Fool reiterates the falling SWA model

[SWAdude]

Do I have to cut and paste the thread from SWAPA.org or should I just let you continue to be an a$$hole?

Funny. You calling me an a$$hole. You couldn't answer a few real simple questions to prove yourself a couple months ago and now you got a hold of some info by who knows how.

No. I don't believe you are an SWA pilot. Refer to this thread for the test. http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=67646&page=3 Nobody has ever come on this board and ripped their own pilot group like you have. Especially with the half truths that you present.

Total flamebait. I'm done with you.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

Looks like there may be some former SWA employees posing as current employees or current employees who, unlike most, are unhappy. I have no ill will toward you guys, but it seems there is some anger coming out that is not the norm at SWA.

I hope you can step back and deal with your anger as quickly as possible and wish you only the best.

 

[Mach 80]

"Rift", "Mutiny"..etc

There are a very small group of SWA pilots, about 20 of them, who post regulary on a private forum and are constantly getting each other worked up as a mob mentality will do sometimes. 4,800 other SWA pilots would laugh in your face if you told them there was a mutiny about to occur. This particular group also allow themselves to think that a high number of SWA pilots feel just as they do because that's all they read and see on thier little private forum. Because that's all they read, they think a huge number of SWA pilots think as they do, when in fact, it's just that little group of 20 who mentaly masturbate each other over the same couple of issues. In fact, there are nearly 5,000 other SWA pilots who think their little private forum is pretty much completely off the wall or at least the issues are extremely exaggerated. Many of these same guys find it necessary to spout off here too. You know the type...all the airlines have a few who know what's best for everyone and want to tell everyone. Primarily it boils down to an ego problem with many of them --- no one listens to them in person so they have to turn to the internet and think they are being heard that way, when it's only the same 20 guys who have the same problem who are listening and boost each other egos...thus the mental masturbation.

 

[firstthird]

exactly.

 

[SWAdude]

Very well said!:beer:

 

[Mach 80]

I just don't get these guys. Here the SWA pilots make more than any other 737 drivers in the world, more than many 767 and 747 drivers, with great schedules and job security, and instead of spending time off fishing, with their families, taking trips, these very few feel the need to complain about everything. If they spent half the time posting their whining on the internet on researching the stock market instead, they'd be doubling their 401K and profit sharing accounts.

 

[7S3W7A]

Funny. You calling me an a$$hole. You couldn't answer a few real simple questions to prove yourself a couple months ago and now you got a hold of some info by who knows how.

No. I don't believe you are an SWA pilot. Refer to this thread for the test. http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=67646&page=3 Nobody has ever come on this board and ripped their own pilot group like you have. Especially with the half truths that you present.

Total flamebait. I'm done with you.

Boo Hoo....Your done with me....You were done when I answered Slug's test months ago. Sticking your head in the sand again? Realizing people are happy with the airline but hate the greedy pilots, I mean captains, who work here?

You're a complete moron.

Here you go jacka$$:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slug
7S3W7A,

A little test.

1. What link do you get taken to if you select the 401(k) button on the SWAPA web site?

2. What is the fourth link button down in the left hand column of the SWAPA members site?





3. Log on to

SWAlife.com​

What is the first item listed under the need to know section in the right hand column?

Slug


Just to amuse people like you who like to pretend you're an ostrich instead of actually solving the fallacy that is our union. By the way, I never said SWA was a bad place but our union makes it that way. Do you live in Utah?

1. 401kaccess.com
2. on the road
3. 2006 message to the field


The answers currently are:

1. 401kaccess.com
2. on the road
3. Gary's newsline transcripts


Any other thread you want to quote? Keep stick your XXXXXX head in the sand and screwing over your fellow pilots with your greed and stupidity. Are you the treasurer who XXXXXXX us with the Utah scandal and stole $150,000 from us just to go unpunished by your XXXXXXXXXXX Ike and friends?

XXXXXXXXX


Congratulations! You won the contest and proved you're a SWA pilot. Now for the bad news, you proved you're a crude SWA pilot who can't follow a few simple rules of decorum, nor disagree without being disagreeable.

In a sense of fairness, since you were called an A-Hole by another poster, I let your insult of calling him a Jacka$$ remain. Continuing with the fairness issue, I'm giving you the same 7 days in the Penalty Box that I've given other posters recently for using the F-word (spelled correctly or not). For your invective regarding homosexuals, your sentence shall run concurrently.

Now, back to the good news. We don't have to suffer with you for a week!

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXWhoops!!!XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Wait- a SWA pilot says you didn't answer the questions correctly. Given the fact that only with a bit of honesty and credibility, can a productive dialog take place, until you can prove to us that you are truly a SWA pilot, will you get out of the PB. I wouldn't have taken this action but the whole crux of the thread/issue/problem here is that you are posting from the standpoint of an authentic SWA pilot and are defending yourself herein. Forget about convincing your adversaries here, convince me.

Of course, you'd still get the week off for using the F-word.

UAL78

 

[Delville]

As for the topic of this thread---The Motley Fool is for investors, not employees. That said, they "reiterate" their lack of faith in SWA in favor of JetBlue as JetBlue stock falls and SWA stock has risen. 19 to 11 and 14 to 17. I would say these "Fools" are wrong at least as much as they are right.

Keep that in perspective and watch your wallet around those guys.

BTW, they seem to be completely ignoring the up and comer here that is the real player, Airtran.

And why no articles about Alaska??

Good points FBJ.

The Motley Fool's recommendation of JetBlue as a wise airline investment choice only highlights their lack of understanding of the airline industry. We all, for the most part, are airline industry "insiders" with a degree of insight into and knowledge of the airline industry that most investment professionals don't even come close to. We all know that JetBlue is in some pretty serious trouble while the Motley Fool is recommending them. They are wrong. BTW, one investment analyst who seems to know the airline business very well is Jamie Baker from JP Morgan.

The Motley Fool is probably also off-base about SWA. Regardless, I wouldn't trust the Motley Fool's ill-informed analysis of SWA any farther than I can throw it. And, as FBJ pointed out, they completely missed the boat on AirTran who even Gary Kelly has acknowledged is SWA's biggest threat.

Why nothing on Alaska? I don't know. Alaska is another former golden name in the airline industry that is on it's way down. The Motley Fool probably would have recommended them.

 

[guccistyle]

Any other thread you want to quote? Keep stick your fu#king head in the sand and screwing over your fellow pilots with your greed and stupidity. Are you the treasurer who f-ed us with the Utah scandal and stole $150,000 from us just to go unpunished by your and friends?

A-hole!

Dude, you have anger issues you need to deal with way before you start giving advice on how to further the financial success of the company. I'll bet your a hoot to hit the hotel bar with. No wonder you don't like the company captains, I can't imagine any of them ever want to hang out with you. Usually the guy who thinks everyone else around him is an a-hole...is actually the a-hole himself. Solve your own issues before you continue to rant about everyone else. Peace.

Guch

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

Motley Fool has been a staunch supporter of Jetblue, but really never a basher of WN. They take a swing at the incumbant king in this article, but do they really know what they are talking about?....a little.

Kelly knows that in order to continue their success they must grow by at least 10% per year. Gordon Bethune reiterated this many years ago. In other words they have to keep bringing in newbies to subsidize the bourgeoisie. Sounds a little like the Social Security System today. He hasn't sought to change the business model proactively, the system is dictating a new business model to him where he must seek high cost stations to place the expanding fleet in the next few years. Sound like a winner? :laugh: :laugh:

imp:

http://www.fool.com/news/commentary/2006/commentary06032104.htm?source=eptyholnk303100&logvisit=y&npu=y

Lowecur,

I agree with many that the 10% growth helped SWA in the past and WAS one of the elements of their success. How else could they attract top notch pilots (I know this is up for debate but many of them are very sharp) who were being promised a fraction of UAL and AA wages at the time?

Now the growth will slow. It would be bad if wages had not gone up. The 4 year upgrades to Captain are a thing of the past. But you forget that SWA pays its FO's well and does not depend on them subsidizing the growth or retirements.

Instead of big growth SWA now has economy of scale. Employees per aircraft are down and debt relative to assets is down. SWA has Walmart like power in negotiating for services.

You mention going into big markets as bad and indicative of high costs leaving smaller markets unreachable. This is bass ackward thinking. Every airline wants to enter a big market, but SWA couldn't before and had to settle for smaller markets instead. SWA is no longer settling for just smaller markets for growth. Not a failing model, a changing model. If a carrier does not change in America, it will not be around long.


The case against SWA is different than the model "failing". It is that the models elsewhere may actually start to bite--



When the legacies do start hiring off the street, they will see some benefits of hiring newbies at new, breathtakingly low rates. But until then they will not help. JetBlue is taking advantage of their 1st year rates and has hit a temporary bump in the road because the forecast for 2006 and 2007 is for robust airline industry revenue. All JetBlue has to do is get down the road to 2008 or 2009 and the good news will continue. I would rebuy JetBlue stock when the articles come at Motley fool giving up on JetBlue. It will signal a good base for future advances.

The -190 may be good, but will not hurt SWA significantly as some think. It would have hurt the SWA of 2000 or before. But not the SWA of 2007 and beyond. Don't understand that? SWA is almost a different airline compared to 2000. The routes lean toward long haul, high percentage of fleet is new, and the competitive landscape is completely different. And the SWA of 2012 will be different than today. The regionals, USAir, Newco, and JetBlue will duke it out for the 76 to 100 seat market. I predict much JetBlue success, but I know it will be hard fought.

Then there is Virgin USA. Who will they hurt if they get off the ground? I predict UAL and AA on international. Branson wants feed for their international flying. Virgin may inadvertantly hurt JetBlue if Jetblue is heavy in Virgin markets.


All these trends may reduce SWA flights into some markets. But the entry into new markets will offset it. More than offset it. In fact, I see very little SWA reduction in smaller markets at all. Something about frequency of service and all that jazz. Or so goes my crackpot theory.


I still think JetBlue will do o.k., but not at significant SWA expense.


When I agree with some of these analysts on company success or trouble it is almost always for totally different reasons than they offer.

 

[canyonblue]

Looks like there may be some former SWA employees posing as current employees or current employees who, unlike most, are unhappy. I have no ill will toward you guys, but it seems there is some anger coming out that is not the norm at SWA.

I hope you can step back and deal with your anger as quickly as possible and wish you only the best.

It would be easy if this person was as vocal at work as he is on the board, but I have not met anyone of that caliber at SWA yet. He truly has issues with the current SWAPA administration, but no one has been this vocal at work to lead me to believe this person works for us. 7S3W7A, could you please be this vocal at work, and come join the crowd at pprune. That way it would be easy to get your credit as a SWA pilot. Until then, I have to say I don't believe you work for us, or you are too afraid to be this opinionated at work, which is truly sad.

 

[SWAdude]

The answers currently are:

1. 401kaccess.com
2. on the road
3. Gary's newsline transcripts

Wrong imposture

1. login 401k
2. your money
3. need to know

Don't let this imposture fool anyone...he needs to be ignored. He is NOT a SWA pilot.

 

[TAZ MAN]

Any other thread you want to quote? Keep stick your XXXXXX head in the sand and screwing over your fellow pilots with your greed and stupidity. Are you the treasurer who XXXXXXX us with the Utah scandal and stole $150,000 from us just to go unpunished by your XXXXXXXXXXX Ike and friends?

XXXXXXXXX


Congratulations! You won the contest and proved you're a SWA pilot. Now for the bad news, you proved you're a crude SWA pilot who can't follow a few simple rules of decorum, nor disagree without being disagreeable.

In a sense of fairness, since you were called an A-Hole by another poster, I let your insult of calling him a Jacka$$ remain. Continuing with the fairness issue, I'm giving you the same 7 days in the Penalty Box that I've given other posters recently for using the F-word (spelled correctly or not). For your invective regarding homosexuals, your sentence shall run concurrently.

Now, back to the good news. We don't have to suffer with you for a week!

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXWhoops!!!XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Wait- a SWA pilot says you didn't answer the questions correctly. Given the fact that only with a bit of honesty and credibility, can a productive dialog take place, until you can prove to us that you are truly a SWA pilot, will you get out of the PB. I wouldn't have taken this action but the whole crux of the thread/issue/problem here is that you are posting from the standpoint of an authentic SWA pilot and are defending yourself herein. Forget about convincing your adversaries here, convince me.

Of course, you'd still get the week off for using the F-word.

UAL78

Thank you!

This guy is nutz!!

 

[Hobiehawker]

Thank you!

This guy is nutz!!

Your not kidding!! Even if this guy proves he is a Southwest Airlines pilot, which it appears he won't, I hope they still keep him off.

 

[SWA/FO]

Awesome UAL78....

 

[Andy]

How else could they attract top notch pilots (I know this is up for debate but many of them are very sharp) who were being promised a fraction of UAL and AA wages at the time?

Why would this be up for debate? During the late 90s, the pay at LUV didn't lag enough to make a huge difference. I knew a lot of sharp pilots who wanted to go to LUV as #1 choice.
My rank ordering was USAirways, Northwest, Delta, Continental. I based it on retirements. I just happened to be called by UAL first (it wasn't high on my list, but it was on it) and hired by them. Within weeks of starting class, Northwest and Delta offered me interviews.
Southwest was never on my list because my goal in life is to be a bunkie on an international widebody. I figured that I already had over 2000 bad landings in my career; no need to have another 5000 bad landings when I could get through the rest of my career with less than 500 more bad landings. Besides, you only get paid while the wheels are turning, so I prefer long flights over short hops. The guys that wanted to go to LUV wanted to fly multiple legs daily.

 

[canyonblue]

The guys that wanted to go to LUV wanted to fly multiple legs daily.

Or maybe, like me, chose SWA because of the culture. Of all my friends that went to various Majors in the late 90's and 2000, I never heard one of them say "this place is awesome!", except the guys I know who went to Southwest. I just couldn't fathom going to work for the next 20 years and hating it. Ask Slug about the difference in coming to work for a trip vs another carrier. It should never be about the pay, because if that is at the top of your list, good luck in this industry.

 

[pgcfii2002]

SWA rocks....money isn't everything....do it for the love of the game man!!!

 

[SWA/FO]

I luv Southwest Airlines! Customer appreciation days fall on the 5th and 20th of every month.

 

[Benhuntn]

I was teetering but now I'm tottering. Whew! this thread had me worried. For a minute I thought I was the only happy guy left at SWA and 7s3w7a was right. I am ok now though since there must be 3-4 happy guys. By the way 7s3w7a I can't see my belt but I'm not greedy. Just 2/3 of the way to fat dumb and happy.