Flexjet QOL getting flushed down the toilet.

ArtVandalay

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Now the talk of not giving hotels in domiciles? It is now subjective whether you get a hotel room or not? The downturn in the economy is now giving Flex mgmt the excuse they need to do what they've always wanted to do. Lets take a look at what our wonderful leader has done for us so far..

A layoff, a 2 day work reduction across the board that equates to about a 18% pay cut , only 3 days off after long recurrent now, no crew meals on standby, and now hotels in domiciles is subjective. Oh, and thanks for the 4% raise that puts us in line with "industry standards" and slaps the face of every person you just laid off. What's next?

You want a union don't you?
 

unclepetey

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They will take away hotel rooms for a bit in domicile. Then a few weeks later they will happily announce that hotel rooms are back, actually one room for 3 crew members. Some idiot will then come on here and post that we got our rooms back.
 

F/O

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Same old greedy airline exec / Fred Reid playbook. Doesn't surprise you, does it?
 

ArtVandalay

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I'm usually one not to complain about a raise; however, in our current situation, it seems moronic to give raises.
 

CALRepublic

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Now the talk of not giving hotels in domiciles?

You want a union don't you?
Yeah, but you also want that gig to last, don't you??

If you're going to over-night at your domicile, why not just go home and save the company a few bucks???

I guess you have no problem with those people that over-night at their domicile, request and check into a hotel room (just for the points) and then drive home... the company just spent $140 so someone can get a few points and not even use the freeking room.
 
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gutshotdraw

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I live 8 minutes from the airport so I stay at home when we layover in my domicile. But there are many guys that live a looong way from their DECLARED gateway city. These are the people that would be negatively affected if required to stay at home during a layover in their gateway. They don't want the room for the points.....
 

CALRepublic

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Correct, some people live a loong way from way from home, and they'd be affected..... But many don't, I think it's a good time to try to help the company a bit.... every dollar counts...

if you're complaining about not having a hotel room at your own domicile, then life it's not that bad... talk to someone who commutes on the airlines to work, you'll see what I mean
 

EatSleepFly

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Yeah, but you also want that gig to last, don't you??

If you're going to over-night at your domicile, why not just go home and save the company a few bucks???

I guess you have no problem with those people that over-night at their domicile, request and check into a hotel room (just for the points) and then drive home... the company just spent $140 so someone can get a few points and not even use the Freeking room.
First of all, I've never seen or heard of anyone getting a room just to get points and then go home.

Secondly, to answer the question I bolded, Flex's "domiciles" are a joke. We're not talking about the little podunk one-airport towns that you guys are fortunate enough to have as bases. We're talking about New York, Los Angeles, South Florida, etc. AND all the surrounding areas.

They're almost all huge, and they're almost all in areas with bad traffic during the "slow" hours and literally parking lots during rush hours. Even in the nicest of weather (and that's when it seems to happen), all it takes is one dumb $#!t to cause an accident and it's game over. Might as well get comfortable. I sat in the back of a sedan for over two hours once trying to get from TEB to HPN, because an accident. Then you have the high cost of living in many of them causes many people to live at the outer edge.

To go home instead of a hotel just because you're in your "domicile" (which should really be called "region" or something) could easily require three hours of driving each way in NY or LA. Yeah, that sounds like a blast. All it will take is one forced charter as a result of a crewmember getting in an accident trying to hurry back from their overnight and it will end up costing them more than they saved. Not to mention flushing QOL down the toilet in the first place.

And subjective? Who decides? Scheduling? Yeah right. Give me a break. Like they need one more thing to screw up.

I really really hope this isn't true. If it is, I probably won't be going back. :(
 
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Photoflight

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yah, its cool when you land in Plam Springs and get no hotel room because your domicile is LA but your home is up near ontario and your cars at SNA.
 

FalconPilot69

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OK, CAL, these morons should be fired for being friken Aholes! The fact is that some of us who do live in gateway are at the 90 minute limit of our gateways. Now you want us to drive 3 to 4 hours depending on traffic? Are you going to be happy when the person next to you is falling asleep because they are beat from driving 3 or 4 hours? No, you will probably rat them out. In some cases, it is the only way gateway crews get rest. This new policy is bogus. What's next? Maybe this policy is designed to stop those like you describe. But lets face it, why hurt the masses for a couple of morons. Quit ************************* footing around and fire the ones who are doing this and leave the rest of us who bust our humps day in and day out with the company that they think is the best there is to work for. Rant off

I guess you have no problem with those people that over-night at their domicile, request and check into a hotel room (just for the points) and then drive home... the company just spent $140 so someone can get a few points and not even use the freeking room.
 

ArtVandalay

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CAL it's not about saving the company money, we all do that on a daily basis, it's about principles and doing right thing. Sometimes I take the hotel, sometimes I don't. It depends on how I feel. If I have a 5am departure on 10 hours of rest, I will not be driving over an hour to get home regardless. The company is NOT going to save that much money in the grand scheme of things on these hotels. They piss away twice our hotel budget a year on stupid $hit that I won't get into here so, don't judge whether our life is bad or not.
 

FastJP4

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It's amazing how quickly FG turned what used to be a decent job into the laughingstock of the Fractional industry.

One has to wonder if he's modeling it after Mesa - but then again you don't get a nickname like his for nothing.
 

unclepetey

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It's amazing how quickly FG turned what used to be a decent job into the laughingstock of the Fractional industry.

One has to wonder if he's modeling it after Mesa - but then again you don't get a nickname like his for nothing.
Exactly. I worked at Mesa back in the day and now I wish I would have stayed there, LOL. How sad is that?
 

Pacific

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1.
If you're going to over-night at your domicile, why not just go home and save the company a few bucks???

2.
I guess you have no problem with those people that over-night at their domicile, request and check into a hotel room (just for the points) and then drive home... the company just spent $140 so someone can get a few points and not even use the freeking room.
1. Because depending on the gateway you live in home could be 3 plus hours away.

2. Anyone doing this should be fired. From what I have experienced quite the opposite is true. Knowing I was planned to overnight in my gateway and close to home I told dispatch and scheduling that no hotel would be needed while opening up that morning. During closeout of course I received hotel information. Again let the company know I didn't need the hotel room. Never was canceled...a waist of $149.00
 

doh

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Yeah, but you also want that gig to last, don't you??

If you're going to over-night at your domicile, why not just go home and save the company a few bucks???

I guess you have no problem with those people that over-night at their domicile, request and check into a hotel room (just for the points) and then drive home... the company just spent $140 so someone can get a few points and not even use the freeking room.


I take the hotel in ADS. If I go home, I have to get a sedan to DFW to get my car. The next day I drive back to ADS. At the end of my rotation I have to get a sedan back to ADS. Each sedan costs $65, the same as the hotel at ADS($59 including tax), so I have spent $130 as oppossed to $59 for the hotel alone. Does that make sense? I don't think so, so I take the hotel. If I happen to be on the Ft Worth side, the wife gets me and I go home. I am trying to do what makes sense from a cost standpoint. I get enough hotel points, so that never enters into the equation. Does that explain it for you? I hope so!
 

smartelephant

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I agree that's it wrong for the company not to give hotels in the domiciles anymore. Especially without changing the callout times if the schedule changes overnight. But, from where I sit (on furlough for just over a month now) I would gladly pay for my room at ADS or DAL just to get my job back. Even with the paycut. Because let me tell you, being on unemployment is no fun and there are no flying jobs avaliable without committing to living overseas and even then you need alot more expereince than some of us have. So, I'm not bitter about the furlough. That's just business. But, If I were you guys I would just be happy to still have the job. And hopefully FR will leave soon since he doesn't care about this place anyway.
 

FastJP4

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FG will not leave until someone in Montreal points him towards a door. He's found his perfect situation:

1. An incredibly weak pilot group, and no form of any union to bother him with the pesky little details of contractural obligations. QOL issues for the pilots - "who cares". Slash their pay - "who cares". Throw as many on the street as possible - "who cares". No food while on standby duty - "who cares". No hotel if laying over in a domicile - "who cares". That's just for starters - you can rest assured their will be more treats in the future.

2. The rest of management at the Waterview is in CYA mode, and all are afraid to say anything to him. He is the king, and they (much like the pilots) are his servants.

3. His boss's are 1,500 miles away. They talk to FG, and FG supplies them with numbers and info. I seriously doubt they are even aware of how he is a one man wrecking crew in Waterview - most likely they think he is doing a wonderful job, afterall - Fred says he is.

Nope, FG will suck the life out of what used to be a respectable, career oriented company. THAT is his personal business model. His additional compensation package comes from margins - profit percentage, decrease in costs, "efficiencies", slashing labor costs, saved money from hotels & food etc. etc. etc.

A HUGE chunk of what is being ripped away from the pilot group goes towards HIS bonus's for HIS bank account. If you think he gives a rats a$$ about you whatsoever - you are sorely mistaken.

The ONLY way to do something about this is to form some type of a bargaining position. And with someone like FG, your not forming a bargaining position to get at FG, your forming a bargaining position to get the message to Montreal. And rest assured - those walking on pins and needles throughout Waterview want the same thing to happen.

To know your future, study the past. What your experiencing now is FG's history on pilot interaction. He's had 30 years to prepare. Are you in a position to defend yourself's against him?
 
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