that past experience. At my airline when I did new-hire interviews I never singled out an applicant that had prior corporate experience. Can anyone elebrate?

If you're frustrated that the fractionals (especially XOJET) are not calling you as quickly as you'd like for an interview? Then voice those frustrations. But don't make false accusations about the frac discriminating against 121 guys! Thats just outright stupid! Some of the most senior pilots at XOJet are 121 guys! Hell, the D.O. is a 121 guy!

 

[texman]

If you're frustrated that the fractionals (especially XOJET) are not calling you as quickly as you'd like for an interview? Then voice those frustrations. But don't make false accusations about the frac discriminating against 121 guys! Thats just outright stupid! Some of the most senior pilots at XOJet are 121 guys! Hell, the D.O. is a 121 guy!

I think the best way is call like you said, and start building a relationship. This is what you will do with the customer every time you come in contact with them. Even though I don't work for XO, but another frac, I do believe this is common practice. They want to know if you will get along with the other guy for a week. Building a relationship over the phone is very improtant.

 

[acaTerry]

I don't think its so at NJA. Resume / application goes through a process of box checking, and then you do how you do at the interview. That's really all there is to it.

 

[justthewife]

Maybe it's not the 121 background that is the problem, but what you did prior. If you have 500 hours and then got hired, then you really haven't done the variety of flying that would be important to have at a fractional. Even just CFI work would be a step up, but still probably not enough.

My husband got hired from a 121 to a fractional, and he has a background of military, cargo, and 121. I think all that factored into the choice to hire him, as well as the fact that he has worked in a customer-oriented field before entering aviation.

 

[mt2]

Both airplanes do trips there but this will be my second in six months, both on the 550. I'll probably skip the beer and go straight to the very nice South Australian Cab/Shiraz. Still have to decide what to drink in Honolulu on the way over and in Auckland in between.....hmmm.

Come on over to the Dark Side....ask Diesel -- it doesn't suck.

Two best choices in HNL: Go to the Shorebird for dinner, have a cold beer or a nice Cab and cook/eat a great steak. Dukes for lunch -- Mahi sandwich and a cold bev while scoping out the surf. Always tried to hit one or the other on HNL layovers.

 

[Freight Dog]

Two best choices in HNL: Go to the Shorebird for dinner, have a cold beer or a nice Cab and cook/eat a great steak. Dukes for lunch -- Mahi sandwich and a cold bev while scoping out the surf. Always tried to hit one or the other on HNL layovers.

Shorebird has a nice ambiance, and they'd give 20% off to airline crews, even for local carriers. But the food...? Pass...

You want the best steak on the island? I'll give you a hint, it's not in Waikiki. Head over to Haleiwa on the North Shore and hit Haleiwa Joe's. Great ambiance, great sunsets. They also have one at Kaneohe. You'll have the best steak on the island, BAR NONE. You'll also have the best seafood on the island, BAR NONE. As an appetizer at HJ's, I'd suggest Emma's Poke and sizzling mushrooms.

It's worth the drive from Waikiki... believe me.

Want the best burger on the island for lunch? Head over to Ward 16 theaters off of Ala Moana and park there. It's called Kua Aina Burgers. Just ask anyone to point it out. Local joint - no credit cards, cash only. You can get Ahi and all that other stuff, but these guys are famous for their burgers. Maybe 5-10 minute drive from Waikiki.

 

[blueridge71]

Roughly half of CS pilots are from a 121 background.

I'd say the reason that most 121 guys are rejected is either (a) lack of customer service/people skills or (b) just not persistent enough.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Head over to Haleiwa on the North Shore and hit Haleiwa Joe's. Great ambiance, great sunsets.

I was going to Haleiwa Joe's when it was the Chart House (I'm dating myself, I know). You're right about the sunsets. You ought to see it when the Eddie Invitational is called and the bay closes out like it did about 10 years ago. Those guys are nuts and the traffic was all the way to the bridge just outside Honolulu.

 

[Freight Dog]

Chart House??? Wasn't that like before Hawaii became a state?

 

[HalinTexas]

I miss Hawaii.

The Shore Bird was OK for breakfast. I always found Duke's was too crowded.

I always went to the Harbor Pub, below the Chart House, looking at the Ala Moana small boat harbor. They had great pizza, pretty cheap beer, and the locals were nice. I used to eat breakfast there, too, but they didn't open until 8AM.

Arnolds, a real divey place in an alley across from the post office had some interesting local color and cheap beer.

Moose Magilacutty's on Dewers (I think that's the name of the street.) When you cross Kalakaua, as you walk towards the Shorebird, there's a new two-level strip mall with a brew pub in towards the back. Forgot the name. Plenty of eye-candy tourist. :beer:

You can forget Senor Frogs. uke:

Walk back into the Hilton Hawaiin village. Neat place, lots of restaurants.

The all-time cheapest beer is at a place near UH at the NE corner of University and King. I forgot the name. It's mostly outdoor, lots of college kids around. A real dump, 90 something taps, cheap, cheap, cheap. Sushi, if you like eatin' bait, and local pizza.

If you walk, or ride, up and down Kuhio, one block off the Waikiki, and where the busses run ($2), there's all kinds of places to eat. Tsunami's, below a gay bar, used to have $5 breakfast. Great deal.

Lulu's on Waikiki used to be pretty cool, but they've gone shishi-fufu. Pretty good burgers on the lunch menu, good view of the beach and the sunset. Not all that cheap, but nothing on Waikiki is cheap.

Now Maui.......

I like all the islands. I was even figuring out Kaui, when they didn't stick us at the Hilton Beach resort N. of the airport.

Have I said how much I miss Hawaii?

 

[brokeflyer]

I miss Hawaii.

The Shore Bird was OK for breakfast. I always found Duke's was too crowded.

I always went to the Harbor Pub, below the Chart House, looking at the Ala Moana small boat harbor. They had great pizza, pretty cheap beer, and the locals were nice. I used to eat breakfast there, too, but they didn't open until 8AM.

Arnolds, a real divey place in an alley across from the post office had some interesting local color and cheap beer.

Moose Magilacutty's on Dewers (I think that's the name of the street.) When you cross Kalakaua, as you walk towards the Shorebird, there's a new two-level strip mall with a brew pub in towards the back. Forgot the name. Plenty of eye-candy tourist. :beer:

You can forget Senor Frogs. uke:

Walk back into the Hilton Hawaiin village. Neat place, lots of restaurants.

The all-time cheapest beer is at a place near UH at the NE corner of University and King. I forgot the name. It's mostly outdoor, lots of college kids around. A real dump, 90 something taps, cheap, cheap, cheap. Sushi, if you like eatin' bait, and local pizza.

If you walk, or ride, up and down Kuhio, one block off the Waikiki, and where the busses run ($2), there's all kinds of places to eat. Tsunami's, below a gay bar, used to have $5 breakfast. Great deal.

Lulu's on Waikiki used to be pretty cool, but they've gone shishi-fufu. Pretty good burgers on the lunch menu, good view of the beach and the sunset. Not all that cheap, but nothing on Waikiki is cheap.

Now Maui.......

I like all the islands. I was even figuring out Kaui, when they didn't stick us at the Hilton Beach resort N. of the airport.

Have I said how much I miss Hawaii?

why all the cheap talk?.....if its cheap then that is exactly what you get.

 

[HalinTexas]

why all the cheap talk?.....if its cheap then that is exactly what you get.

1. Not true.

2. "Cheap" is relative.

Sometimes is synonymous with "value priced."

 

[Freight Dog]

No doubt, Hawaii was fun. I miss it too, and I used to live there. Wish I could wind the clock back...

Gutshotdraw, I hope you're having fun out there. I forgot to mention... if you like Thai food, there's a place at McCully Shopping Center which is a very short drive from Waikiki, it's a little joint, but they have the best Thai food I've ever had, in Hawaii or in the mainland. It's called Phuket Thai.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Rest of the crew wanted Duke's tonight. Table on the rail, nice steak, perfect weather, who am I to argue?

 

[petitepilot]

Not only are the xojet guys mostly 121, they also mostly ex independence/aca.

I think you've been turned down by more than one company. It's probably time for personal introspection through which you will experience personal growth if you are indeed honest with yourself. Just because you got your pilot ratings doesn't entitle you to squat. Especially in this job market. If you think the people interviewing you can't pick up on your negativity, you are truly an island of yourself. You think you're not there because of them. In fact, you aren't there because of YOU.

There can be a nice ending to your story. You are habitually negative. It takes 2-3 weeks to form a new habit. Try being positive during this time, like the glass is half full. Try not to use the words I, ME, My or Mine in any sentence. And try to refrain for negativity on a public forum where you THINK you are maintaining anonomity, because in this small industry and age of techies, I have no doubt that peeps can get your personal info through your IP.

Remember, the pilot group is one big family of mutual acquaintences, and they largely get along and network. Right now, you really don't fit in. But you can!