FAA changes SFO Landing Policies

[livin'thesim]

I wonder if they have an Embarrassment Management System instead of a Safety Management System?


Instead of the ASAP, maybe they have an ESAP (Ego-Salving Action Program)?

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

They have punitive FOQA including a letter of apology and time off without pay.

This is an example of what can happen at a Korean-based airline:

A friend (American, FO-PNF) on was flying in to an island airfield in the Pacific. Captain (Korean, PF) wasn't paying attention to the progress and started down late. They try to catch up and on final it isn't looking good. At 1000', they aren't stabilized, so they go around. They bring it back around, land, no problems. Good call.

Later that week, my friend gets a call saying he busted FOQA.

Why?

Because on the Go-Around, they dipped below 1000'. . . :smash:

I guess they need a DDA(H) for Stabilized Approach Criteria.

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

One more story about Korean aviation decision making:

My friend told me about this:

He is FO-PNF flying in to Pusan-Gimhae. They're #2 for the ILS and the weather is at minimums. The #1 airline doesn't get the field in sight, and goes around. My friend's flight doesn't get the runway and goes around, too.

Both flights hold for a while until the weather comes up a bit. Both flights start getting vectors for the approach. #1 airline goes missed again. My friend's flight gets the runway insight, but the CA-PF goes around. . .

Why?

The CA explained that if the #1 airline went missed, it would be suspicious if they did land. . .

 

[livin'thesim]

Sounds like a retarded, backward, foolish culture.

Yep, Westerners are quite superior to that culture. Punitive FOQA? What a bunch of f-wads.

I think that their harda## hero-pilot culture is indicative of a deep sense of inferiority they feel toward Westerners. Insecurity usually leads to this kind of we-don't-make-mistakes attitude.

Acknowledging the fallibility of human beings and the fact that we all make mistakes is the first step toward curing those mistakes.

Idiots.

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

Sounds like a retarded, backward, foolish culture.

Yep, Westerners are quite superior to that culture. Punitive FOQA? What a bunch of f-wads.

I was always second on the crew bus or crew limo, after the CA, before the FAs. I always had good crew meals. I had 4 MELs in 2 years. 4. 4! I never ever waited for a gate or a push crew or a jetway operator.

Their culture isn't foolish. It's different, and they wouldn't make the same mistakes you and I would make.

We need checklists because we're weak at routines. They aren't. They're robots. We're cowboys. We grew up thinking the cowboys should win that movie, but it ain't necessarily so.

The airline should just buy some Cessnas and make them go fly touch and goes a few times a year. For stick and rudder. For fun.

 

[Dan Roman]

Sounds like a retarded, backward, foolish culture.

Yep, Westerners are quite superior to that culture. Punitive FOQA? What a bunch of f-wads.

I think that their harda## hero-pilot culture is indicative of a deep sense of inferiority they feel toward Westerners. Insecurity usually leads to this kind of we-don't-make-mistakes attitude.

Acknowledging the fallibility of human beings and the fact that we all make mistakes is the first step toward curing those mistakes.

Idiots.

Actually, grown ups who consistently use the word "retard" are generally perceived as the idiots of our society. It too is an indication of some deep rooted insecurities about oneself.
Thinking one society is a bunch of F wads and another is superior is kind of the same thing as not being able to "acknowledge the fallibility of human beings and the fact that we all make mistakes" to use you words.

 

[waveflyer]

I was always second on the crew bus or crew limo, after the CA, before the FAs. I always had good crew meals. I had 4 MELs in 2 years. 4. 4! I never ever waited for a gate or a push crew or a jetway operator.

Their culture isn't foolish. It's different, and they wouldn't make the same mistakes you and I would make.

We need checklists because we're weak at routines. They aren't. They're robots. We're cowboys. We grew up thinking the cowboys should win that movie, but it ain't necessarily so.

The airline should just buy some Cessnas and make them go fly touch and goes a few times a year. For stick and rudder. For fun.

Good perspective- thank you- I think we're all interested in learning more from those who've been there

 

[livin'thesim]

Actually, grown ups who consistently use the word "retard" are generally perceived as the idiots of our society. It too is an indication of some deep rooted insecurities about oneself.
Thinking one society is a bunch of F wads and another is superior is kind of the same thing as not being able to "acknowledge the fallibility of human beings and the fact that we all make mistakes" to use you words.

I used the word just to give you an reason to get your shorts all cranked up, you adorable little blank-slate equalist.

 

[HA25]

Now for the lighter side

FWO = FLYING WHILE ORIENTAL = NO PHERIPHAL VISION = NO HAND EYE COORDINATION

DWO = DRIVING WHILE ORIENTAL = THE ABOVE ALSO

We have more than a few "Oriental" pilots at Hawaiian that hand fly the crap out the airplanes day in and day out, in the case of inter-island they're doing 8-10 visual approaches a day in 35Kts+ Gusts.... not to mention the 767 ops in and out of Maui... as hard as it gets for visual approaches, short runway, gusts, etc..

it's not about the genetic make up of Asians, it's the culture of those carriers and those countries... Some of the best pilots and (honestly) best CRM at HAL is the guys from Asian backgrounds..

If I were still a moderator here, that post would have been deleted..

 

[SWA Bubba]

Actually, grown ups who consistently use the word "retard" are generally perceived as the idiots of our society. It too is an indication of some deep rooted insecurities about oneself.
Thinking one society is a bunch of F wads and another is superior is kind of the same thing as not being able to "acknowledge the fallibility of human beings and the fact that we all make mistakes" to use you words.

Tell that to the guy who designed our VNAV programming. He has the plane using that very word all the damn time! On the other hand, considering some of the stuff that the VNAV programming does (or at least the version that SWA bought), no to mention the abysmally pathetic lack of effort it puts up before reverting from VNAV Path to VNAV Speed, perhaps that particular programmer does fit into your category defined above as "idiots of our society."

Jes' sayin'...

Bubba