FDX and furloughed pilots

[PHX767]

This subject has been on another thread, but I wanted to get some more response on the issue.

It was brought up that FDX will not consider furloughees except from USAir.

My contact at FDX says that there was a memo stating the rumors about not hiring furloughed pilots was untrue due to potential lawsuits. The new hires may require signing a letter giving up any previous seniority numbers but that has not been determined.

At AA, the company must offer a furloughed pilot recall even if he has sent a letter "resigning" his rights. I understand each airline may be different.

It's no wonder that the FDX management would be hesitant to hire a furloughee.

Has anyone seen the memo mentioned above?

 

[TonyC]

This subject has been on another thread, but I wanted to get some more response on the issue.

It was brought up that FDX will not consider furloughees except from USAir.

My contact at FDX says that there was a memo stating the rumors about not hiring furloughed pilots was untrue due to potential lawsuits. The new hires may require signing a letter giving up any previous seniority numbers but that has not been determined.

At AA, the company must offer a furloughed pilot recall even if he has sent a letter "resigning" his rights. I understand each airline may be different.

It's no wonder that the FDX management would be hesitant to hire a furloughee.

Has anyone seen the memo mentioned above?

If I were in your shoes, I would consider your contact at FDX (that said there was a memo stating the rumors about not hiring furloughed pilots was untrue...) to be unreliable. FedEx HAS hired furloughees in the past and gotten burned. The "burning" occurred AFTER they had ostensibly resigned their seniority at the airline that furloughed them. There is nothing that can prevent that from happening again short of NOT hiring furloughees again.

You have astutely observed that "FDX management would be hesitant to hire a furloughee." Such is confirmed in the e-mail sent to FedEx pilots (if your contact is a pilot, he should have received it) from the Chief Pilot. He said:

"We still aren't interviewing furloughed folks from anyone but U.S. Airways…and we're cautious there too. Hopefully the economy will keep picking up and everyone will be employed again soon. The best way to get your pal hired if he's furloughed is for him to be employed by FedEx somewhere or fly for another airline/commuter outfit. The website will be open soon for both new apps and updates. I'll tell you when it happens."

I have no idea why working for a commuter outfit would make any difference - - seems to me AA could still recall you. And the website has already opened for new apps and he didn't tell us. But aside from that, I believe what he said is the reality that must be dealt with.

Good luck.

 

[PurpleTail]

IMHO

If you are on furlough from a Big 3 (DAL, AA, UAL) I think it would be safe to say that you have about a 1% chance of getting hired at FDX. Nothing personal and I know there are some really great guys/gals out on the street that deserve better BUT there are just too many quality and qualified apps on file right now. I would even guess that there are at least 10,000 apps on file with FDX that the company wouldn't have to worry about someone being recalled.

So what would you do?? Spend the time and money and train someone who you know will stay OR take the chance and roll the dice on someone that could possibly have an option later down the road to leave??

 

[Wise Guy]

So what your saying is that management is not convinced that FDX is a good enough place to work that they would stay over going back to an airline that just laid them off for several years. Kinda funny. I know UPS got burned on the same type of deal in the mid-90's. Most of the Delta guys they hired went back. Of course UPS couldn't believe they weren't the carrier of choice for a professional pilot. Oh, well.

 

[TonyC]

So what your saying is that management is not convinced that FDX is a good enough place to work that they would stay over going back to an airline that just laid them off for several years. Kinda funny.

Basically, yes.

The pilot probably had a choice on the front end, and chose American or Delta or Northwest, or whoever - - for whatever reasons, and they don't really matter. Fast forward to the point where the same person is faced with the choice of sticking with FedEx where he's sitting sideways and flying at night and enjoying 13 months of seniority on a substandard pay scale, or going back to the job he left flying the right seat of something during the day on the 4th year of seniority of an industry-leading pay scale. Why wouldn't he choose again the same path he had originally chosen?

I'd say there's a persuasive argument in favor of the latter choice.

 

[PHX767]

I certainly understand why management would be hesitant to hire a furloughed guy from a big major. They have been burned by pilots with no integrity that lied about their intentions. Unfortunately, it comes with the environment we are a product of. Many Pilots seem prone to misstate their intentions in order to get a job.

My point is, if their policy is not to hire those furloughees, why not be up front about it and state that before I gave them fifty bucks?
There is a section on the app where you answer if you are furloughed, who from, and are they still operating or not. If there had been a hint that "AA, DAL, and UAL furloughees need not apply", I would have understood completely and saved the money.

I guess honesty is lacking on both sides of the equation.

Okay, this dead horse has been beaten enough. Thanks for the honest input and reality checks.

 

[TonyC]

My point is, if their policy is not to hire those furloughees, why not be up front about it and state that before I gave them fifty bucks?
There is a section on the app where you answer if you are furloughed, who from, and are they still operating or not. If there had been a hint that "AA, DAL, and UAL furloughees need not apply", I would have understood completely and saved the money.

I guess honesty is lacking on both sides of the equation.

Excellent point. I didn't realize you had already applied, and I thought the policy against hiring furloughees was pretty widely publicized.

I guess you can do one of two things. You can hang tight and hope they change their minds, in which case it's good that you got your application in.

Or, you could write a polite letter explaining that you have just found out about their discriminatory policy about hiring, and would appreciate a refund of your $50 application fee. Furthermore, you'd appreciate it if they could publish their discriminatory policy on the application website so that other people would not be duped into throwing away their money.

Well, OK, maybe a third - - just write and politely ask for your money back.

Or, leave your app in, go get hired by a commuter, and keep the app updated. Ya never know...

Again - - Good Luck to you, whichever way you choose to go.

 

[Wise Guy]

TonyC,

Hope that you picked up on my tounge firmly in cheek. If you think FDX has substandard pay scales, you should check out UPS's "hidden" B scale. Your 4 year DC10 FE's drag down more than our right window seat guys.

Regards, WG

 

[biplanepilot]

TonyC said "Why wouldn't he choose again the same path he had originally chosen?

I'd say there's a persuasive argument in favor of the latter choice."


Actually one factor that might be against returning to the original chosen path is age.

I'm 45 years old, and only had 10 months of seniority at UAL when I was furloughed. If I was hired by any airline now, I have a very good case to stay there until age 60. Realistically I will not be recalled by UAL for many years, maybe not for another 6 or 7 years. At that point I would be 51/52, and I would not want to start all over again at UAL.

I may have thrown $50 away by applying to FDX, but you have to be in it to win it, and to me it's worth the chance. I've still got 15 of my best years to give 'em.

Good luck all,

Biplanepilot

 

[acarpe3448]

Biplanepilot:

I have to agree with what you are saying. Two years of Delta senority did not keep me from being furloughed. Today it seems as though Delta management would rather take the airline into BK than to recall. After furlough I could have just rolled over and waited for a recall, but living in Memphis provided me an opportunity. I got a job at FedEx throwing boxes. This work is the hardest I have ever done, the pay is the lowest I have ever earned, and the racial tension is unreal. But, working this job for over a year now does qualify me for a preferential interview for internal employees. If a job results out of all of this, then the broken left wrist, broken right thumb and head wound will all be worthwhile. I want to be at FedEx, I am now bleeding purple, and I wanted to demonstrate my love of aviation and my desire for a career at FedEx. I do not want to just give up.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

Acarpe3448,

Keep us updated. If anyone deserves to be at FedEx, it is you.
Don't forget to put an app in at SWA or JetBlue, just in case.

 

[TonyC]

I got a job at FedEx throwing boxes. This work is the hardest I have ever done, the pay is the lowest I have ever earned, and the racial tension is unreal. But, working this job for over a year now does qualify me for a preferential interview for internal employees. If a job results out of all of this, then the broken left wrist, broken right thumb and head wound will all be worthwhile. I want to be at FedEx, I am now bleeding purple, and I wanted to demonstrate my love of aviation and my desire for a career at FedEx. I do not want to just give up.

My hat's off to you - - be ready to walk the application in as soon as the job opens up.

What are you doing for recency of experience?

 

[acarpe3448]

Instructing on the side. I will let you all know how it all turns out. This has been a very hard year. I have never experienced hard physical labor as intense as this before. A real back breaker.

 

[furloughed]

Fast forward to the point where the same person is faced with the choice of sticking with FedEx where he's sitting sideways and flying at night and enjoying 13 months of seniority on a substandard pay scale, or going back to the job he left flying the right seat of something during the day on the 4th year of seniority of an industry-leading pay scale.

It would be nice if FEDEX reserved their judgement of furloughees until they look at each individual case during an interview. It seems this is a rigid unwavering rule with no exceptions (except US Airways). Some had virtually no seniority at their respective Big 3 airline when furloughed so when recalled, if ever, they would go back at say 3 months seniority, as well as 3 month payscale. With thousands of pilots senior to them furloughed at their repective airline it will be a long time before they even get recalled. If they were hired by FEDEX now they would probably have 5-7 years seniority before recall got to them. Not an appealing reason to go back. Considering the furloughs of the past couple of years are the largest ever, these are not the early 90s when furloughs only lasted a couple of years, even for the most junior furloughee. Junior furloughees look forward to the recall time limit expiring before they are recalled and if their airline has no limit then it will still be 5-10 years before recall. These are not normal cyclical downturn furloughs as we saw in the 80s and 90s, and many people caught at the bottom probably have lost their jobs permanently so finding a good flying job with a good company such as FEDEX is imperative. Good luck to everyone looking.

 

[biplanepilot]

furloughed,

Exactly my thinking, and maybe they will review each individual case. Let's hope that all this is just rumour and conjecture and that you are right. I still think it's worth having the app in with them, even though it irks me that they are charging to apply.

You've got to be in it to win it... good luck to all

Bipe

 

[furloughed]

Bi,

You gotta play to win. I think anybody that is furloughed that wants to work for FEDEX should apply no matter what FEDEX's policy is. If say in six months they change the policy to allow furloughed guys to interview then you are in the system, but if the window is closed then you are out of luck.

f

 

[Radialboy]

Or, leave your app in, go get hired by a commuter, and keep the app updated. Ya never know...

Could you clarify this bit of information for me please? I have not been on the board for a while and am trying to get active again. I do not understand how being hired by a commuter after furlough from a major is looked upon more favorably for FedEx. If you have any insight on this please share. Thank you in advance!

 

[SF3CA]

This is just my opinion, But maybe FedEx is trying to avoid hiring some one with this type of attitude ....." I am a furloughed pilot from a Major Airline and I have already put my time in at the regionals or military and I am not going to work for $20,000 a year. I would rather sit and wait till Fedex calls me than work at a place like that!"

Perhaps Fedex thinks that working at a regional proves that a person does not have a chip on his/her shoulder, loves aviation, and is happy to be working, not bitter that they are furloughed and think they deserve better.

Again .......just my opinion.....

Flame away

 

[TonyC]

Could you clarify this bit of information for me please? I have not been on the board for a while and am trying to get active again. I do not understand how being hired by a commuter after furlough from a major is looked upon more favorably for FedEx. If you have any insight on this please share. Thank you in advance!

I cannot justify or explain the policy, I can only repeat what the Chief Pilot has said:

"We still aren't interviewing furloughed folks from anyone but U.S. Airways…and we're cautious there too. Hopefully the economy will keep picking up and everyone will be employed again soon. The best way to get your pal hired if he's furloughed is for him to be employed by FedEx somewhere or fly for another airline/commuter outfit."

If you're trying to understand the rationale, you're going to be disappointed. You're just going to have to accept it. Sorry.

 

[mar]

It makes perfect sense to me

Airline recruiters are like women.

Women are only interested in men that are already hooked up with another woman. It means they're road tested. Another woman has already signed off on them.

It works the same way in the airlines. Recruiters only want to hire pilots that are currently employed. It means they're desirable and current and really smooooth in their seat.

Get it?

After I got cut loose from my previous gig I went to a job fair and met the chief pilot of Alaska Airlines Paul Majer. I was back in the middle seat of the DC6 as an FE...in other words, not very attractive. He told me, well at least you're working. I hate to see furloughed guys sitting on the beach and waiting to be recalled.

The best way to get a new job is to already have a job. If that job is in the left seat of something turbine, even better.

Good luck.