Fired From Virgin America

[bluejuice787]

A good friend that I used to work with at Jetblue was recently fired. I do not know all the details but I can say that it was the most un-called for firing I have ever heard of. Apparently he asked a question during indoc about being typed as a captain. The guy that answered the question is know as an egomaniac and was most likely hired to manage pilot expectations by intimidation. Ironically he was know for these very same qualities at Airtran.

My friend is one of the most trustworthy honorable men I know. I have worked with him for nearly ten years and can say unequivically that he did not deserve what was so easily handed to him by Virgin.

It is my personal opinion that he was fired for the very qualities that got him hired. He is honest, professional, hard working and a dedicated family man.

Be very careful about applying to Virgin. They say one thing about treatment and values and do the opposite.

Juice

 

[Lear70]

Good to know. They called me for an interview...

After being handed my walking papers by airTran just last month (although for lack of anything even resembling meaningful reasons), I was a bit surprised to receive an interview offer from Virgin with the termination fresh on my record and on my application as well.

Definitely don't need to get into yet ANOTHER "shiny and pretty on the outside, just as black as some Legacies on the inside" kind of carrier...

There may be more to the story, but after what happened to me, I'm inclined to believe the worst rather than the best out of some of these places.

 

[Joblu]

Sorry to hear that guys! That surely blows. What are you doing now Lear?

 

[bluejuice787]

Good to know. They called me for an interview...

After being handed my walking papers by airTran just last month (although for lack of anything even resembling meaningful reasons), I was a bit surprised to receive an interview offer from Virgin with the termination fresh on my record and on my application as well.

Definitely don't need to get into yet ANOTHER "shiny and pretty on the outside, just as black as some Legacies on the inside" kind of carrier...

There may be more to the story, but after what happened to me, I'm inclined to believe the worst rather than the best out of some of these places.

I bet it is the same good ol boys at Airtran that are now at VA

 

[A350]

Lear:

Hope you find clearer skies during your time in this "career".....

I can't believe that VA just cans people for nothing...the first JB guy that got the axe deserved it from what I have heard at least from the people that used to work with him at Indy Air. The latest guy is a mystery but there is usually three sides to the story, the company, the employee, and the truth.

A350

 

[swaforme]

I have seen many fired at various airlines in my career. Unfortunately most of the time it was justifiable. In many cases an attorney was hired and the employee was able to get their job back through litigation. Sometimes for better or worse.

I would say that if the story is true how you tell it, your friend would have an excellent chance of saving his job with the correct representation. Especially in California where the courts seem very empathetic to the employee side. Of course why would you want to work for a company that you had to sue to keep the job. Happens all the time though. We have had our fair share of that here at old SWA. We had an f/o let the Ca run into a gas station and they didn't fire him.

Like he said above, always more to the story.

 

[thruthemurk]

Lear:

Hope you find clearer skies during your time in this "career".....

I can't believe that VA just cans people for nothing...the first JB guy that got the axe deserved it from what I have heard at least from the people that used to work with him at Indy Air. The latest guy is a mystery but there is usually three sides to the story, the company, the employee, and the truth.

A350

So they have already fired at least two pilots in several months of operation? Sounds like a problem with the hiring process - or the culture- or both.

 

[Old School 737]

Good to know. They called me for an interview...

After being handed my walking papers by airTran just last month (although for lack of anything even resembling meaningful reasons), I was a bit surprised to receive an interview offer from Virgin with the termination fresh on my record and on my application as well.

Definitely don't need to get into yet ANOTHER "shiny and pretty on the outside, just as black as some Legacies on the inside" kind of carrier...

There may be more to the story, but after what happened to me, I'm inclined to believe the worst rather than the best out of some of these places.

How long were you at Airtran?

 

[Captain Overs]

You guys crack me up. I'm sure there is more to the story, but you guys probably don't care about the facts.

 

[Lear70]

Was at airTran about a year and a half, grievance and civil suit pending, but it's a long, drawn-out process. Will be a toss-up to see which happens first, the arbitration or a new contract T.A. at airTran which *should* (DFR issue) bring all the "hostages" back (people who were vocal about the T.A. and have found themselves on the streets... there's more than just me).

I'm flying Lears again, just finishing sims and getting ready for OE.

Overs, you can laugh all you want, and there IS more to the story... a lot more that the company did that shows personal malice that I can't talk about right now but, rest assured, it WILL come out in the civil suit(s).

Yes, there's always two sides to the story (I believe I was the first person to say that), but sometimes the person crying "foul" is in the right. Or do you automatically assume that ALL companies are ALWAYS doing the morally- and ethically-correct thing?

Shall we talk bankruptcies and pensions? Because there's PLENTY of material there to show corruption... It's big business; they do what they think they can get away with and, if you're in the way, too bad.

 

[AA717driver]

From what I hear, VA hired some individuals who probably should have been fired themselves in the past.

They are slowly making some changes in personel but probably not fast enough.

It seems that some good guys get $hitcanned and the feces floats to the top.

Good luck Lear! TC

 

[~~~^~~~]

AA717 - You may be correct & don't assume that these guys were not fired, or so mistrusted that they came to work one day and found they were locked out of their own offices by their fellow managers.

One was famous for trying to divert FAA enforcement actions against the Pilots' Certificates to keep the Company's Certificate clean. He would tell the pilots he had things handled with the FAA if they just would not involve the union. Then he would go to work documenting a case against his pilots, making up wild allegations and just outright lying about the "facts."

The union would give pilots common sense advice that the FAA does not delegate its' enforcement authority to airline managers - no more than traffic cops let private individuals enforce traffic laws. By the time the pilot put 2 + 2 together this manager would already have a "deal" made with the FSDO that made the pilot the scape goat. Legitimate safety concerns were swept under the rug while everyone wondered how a pilot could be so crazy as to have performed the things management had "documented."

Some in the FSDO knew how this guy operated and would give the pilots the benefit of making their case, or even better, did a little safety investigation on their own. But, many of the government workers were too happy to allow this manager to do their jobs for them and just went along.

He turned up at Virgin America and many hoped he had turned over a new leaf with the new job. These details are only provided in the event that the M.O. is the same.

 

[bluejuice787]

AA717 - You may be correct & don't assume that these guys were not fired, or so mistrusted that they came to work one day and found they were locked out of their own offices by their fellow managers.

One was famous for trying to divert FAA enforcement actions against the Pilots' Certificates to keep the Company's Certificate clean. He would tell the pilots he had things handled with the FAA if they just would not involve the union. Then he would go to work documenting a case against his pilots, making up wild allegations and just outright lying about the "facts."

The union would give pilots common sense advice that the FAA does not delegate its' enforcement authority to airline managers - no more than traffic cops let private individuals enforce traffic laws. By the time the pilot put 2 + 2 together this manager would already have a "deal" made with the FSDO that made the pilot the scape goat. Legitimate safety concerns were swept under the rug while everyone wondered how a pilot could be so crazy as to have performed the things management had "documented."

Some in the FSDO knew how this guy operated and would give the pilots the benefit of making their case, or even better, did a little safety investigation on their own. But, many of the government workers were too happy to allow this manager to do their jobs for them and just went along.

He turned up at Virgin America and many hoped he had turned over a new leaf with the new job. These details are only provided in the event that the M.O. is the same.

Interesting? S.C.? B.W.?

 

[Soulfly]

How many scabs are left at Airtran?

 

[Spud]

About 500 less than CAL or UAL.

 

[FDJ2]

Definitely don't need to get into yet ANOTHER "shiny and pretty on the outside, just as black as some Legacies on the inside" kind of carrier...

The likelihood of getting canned at a Legacy carrier, with solid union representation, just for asking a question or some other frivolous reason is zero.


Lear, the "shiny and pretty" thing is a fast upgrade in a shiny new jet at a start up, the downside is a lack of good representation when you get in trouble or some manager has it in for you.

Don't associate what happened to you at Airtran with "just as black as some legacies."

 

[bluejuice787]

The likelihood of getting canned at a Legacy carrier, with solid union representation, just for asking a question or some other frivolous reason is zero.


Lear, the "shiny and pretty" thing is a fast upgrade in a shiny new jet at a start up, the downside is a lack of good representation when you get in trouble or some manager has it in for you.

Don't associate what happened to you at Airtran with "just as black as some legacies."

agreed

 

[whymeworry?]

why anyone would work for VA is beyond me.

 

[jonjuan]

Lear70!!!

I'm flying Lears again, just finishing sims and getting ready for OE.

A bit OT, but your screen name might just come true....Maybe in time for your airtran return.

http://www.learjetnxt.com/

October 30, 2007
BOMBARDIER AEROSPACE LAUNCHES LEARJET NXT AIRCRAFT

Bombardier Aerospace has launched an all-new Learjet aircraft, provisionally named Learjet NXT. The Learjet NXT, positioned between the midsize and the super midsize segments, is the next generation in Learjet excellence.

The development program of this all-new jet with continues to progress well, and it is on target for a public unveiling in October 2008, in time to commemorate the 45th anniversary of the first flight of a Learjet aircraft.

 

[PCL_128]

How many scabs are left at Airtran?

Flying the line? Less than 20, I believe.