FedEx and Pilots reach TA !!!!

[Purpledog]

I prefer to have most of my money available to me ( or my heirs) rather than lose most of it by keeling over two days after retirement after flying night freight for so many years.

Amen. Finally some sense on here. Also with money in hand, much easier to retire early so you don't die right after retirement.

 

[Laughing_Jakal]

14% B-Fund

I heard the company offered a 14% B-Fund but it was traded for mandatory benefits for (Gay) domestic partners....

Hell, if we are going to rumour monger....then it might as well be inflammatory!

The company likes the A-fund because they have done a study of the box lunch remnants and find everyone eats the pecan pie and cheese cake. Most of the grapes and fruit are thrown away. I think they think the A-Fund will save them in the end....banking on the increased rates of night flying and colon cancer.

 

[VaB]

Hell, if we are going to rumour monger....then it might as well be inflammatory!

Rumor mongering?!? What else have you heard?

 

[PurpleTail]

I'm just wondering where "pay for the delay" comes into play. If our pay raises are pretty much in line with our table position and our four cornerstone issues were "effectively addressed", great...but unless there is some serious retro pay I would say the company won. Hopefully the TA will prove otherwise.

My thoughts exactly.

I know compensation was our '5th priority' but I was kind of hoping for something a little better than a 1% increase in contributions and 9% raise. Two and a half years after the fact that is essentially a 3% raise each year which, IMO, isn't that much of a 'gain' than what was expected at a minimum.

If rig goes to 3.75 and medical does NOT go up than their were some gains in that regard and some QOL improvements. But, by no means, did we hit a homerun as far as a 'raise' is concerned. FWIW, lets hope the TA says more.

 

[Gearup727]

From what I understand the B-Fund is only there because we are required to retire at age 60 vs 65. Who says the B-Fund dosen't go away when and if this age 65 comes into being. I know the over 60 guys get a letter from FedEx straight away once they go over 60 they cut off the B-Fund. Next you really don't own the money in the B-Fund. It is stuck in the lame selection of Vanuguard Funds some underachiever at FedEx thinks is adequte for your retirement planning. If the market takes a big sh t there goes your B-Fund. I like to see us negeotiate a plan where the pilots A-Fund is placed in an acount that is seperate from the company. Once the money goes in it can't flow back to the company if hard times come.
Just my 2cents worth.

 

[Aviator7576]

B plan

Gearup...

Can the fedex guys make their own fund/stock decisions with the b plan? Our base fund selection is Fidelity but we can opt to go with the brokerage link and play experts ourselves. And why is it cut off at 60? Is it contractual?

Wondering,

Aviator7576

 

[Gearup727]

FedEx dosen't have brokerage option. All we have is around a dozen standard type funds. S&P index, agressive, international, bond, ect.

 

[Aviator7576]

B plan

Gearup..

And the age 60 cutoff?

Aviator7576

 

[Gearup727]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the only reason the B-Fund came into existence in the airline industry was because pilots have to retire at age 60. I guess at the time age 65 was the normal retirement age. They were not able to acrue retirement for those 5 years like other professions. So the IRS allowed pilots companies to create and contribute to the B-Funds. If pilots are allowed to go to age 65 I could see the rational for the B-Fund not being allowed by the IRS. I'm not tring to hijack the thread but this back and forth on the B-Fund may become a mute point when the age 65 goes into effect.

 

[Laughing_Jakal]

rig change

If the rig changed to 3.75, then that = a 6.67% increase on trips that are paid by rig.

 

[Purpled]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the only reason the B-Fund came into existence in the airline industry was because pilots have to retire at age 60. I guess at the time age 65 was the normal retirement age. They were not able to acrue retirement for those 5 years like other professions. So the IRS allowed pilots companies to create and contribute to the B-Funds. If pilots are allowed to go to age 65 I could see the rational for the B-Fund not being allowed by the IRS. I'm not tring to hijack the thread but this back and forth on the B-Fund may become a mute point when the age 65 goes into effect.

Sounds like one more reason not to change the age.

 

[FoxHunter]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the only reason the B-Fund came into existence in the airline industry was because pilots have to retire at age 60. I guess at the time age 65 was the normal retirement age. They were not able to acrue retirement for those 5 years like other professions. So the IRS allowed pilots companies to create and contribute to the B-Funds. If pilots are allowed to go to age 65 I could see the rational for the B-Fund not being allowed by the IRS. I'm not tring to hijack the thread but this back and forth on the B-Fund may become a mute point when the age 65 goes into effect.

Tax law is written by the Congress, not the IRS. Today the move is toward more Defined Contribution plans (B Plans), not Defined Benefit plans (A Plans).

 

[tomgoodman]

Another monger

Rumor mongering?!? What else have you heard?

FedEx/UPS merger imminent. New corporate name: Fed Up.

 

[Purpled]

FedEx/UPS merger imminent. New corporate name: Fed Up.

We already tried merging, with these results:

http://www.captionmachine.com/archives/2002/03/20/ups-and-fedex-crash/

 

[Brian a300]

If your Negotiating Committee truly speaks for you as most of you have said, you should be voting yes without even looking at the TA.
I know I will vote yes, those guys are true heros. Wouldn't it be great if the vote came in at 95% pass. This would send a true messasge that the Negotiators do truly speak for us. Congrats to all!!!​

 

[VaB]

If your Negotiating Committee truly speaks for you as most of you have said, you should be voting yes without even looking at the TA.
I know I will vote yes, those guys are true heros. Wouldn't it be great if the vote came in at 95% pass. This would send a true messasge that the Negotiators do truly speak for us. Congrats to all!!!​

LOL! I love you P3 guys, the eternal optimists.

Screw it, I'm with ya, where's my ballot?

 

[donger]

If your Negotiating Committee truly speaks for you as most of you have said, you should be voting yes without even looking at the TA.​

I know I will vote yes, those guys are true heros. Wouldn't it be great if the vote came in at 95% pass. This would send a true message that the Negotiators do truly speak for us. Congrats to all!!!​

Our MEC has not released the TA to the members. They themselves may not have had a chance to review its language. At that point they will release it to the members along with their "vote recommendation".

The days of the home run died with Delta's contract before 9/11.

 

[Echopapa]

If your Negotiating Committee truly speaks for you as most of you have said, you should be voting yes without even looking at the TA.


I know I will vote yes, those guys are true heros. Wouldn't it be great if the vote came in at 95% pass. This would send a true messasge that the Negotiators do truly speak for us. Congrats to all!!!​

I disagree. There is a reason for the membership vote..one of which being that our negotiating commitee had to make some compromises.

Be a responsible union member, read the TA, discuss, and then vote. If you vote no be prepared to walk...if you vote yes...no more bitchin for 4 years about the contract.

Oh...a 95% vote sends the message that the company gave in to easily. Their goal is 51%...the crappiest deal that 1% over 50% would accept.

 

[Boxav8r]

Just curious... where'd the 7% retro figure come from?

 

[Brian a300]

Just curious... where'd the 7% retro figure come from?

THAT WAS THE TABLED DEAL THE UNION WANTED!!

 

[Fox2]

Regarding the 3%/yr. pay increase: It costs each pilot 1.95%/yr in union dues, plus 1.6% Rate of Inflation = 3.55%. That's a LOSS of 0.55%/yr in real dollars in years two through four. Even if one discounts the rate of inflation, one must at least subtract the costs of doing business. So 3.0%/yr. - 1.95%/yr. = 1.55%/yr. pay increase.

Over the life of the contract, the entire pay raise equation might look like this:
9% first year pay increase + 3%/yr over following three years = 18% total.
1.95% union dues X 4 yrs = 7.8% cost of doing business

18% - 7.8% = 10.2% pay raise before rate of inflation factored in.

1.6% Rate of Inflation (conservatively) X 4 yrs. = 6.4%.

So, 10.2% - 6.4% = 3.8% real increase in pay over four years.
3.8% divided by 4 yrs. = .95% pay increase per yr. in real dollars.

With inflation on the rise and the Feds correspondingly raising interest rates, it doesn't seem like much after two plus years of negotiating. Hopefully, there are other work rule improvements that translate into REAL dollars.

 

[Purpled]

So 3.0%/yr. - 1.95%/yr. = 1.55%/yr. pay increase.

This is the worst math I've seen since the Gore campaign.

1.95% of 3.00% is .02535% The union gets an extra quarter of a percent compared to what they are getting now.

Do you also think that when you make that last dollar which puts you into the next higher tax bracket that you are actually losing money now because of that raise?

 

[USMCFDX]

Purpled I guess he likes fuzzy math. Fox2 spent all that time on that post just to get it wrong.

Fox2 probably spells potato with an e.

 

[Attkpuke]

Gearup"s comment...

"FedEx dosen't have brokerage option. All we have is around a dozen standard type funds. S&P index, agressive, international, bond, ect."

is incorrect. You may, by contacting the plan administrator via employee benefits, opt out of the funds offered and self-direct. Not many do it and I'm not sure of the ramifications of doing so but I have spoken personally with a crew member who is doing it. I believe this goes for the 401k as well as the B fund...the important thing is make sure it's done within the/a "qualified" account, ie a a tax deferred account.

 

[Brian a300]

Why not stop speculating and wait for the TA? I believe we will all be happy, but again I do think the glass is half full..

 

[VaB]

Why not stop speculating and wait for the TA? I believe we will all be happy, but again I do think the glass is half full..

Happy or not, ya gotta vote the first one down.

 

[Brian a300]

Happy or not, ya gotta vote the first one down.

Wait and read it 1st, u may be surprised!!

 

[LivinDaDream]

VaB,

I'm not sure where you get this "vote the first one down" mantra from. Is this your first contract ever, or what?

Go back through the negotiating history of all airlines and show me one positive outcome from a "vote the first one down" philosophy. That is SO short-sided and naive.

Like several wise folks on this thread have said, wait for the TA, read it, attend road shows, ask questions, think it through, and then vote your best interest. I would actually encourage you to contact a rep or a negotiating committee member and ask them what they think about "vote the first one down". Then explain to them why you think that makes so much sense. I would actually like to hear your arguments for this stance.

I'm not telling you how to vote, I would just hope that my fellow pilots are using a little more responsible approach to an important matter.

 

[PurpleTail]

Regarding the 3%/yr. pay increase: It costs each pilot 1.95%/yr in union dues, plus 1.6% Rate of Inflation = 3.55%. That's a LOSS of 0.55%/yr in real dollars in years two through four. Even if one discounts the rate of inflation, one must at least subtract the costs of doing business. So 3.0%/yr. - 1.95%/yr. = 1.55%/yr. pay increase.

.

Also, on a side note, your Union dues are tax deductable so you get a lot of that money back...quit crying about you RAISE when 90% of the industry have been taking DEEP cuts.

 

[twgordy]

Here is an idea! If you guys don't like working at FedEx may I suggest you put your app in with ASA, Skywest, Comair, etc....! Mabey you would be happier.