Well Said.
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Well Said.
B19 Flyer
....
- Joined
- May 8, 2006
- Posts
- 1,595
Every single thing that I despise about unions and the union mentality is stated in this post. Take down the company and all the employees that work there. Take away everybody's job security, paycheck and home life. Remove their benefits, their way of life, their careers and their futures because you don't think that management is doing it the right way and you ain't got the nuts to step into managment and try to make things better yourself. Your union leadership that has failed to negotiate a CBA is going to put every employee there at risk. An agreement is based on two sides agreeing, not just one. 34% of the pilots chose NOT to force a union into the company, yet they are living with the reality that they may be unemployed by the selfish and "know it all" 66% that did.
Be careful what you ask for, you wanted a union... you got yourself a union and all the joy that comes with it.
I LOVE my non-union airline.
dash_trash
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2005
- Posts
- 173
b19
For someone who “claims” to be at a non-union airline, you sure spend a lot of time on the fractional board fighting management’s fights.
As for not having the “nuts” to join management and make a change … this management teams past speaks for itself. It is only a matter of time before THEY destroy this company. Our illustrious CEO has left a train wreck everywhere he’s been. America West … Bankruptcy, USAirways … MetroJet (gone), the dismantling of the Express Division and lest we forget the TWO Bankruptcies in 2 years time, which of course, included a bonus the first time in front of the bankruptcy judge. A VP of Operations who stabbed every pilot at Eastern Airlines in the back and gave the knife a twist by CROSSING THE PICKET LINE! A VP of Human Resources how approved a benefits cost increase to the employees in excess of 150% and doesn’t think enough of the operation to actually move to Cleveland. Program Managers who consistently pressure their crews to violate FAR’s, support duty and rest provision which boarder on ludicrous, and manage through the time honored tradition of INTIMIDATION.
There is a saying that a company gets the UNION they deserve. Options deserved a union much sooner ... and we are here to stay … GET USED TO IT!!!
As for joining management, not in a million years!
For someone who “claims” to be at a non-union airline, you sure spend a lot of time on the fractional board fighting management’s fights.
As for not having the “nuts” to join management and make a change … this management teams past speaks for itself. It is only a matter of time before THEY destroy this company. Our illustrious CEO has left a train wreck everywhere he’s been. America West … Bankruptcy, USAirways … MetroJet (gone), the dismantling of the Express Division and lest we forget the TWO Bankruptcies in 2 years time, which of course, included a bonus the first time in front of the bankruptcy judge. A VP of Operations who stabbed every pilot at Eastern Airlines in the back and gave the knife a twist by CROSSING THE PICKET LINE! A VP of Human Resources how approved a benefits cost increase to the employees in excess of 150% and doesn’t think enough of the operation to actually move to Cleveland. Program Managers who consistently pressure their crews to violate FAR’s, support duty and rest provision which boarder on ludicrous, and manage through the time honored tradition of INTIMIDATION.
There is a saying that a company gets the UNION they deserve. Options deserved a union much sooner ... and we are here to stay … GET USED TO IT!!!
As for joining management, not in a million years!
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buzz off
Hey B19 why don't you back to worrying about playing in the big leagues there at mesaba and let us handle our own problems. In case you didn't notice our management has managed to do everything you listed in your post to us without the company going tits up. So go back and mind you own P's and Q's Junior!!!
Hey B19 why don't you back to worrying about playing in the big leagues there at mesaba and let us handle our own problems. In case you didn't notice our management has managed to do everything you listed in your post to us without the company going tits up. So go back and mind you own P's and Q's Junior!!!
Hey Fr8Dog and Dash I'm willing to bet my girlfriend's feet have more time in the air than our buddy B!
dash_trash
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2005
- Posts
- 173
Now that's funny! :laugh:
B19 Flyer
....
- Joined
- May 8, 2006
- Posts
- 1,595
I will agree that they most likely are!
You can blame your schedule and her lonelyness more than you can my lack of time on the flight deck though! :laugh:
It is soooo obvious B19 is our VP of Flt Ops Bob
Just look at the strategy he is undertaking:
He tries to deflect blame for not yet reaching an agreement on a CBA to whom? The Union Leadership of course. Management dragging their feet never seemed to enter his statement. Nor did the fact that any employment attorney worth his salt will tell you two things: 1. After a newly elected union gets on a once non union property, the average time to a 1st contract is 4-5 years! That's reality folks. Call up your local employment law specialist and ask him yourself. 2. On average, by the time a 1st contract is reached, there are only 25% of the employees still on the property, that were there when the union was originally voted in. Why? Things often get extremely nasty, as management hates to give up any control to their employees. Its only when it becomes too costly to continue fighting their employees (and guess who can most affect those costs), that management will finally be willing to settle a contract.
It is also of interest to note that 1st contracts are typically not very good. Often management has beaten their employee group so hard that they are willing to sign an inferior contract, just to get the fight over with. That tactic is certainly in play at Flight Options.
Bob is also attempting to splinter the pilot group by referencing the 34% being hurt by the 66%. Well, being Bob, he is already taking liberties with the facts; it was 33% and 67%, but whose counting. What he also is ommitting is that on average, union votes, if they are successful, are usually very close, as in the low 50s vs high 40s. The fact is that 2 out of every 3 Flight Options Pilots (67%) voted for the Union, even with the company's address manipulation and numerous Pilots being forced to request directly from the NMB a ballot which they should have received per the addresses provided by the company (interestingly, said pilots continued to receive their paystubs, but somehow, the initial ballot just got "lost in the mail" LOL).
It is clear that B19 is playing fast and loose with the facts once again. He is playing the "Scare Tactic" card that Flight Options might go out of business due to the big bad union. Well, if Flight Ops does go out of business, it won't be through the fault of the union. It will be because our management refused to pay an industry standard pay package to their highly intelligent and highly skilled pilot force. If that's the choice our management makes, so be it. I will no longer tolerate being under valued by a small group of self-centered executives, who say they care, but have done nothing more than take from all their employees (not just the pilots) since the day they set foot on the property.
Freedom is not free.
Just look at the strategy he is undertaking:
He tries to deflect blame for not yet reaching an agreement on a CBA to whom? The Union Leadership of course. Management dragging their feet never seemed to enter his statement. Nor did the fact that any employment attorney worth his salt will tell you two things: 1. After a newly elected union gets on a once non union property, the average time to a 1st contract is 4-5 years! That's reality folks. Call up your local employment law specialist and ask him yourself. 2. On average, by the time a 1st contract is reached, there are only 25% of the employees still on the property, that were there when the union was originally voted in. Why? Things often get extremely nasty, as management hates to give up any control to their employees. Its only when it becomes too costly to continue fighting their employees (and guess who can most affect those costs), that management will finally be willing to settle a contract.
It is also of interest to note that 1st contracts are typically not very good. Often management has beaten their employee group so hard that they are willing to sign an inferior contract, just to get the fight over with. That tactic is certainly in play at Flight Options.
Bob is also attempting to splinter the pilot group by referencing the 34% being hurt by the 66%. Well, being Bob, he is already taking liberties with the facts; it was 33% and 67%, but whose counting. What he also is ommitting is that on average, union votes, if they are successful, are usually very close, as in the low 50s vs high 40s. The fact is that 2 out of every 3 Flight Options Pilots (67%) voted for the Union, even with the company's address manipulation and numerous Pilots being forced to request directly from the NMB a ballot which they should have received per the addresses provided by the company (interestingly, said pilots continued to receive their paystubs, but somehow, the initial ballot just got "lost in the mail" LOL).
It is clear that B19 is playing fast and loose with the facts once again. He is playing the "Scare Tactic" card that Flight Options might go out of business due to the big bad union. Well, if Flight Ops does go out of business, it won't be through the fault of the union. It will be because our management refused to pay an industry standard pay package to their highly intelligent and highly skilled pilot force. If that's the choice our management makes, so be it. I will no longer tolerate being under valued by a small group of self-centered executives, who say they care, but have done nothing more than take from all their employees (not just the pilots) since the day they set foot on the property.
Freedom is not free.
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storm brewing on the horizon
Hey b-19 Bob, Ford and Harrison goon, flops management or whomever else you are pretending to be. I am often reminded of what a good friend of mine once told me. After surviving Vietnam there is nothing that I am afraid of anymore, nothing scares me. That is exactly how the majority of your senior pilots feel here. I hope your coughers are chock full of cash to support your charter needs in the near future. I could be unemployed from here tomorrow and not give a rats a$$. You wanted a fight and you are going to find yourself immersed in a fire fight you cannot control. I would also like to add for attorneys billing five hunsky an hour I would of hoped they could have done better than that.
Hey b-19 Bob, Ford and Harrison goon, flops management or whomever else you are pretending to be. I am often reminded of what a good friend of mine once told me. After surviving Vietnam there is nothing that I am afraid of anymore, nothing scares me. That is exactly how the majority of your senior pilots feel here. I hope your coughers are chock full of cash to support your charter needs in the near future. I could be unemployed from here tomorrow and not give a rats a$$. You wanted a fight and you are going to find yourself immersed in a fire fight you cannot control. I would also like to add for attorneys billing five hunsky an hour I would of hoped they could have done better than that.
Ben Dover FLOPS
Active member
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2007
- Posts
- 36
Hey Bob
You should change your Handle to "BM-19". All of your posts resemble a 19 pound bowel movement.
You should change your Handle to "BM-19". All of your posts resemble a 19 pound bowel movement.
TurboHonda
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2004
- Posts
- 167
Ha Ha. That's a pretty good comeback, Bob. I'm starting to believe there might be some blood in your veins after all.
Not a Myth, Not an Urban Legend,
Let's have a show of hands. (metaphorically speaking) Who has heard the story of Shawn and the Toilet Paper? Better yet who has lived the story of Shawn and the Toilet Paper? When I first heard this story I thought it was a myth, but since I've heard it from at least 3 pilots with nearly identical details I think it has to be fairly credible. C'mon, you guys who lived the Shawn and the Toiler Paper adventure I invite you to add it to our Tidbits folder. It's an amusing and illustrative story. Who's gonna be first?
Let's have a show of hands. (metaphorically speaking) Who has heard the story of Shawn and the Toilet Paper? Better yet who has lived the story of Shawn and the Toilet Paper? When I first heard this story I thought it was a myth, but since I've heard it from at least 3 pilots with nearly identical details I think it has to be fairly credible. C'mon, you guys who lived the Shawn and the Toiler Paper adventure I invite you to add it to our Tidbits folder. It's an amusing and illustrative story. Who's gonna be first?
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