Flexjet side deal mediation attempt?

[GlorifiedCabbie]

FUD. 6 pilots have moved on in the last 30 days. The options side is getting worked so hard, pilots are leaving for more pay and less work. RH is in Dallas spewing his FUD and saying the Options pilots are lazy. RH is a manure spreader Scheduling is no longer honoring a 12 hour duty day after 3 consecutive days of 14 hours. I want to know who these lazy pilots are,because I should see them just hanging out at the FBOs. They are forcing us to call fatigue because they are no longer honoring their "guidlines"..

 

[el raton]

Imissmypilot...who told you I'm in the Challenger? I'm not.

How is it fair that fo's at flops are taking our chance of going there away? We got screwed, and we're gonna get it worse after the mcba. Especially if Ken is as bad of a businessman as the union says he is.

 

[Bjtdrvr]

So what you are saying is that you want to decertify so red label pilots can all stay safe even though many of them could not hold the position that they are in (in case of a furlough). Or decertify so KR could just get rid of all of the pilots in a single fleet if he so chooses because it would make financial sense for him to reduce training costs? Then who gets screwed? You are being very short sighted when it comes to the big picture!!!!! KR is all about money and keeping as much of it as he can.

 

[el raton]

So what you are saying is that you want to decertify so red label pilots can all stay safe even though many of them could not hold the position that they are in (in case of a furlough). Or decertify so KR could just get rid of all of the pilots in a single fleet if he so chooses because it would make financial sense for him to reduce training costs? Then who gets screwed? You are being very short sighted when it comes to the big picture!!!!! KR is all about money and keeping as much of it as he can.

I'm right where my seniority a flexjet should be. The onesky list does put me and every pilot around me in a possible danger of being bumped. Everything about this screams "fair", but "fair" only for Flops pilots and the top of the seniority list at Flexjet.

Why should I be willing to sacrifice what I have for something I don't believe in when I have other options that are better? Since the IBT was voted in nothing good has happened at Flex. Trust me, I'm not the only one who feels this way.

 

[Bjtdrvr]

I understand what you are saying in regards to the sli. What I am saying is are you better off with all of the.red label pilots getting a pass if there is another furlough or will YOU be in danger of being furloughed if KR has his way of furloughing out of seniority.

 

[Imissmypilot]

Imissmypilot...who told you I'm in the Challenger? I'm not.

How is it fair that fo's at flops are taking our chance of going there away? We got screwed, and we're gonna get it worse after the mcba. Especially if Ken is as bad of a businessman as the union says he is.

Whatever dude. We both know who each other are so let's be real. If you are a part of the only group that got slightly raw deal in SLI then you are a mid pack challenger Captain. There is no other option. If you are now saying you are not part of that group, then quit yer b!tching cuz you got no dog in the fight.

Those FO's at Flops have been working for what is now called OneSky longer than you or I or certainly any Lear Capt or Flex FO. The SLI is honoring seniority plain and simple. When I am wearing my selfish hat I'm not thrilled about it either but the fact is what was done was FAIR and it did not diminish my career expectations. So instead of being mid pack of a group of 300, now you're midpack of group of 600 with double the planes, customers and prospects. At best it's a wash. However, because you now have a union protecting your status and giving you other quality of life improvements I say it's a heck of a lot better than a wash.

BTW I don't think anyway ever said Kenn was bad businessman in the sense you are using it. Quite the opposite. After all, Kenn sure has a knack for lining his pockets with diamonds and gold. The issue is the fact he does so unethically and on the sweat and backs of some by trading on the gullibility and selfishness of others.

You people refuse to do your research. You insist on believing fairy tales propagated by sooth sayers preying on your deepest insecurities. As I said before, I think $$ is at the heart of your cause here el raton. Fair enough. But now you need to ask yourself if you honestly are going to take a hit. And if so, is what you're getting worth to you?

In my book, a stable if not rising W2 with job protections and quality of life improvements does not equal a tragedy. And if anything it's a heck of a lot better than what we've got for the past 7-8 years. By all accounts that's what this union is getting us. Why don't you at least take a wait and see approach to July before you guys keep making a$$es of yourselves with these petitions and hyperbole.

 

[el raton]

I have no clue, nor do I care who you are. I'm amazed at the Flex pilots that are fighting so hard to give away their seats. So be it. I'm not in this group. I just want to save what I have.

 

[Imissmypilot]

I'm right where my seniority a flexjet should be. The onesky list does put me and every pilot around me in a possible danger of being bumped. Everything about this screams "fair", but "fair" only for Flops pilots and the top of the seniority list at Flexjet.

Why should I be willing to sacrifice what I have for something I don't believe in when I have other options that are better? Since the IBT was voted in nothing good has happened at Flex. Trust me, I'm not the only one who feels this way.

I really don't think you understand the SLI, the CBA or history.

A union is the only thing preventing Kenn Ricci from acting on what you say your fears are. I respect you, I like you but friend you are just butthurt over a few slots on a list and that is so short sighted.

I actually disagree with you regarding the IBT and the general feeling of the pilot group. I have been on record not exactly being the biggest fan of leadership but I am getting the feeling I will have to eat a big dose of humble pie. They have been slowly and methodically winning here. I would encourage you to investigate the truth behind that statement and just exactly who is responsible for it.

People are starting to realize the chef behind our sh!t sandwich of late is management. If you don't recognize the game of union busting than you are just too dense to ever see it.

I think you, me and others will start to feel just little more grateful soon for our union leaders. They fought an uphill battle and have had their reputations trashed all so you and I could have a better tomorrow. I do feel a little sheepish and embarrassed sometimes about that but if anything what I am starting to see from the line is a lot more gratefulness and a lot less bashing. To put it simply, the union is winning the PR game, the courts game and hopefully the contracts game. Even the company lawyer knows it now. The only remaining holdout is Kenn and people like you.

 

[Imissmypilot]

I have no clue, nor do I care who you are. I'm amazed at the Flex pilots that are fighting so hard to give away their seats. So be it. I'm not in this group. I just want to save what I have.

Kenn Ricci is the only one giving away seats. To junior pilots who don't deserve them.

So do you want to continue Kenn's way where there is NOTHING stopping him from signing away your seat, seniority number and pay...

or

Do you want to try it the union's way where you do not lose your seat (no system flush) \, you do not lose your pay or you do not suffer some arbitrary consequence the next time Kenn gets a wild hair?

It's like arguing with a brick wall. You are just pissed beyond logic.

Have fun with that. But stop ********************ing up my career so you can remain pissed.

 

[Propilot77]

......

 

[GlorifiedCabbie]

https://youtu.be/_dm9k0XHM6A
How quickly we forget.

 

[V1 Rotate]

I have no clue, nor do I care who you are. I'm amazed at the Flex pilots that are fighting so hard to give away their seats. So be it. I'm not in this group. I just want to save what I have.

You're either illiterate or just refuse to accept the truth. NO ONE will lose their seat due to integration. It's federal law and it's repeated in th Flight Options contract, the one that you fear so much. You'll only be bumped from a seat due to a furlough or fleet reduction, which are management decisions, not the Union's. And in management's 7.15 proposal, if you're non Red Label, then it's lights out for you with their insane bumping rights proposal that they continue to defend on Yammer.

 

[GlorifiedCabbie]

El, are you more concerned about having a title or with a decent quality of life? I'll swing the gear and call you Captain as long as they compensate me fairly.

 

[shanes123]

El Raton isn't gonna change his mind. He enjoys KR sticking his El Baton in his mouth to much like the rest of the RL,IRL,IGMs.

 

[Imissmypilot]

You're either illiterate or just refuse to accept the truth. NO ONE will lose their seat due to integration. It's federal law and it's repeated in th Flight Options contract, the one that you fear so much. You'll only be bumped from a seat due to a furlough or fleet reduction, which are management decisions, not the Union's. And in management's 7.15 proposal, if you're non Red Label, then it's lights out for you with their insane bumping rights proposal that they continue to defend on Yammer.

The problem is that he is not illiterate, nor are some (but not all) of the yammer jammers. They just refuse to accept the truth.

It is extremely frustrating to have had the opportunity to read all the union proposals for the CBA and then get on yammer and see my fellow pilots try to destroy and distract away from me getting what is in those proposals.

RH and others have claimed the union proposals are unrealistic. Really? Have these people even read them? Because when I read them in light of our current standards, the Net Jets CBA and industry trends I think they actually are beyond reasonable! It seems to me they were not trying to go high to come low but actually put forth proposals that could have been accepted right away.

I find it entertaining Rick is still so worried about being outted as the liar he is claiming unprofessionalism and the JW gets on there and actually calls one of his own pilots an a liar! Who are these clowns? But once again I digress...

The only thing that kept us from getting a contract in 9 months was the company. If you are telling me that a group of 6 guys with full time jobs, families and little experience could wade through and come up with a complete and reasonable proposal in that period of time but the company couldn't put forth one single valid proposal in that time is your proof then I call BS!

Here are the facts: we DID have a contract proposal in 9 months. The union presented one. What we did not get was the right to vote on that contract because the company (and a federal judge said it was proven) REFUSED to negotiate. The only reason we are in arbitration now is because a judge is forcing it otherwise the company would keep delaying years if they could. Perhaps Rick was just making his prediction of the 9 months being impossible because he was privy to Kenn's plan to delay, delay and delay some more.

So we finally get some progress and a judge to put an end to the delay tactic and now we have a group of un-informed and/or pigheaded and/or stupid pilots led by the idiot of all idiots that wants to give the company back the right to keep delaying by forcing an end to arbitration? What ********************ing reality bending drugs are these guys on?

I am pissed. And you should be too. And you jammers should be worried about your reputation because now FW, MW, WJ, MR, PD, RA, SG, JJ etc... I am going to do everything in my power to help everyone see that every day this fight continues and takes away bread from my table and stress in my career is your fault. Your fault because you refuse to read and research for yourself. Your fault because you obstruct not on principle or fact but on stubbornness. Your fault because you trash the reputations of your fellow pilots for sport. You don't look to engage them in fruitful debate or point out hypocrisy (because you can't) so you smear them from a high tower where the company protects your disgusting behavior. Your work against my career and family will not be forgotten and I will do everything in my power to remind others of it to. YOUR CHOICE TO BE A PAWN IN THE FIGHT OF MAN AGAINST HIS OWN EMPLOYEES will not soon be forgotten.

Recently on yammer in which one of the jammers accused our union representing pilots of not having Flexjet pilot interests at heart. What dream world is he living in that he then goes on to assert management does? These people are out of touch with the most basic basics of reality.

Your union leaders ARE pilots who work on the line every day. Do you really think they'd cut off their nose just to spite their face?

The Chairman of the Board and his minions have all but declared intifada on our own pilots. But suddenly they are the champion of all that is decent and holy in contract negotiations?

Whatever the ******************** you are drinking should scare even the hardest of crack addicts clean. That is some brain wasting kool aid.

I just found out today yet another union leader is leaving. And the jammers are sure to make hay as they have with the others who are gone now too. A few months ago I would have been pissed at him. But today I have just resigned myself to the fact this is what happens when good men are maligned and battle scarred and unappreciated. So today I am pissed for him. I am pissed for what he has had to endure on my behalf.

I know it doesn't mean much coming from the shadows of cowardice (as many of us are still just not looking to out ourselves in front of this management team or the trashing jammers) but I do give a sincere thank you for all our pilots who are risking their reputations, careers, families etc... to fight for us all. You have my utmost admiration and appreciation. You are men among men.

 

[GlorifiedCabbie]

I wish I could get on Yammer to remind people of some of Uncle's visions. Anybody like the idea of moving from one airframe to another and starting over at year 1 pay? That was the way things worked in KR's world prior to the Union.

 

[V1 Rotate]

I wish I could get on Yammer to remind people of some of Uncle's visions. Anybody like the idea of moving from one airframe to another and starting over at year 1 pay? That was the way things worked in KR's world prior to the Union.

If the grievance filed a month ago works out, you'll get your wish.

 

[Club ORD FO]

Well said iMiss.

 

[dime line]

I wish I could get on Yammer to remind people of some of Uncle's visions. Anybody like the idea of moving from one airframe to another and starting over at year 1 pay? That was the way things worked in KR's world prior to the Union.

"Slide to Poverty"

 

[1folinepilot]

It amazes me that the flex guys are trying to do a side deal mediation attempt to "fix the SLI". Those guys got a huge gift as it is already! There are over 45 guys that were hired after me are senior to me and there are guys as PIC in the G450 that were hired 13 years after me. What else could they possibly want? My first born? They already have my career expectation and pay!

So much for doing what is right. I have no respect for those clowns