I'll Be getting the opportunity to fly part 91 legs with a citation pilot. Though I have a good amount turboprop time, I have no turbojet time. I was curious if any one could tell me some good rules of thumb for flying the citation( such as things to watch for, general power settings for climbs decents approaches. quirks of the airplane etc.) I do know exact specs are determined on weight and meterological conditions. I will be studing the manuals soon and If all goes well perhaps type school, but before then, I dont want to look like a complete idiot. all help is greatly appreciated.
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Flying the ce550 sII
- Thread starter Max T.O.
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flyingtoilet
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sydeseet
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The only thing I can tell you is the CE-550 is easy to fly. What you do want to do is get comfortable in the cockpit. Spend the time to just sit in the airplane and find all the switches. You will be of great help to the captain when he needs you to find something and you know where it is. That includes fire extinguishers and first aid kits. Dont touch the TKS switch unless you are in visible moisture and at or below freezing. After minus 10 just use the cowls. The TKS fluid will freez. Dont ask. I still get a nervous twitch just thinking about it. BE CARFUL refilling the TKS tank. Again, dont ask. Our old radio guy still gives me dirty looks and I dont even work there anymore.
Oh and you will have to put up with the jokes. She isnt fast, but she is a great ship and very forgiving.
Oh and you will have to put up with the jokes. She isnt fast, but she is a great ship and very forgiving.
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Falcon Capt:
Yep they are. The CL-600 covers the 600 and the 601. The 600 having the Lycoming engines and the 601 having the G.E. engines. The 604 is a 601 with Collins avionics and 2 "saddle tanks" in the hell hole.
Collins vs. Honeywell......Well I hated the Collins untill I got used to it. I think it presents information better especially crossing the pond than the Honeywell though. Both are excellent.
If you have the CL-600 type then the 604 type is only a 10 day school.
Yep they are. The CL-600 covers the 600 and the 601. The 600 having the Lycoming engines and the 601 having the G.E. engines. The 604 is a 601 with Collins avionics and 2 "saddle tanks" in the hell hole.
Collins vs. Honeywell......Well I hated the Collins untill I got used to it. I think it presents information better especially crossing the pond than the Honeywell though. Both are excellent.
If you have the CL-600 type then the 604 type is only a 10 day school.
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Maxto,
Just relax; The Slotations are about the planes to learn how to fly jets in. Speeds aren't much different than a turboprop, and the straight wing has all the same landing characteristics of a 172.
You asked about power settings, I have to agree with DC8driver, just do what it takes. If you want Ballpark 60% is about Vref, 78% is 210 knots, and 88% is 250 knots at 10,000, but hell that works in just about every jet I've been in.
If everything works out, you'll be extremely bored in about 100 hours or so. However once you start flying some of the other more exciting jets, you will learn to enjoy the Slotations easy mannerisms even more.
On last thing the landing gear tends to be rather stiff on SII's so don't worry too much about the grease job.
I really can't think of any other gotcha's on the Citation, other than knowing your routing since you might have to make a few turns to let faster traffic pass then Center gives you a direct "Wherethef$ck is that."
Just relax; The Slotations are about the planes to learn how to fly jets in. Speeds aren't much different than a turboprop, and the straight wing has all the same landing characteristics of a 172.
You asked about power settings, I have to agree with DC8driver, just do what it takes. If you want Ballpark 60% is about Vref, 78% is 210 knots, and 88% is 250 knots at 10,000, but hell that works in just about every jet I've been in.
If everything works out, you'll be extremely bored in about 100 hours or so. However once you start flying some of the other more exciting jets, you will learn to enjoy the Slotations easy mannerisms even more.
On last thing the landing gear tends to be rather stiff on SII's so don't worry too much about the grease job.
I really can't think of any other gotcha's on the Citation, other than knowing your routing since you might have to make a few turns to let faster traffic pass then Center gives you a direct "Wherethef$ck is that."
Watch out for birds, coming from behind!
I have flown the SII over at EJM (Exec Jet MIS-Management) out of "Sunken Lunken" Ohio and have these tidbits to offer:
For power in the pattern we used the "Rule of 60". By setting 60 percent clean, you'll be right at 200 knots or so. Then you can start dirtying up with approach flaps, gear and landing flaps without having to worry about messing with the power. Once established on final, only a slight adjustment to the thrust levers is required to set Vref depending on your weight and atmospheric conditions. I seem to remember about 55 to 56 % N1 on final.
There was a hard and fast rule for speed changes that we used to use for most cruise flight conditions. It was something like 3 knots of airspeed for each 1 percent of N1 (fan speed). So if you were doing 250 and wanted to slow to 200 for the Class D, you'd knock out about 16 percent N1. Easy arithmetic, ya dig?
The Citation has an AOA indicator on it that is extremely handy for use during climbs and approaches. Keep an eye on that sucka while the other guy is flying and see what it usually reads. I seem to remember most climbs at .20 to .25 and if the needle went above .35 to .4, you were starting to run out of steam. (Not hard to do in an SII with a decent load of fuel and pax.) She'll get up to the low 30's ok with a load but before going to 390 or 410, I'd burn the fuel down to 4000 lbs. or less first. Using the AOA on approaches made life easy too, just set it where the white band was located (about .6 I believe) and you were right on Vref.
On the lighter side:
Carry lots of enroute charts or "sticky window shades" so you can put them up in the windows to block the sunlight. The Slowtation is a FLYING GREENHOUSE WITH WINGS! You will bake on the ground in the wintertime even if it is below freezing out! I remember well my days of pulling into Raytheon at HOU Hobby in the middle of August and practically sweating to death....Yikes!
Don't forget to retract the flaps after leaving the runway. Unlike the Citation II, they are not electric but hydraulic. Once the engines are shut down at the ramp, you sit there like an idiot with your flaps down.....Ooops!
Enjoy the "Slowwie".....its a great little birdie indeed.
Sean in the Smokies
I have flown the SII over at EJM (Exec Jet MIS-Management) out of "Sunken Lunken" Ohio and have these tidbits to offer:
For power in the pattern we used the "Rule of 60". By setting 60 percent clean, you'll be right at 200 knots or so. Then you can start dirtying up with approach flaps, gear and landing flaps without having to worry about messing with the power. Once established on final, only a slight adjustment to the thrust levers is required to set Vref depending on your weight and atmospheric conditions. I seem to remember about 55 to 56 % N1 on final.
There was a hard and fast rule for speed changes that we used to use for most cruise flight conditions. It was something like 3 knots of airspeed for each 1 percent of N1 (fan speed). So if you were doing 250 and wanted to slow to 200 for the Class D, you'd knock out about 16 percent N1. Easy arithmetic, ya dig?
The Citation has an AOA indicator on it that is extremely handy for use during climbs and approaches. Keep an eye on that sucka while the other guy is flying and see what it usually reads. I seem to remember most climbs at .20 to .25 and if the needle went above .35 to .4, you were starting to run out of steam. (Not hard to do in an SII with a decent load of fuel and pax.) She'll get up to the low 30's ok with a load but before going to 390 or 410, I'd burn the fuel down to 4000 lbs. or less first. Using the AOA on approaches made life easy too, just set it where the white band was located (about .6 I believe) and you were right on Vref.
On the lighter side:
Carry lots of enroute charts or "sticky window shades" so you can put them up in the windows to block the sunlight. The Slowtation is a FLYING GREENHOUSE WITH WINGS! You will bake on the ground in the wintertime even if it is below freezing out! I remember well my days of pulling into Raytheon at HOU Hobby in the middle of August and practically sweating to death....Yikes!
Don't forget to retract the flaps after leaving the runway. Unlike the Citation II, they are not electric but hydraulic. Once the engines are shut down at the ramp, you sit there like an idiot with your flaps down.....Ooops!
Enjoy the "Slowwie".....its a great little birdie indeed.
Sean in the Smokies
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A little gotcha
Something to be careful of on the 550....
When closing the cabin door it is very easy to go over center with the handle. If you do go over center...
1. the door is not locked, and is easily vibrated open
2. you will have no indication in the coclpit that the door is not locked, you have to go pretty far over center with the handle before the door unlocked light comes on in the cockpit.
3. it is important to inspect the green stripes to make sure they line up PERFECTLY. This is the only real indication that the door is locked.
You don't hear much about this little quirk but can be a potential disaster.
As a couple other guys said, the 550 is just like a big 172. Maybe too easy to fly.
Have fun.
Something to be careful of on the 550....
When closing the cabin door it is very easy to go over center with the handle. If you do go over center...
1. the door is not locked, and is easily vibrated open
2. you will have no indication in the coclpit that the door is not locked, you have to go pretty far over center with the handle before the door unlocked light comes on in the cockpit.
3. it is important to inspect the green stripes to make sure they line up PERFECTLY. This is the only real indication that the door is locked.
You don't hear much about this little quirk but can be a potential disaster.
As a couple other guys said, the 550 is just like a big 172. Maybe too easy to fly.
Have fun.
You should transition very easily into the 550. It is a very docile airplane and you will never want to go back to turboprops! Approach speed on the 550 is typically 12-15 knots slower than the king air i was flying! But, be aware, you will need to plan more in slowing down.
The sunshades are a MUST. Got the smoky colored ones at wal-mart for about 6 bucks. just plaster 'em up there and it makes a HUGE difference. You will fry up there. When i first started in the 560 i kept turning the a/c colder cause i was burning up and my boss said 'hey, there's ice forming on this vent back here, think we could warm it up a bit?' hahahaa. you'll see.
and about the door, yes, make sure the green stripes line up to ensure it's locked. also, when you go to open it after the flight, give the seal time to deflate...you'll hear it. otherwise, you could damage the seal. as for the steps, let them down gently....
have a ball.
The sunshades are a MUST. Got the smoky colored ones at wal-mart for about 6 bucks. just plaster 'em up there and it makes a HUGE difference. You will fry up there. When i first started in the 560 i kept turning the a/c colder cause i was burning up and my boss said 'hey, there's ice forming on this vent back here, think we could warm it up a bit?' hahahaa. you'll see.
and about the door, yes, make sure the green stripes line up to ensure it's locked. also, when you go to open it after the flight, give the seal time to deflate...you'll hear it. otherwise, you could damage the seal. as for the steps, let them down gently....
have a ball.
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