End ALPA - Begin War

[PCL_128]

He was attending BOD's and MEC meetings before you were a gleam in the eye of Gulfstream Airlines.....

What positions did he hold, Joey? Why the secrecy? I don't care how long he was there, and in what decade; it obviously didn't teach him any political acumen or knowledge of ALPA's structure.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

The difference between the ALPA haters and the ALPA cheerleaders are.....

The ALPA haters are quitters.. losers, selfish pilots who only know how to care about themselves. In addition, they have no skillset and reject democracy... because they believe and expect democracy to serve them at others expense...

They enjoy the luxury of zero repsonsibility.. it is easy to sit in the stands only to boo and hiss... it is another to be an engaged participant

Do the haters have valid complaints? Yes... at times they do.. often they do not...

But when the haters don't get thier way.. they cry and whine and talk about unfairness.. which is either savvy politics, fair or unfair or simply democractic vote... what they are really doing is simply displaying a temper tanturm because they didn't get what they wanted at others' expense...

The cheerleaders know ALPA has huge problems... but the cheer section doesn't quit. They stay engaged. They work to find solution. At times it is incredibly fustrating... at times the cheerleaders want to yell, scream, pound fists on tables...at times the cheerleaders think about quitting...

But what is the alternative? The cheerleaders know there isn't an alternative, at least not one readily available....

The trick is this... in order to be heard, one has to maintain credibility... all while understanding that change doesn't occur overnight.... and never as much as one wants it too....

The haters don't know how to maintain credibility.. they simply don't have the social and emotional intelligence or discipline to stay engaged... blame their parents..

 

[Turtle21]

You make ALPA sound like a third party that exists outside the control of the line pilots ....

:beer: Did you come up with that on your own or did someone reveal it to you?

 

[Turtle21]

.. all while understanding that change doesn't occur overnight.... and never as much as one wants it too....

The time between April 17th and April 18th is "Overnight".


The haters of democracy will be on the outside. Whining about how they couldn't put the NMB into trusteeship.

The louder you sing the more obvious it is that democracy is in action.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

The time between April 17th and April 18th is "Overnight".

Actually the "overnight" period is the 24-72 hours after March 20th. The nmb vote is not open for each member until the 17th to change his vote.

As we have seen with the USAPA drive... emotion is the driving force behind the latest "we are our own worst enemy" display of self defeatistism.

Therefore, those "high on emotion" who desire USAPA will most likely vote right away. The vote is a 'fire and forget missle.' Voters do not have until the 17th to change thier mind like they do in common ALPA elections.

The bulk of the election will be over by March 23rd. But we will have to wait until April 17th.

The haters of democracy will be on the outside. Whining about how they couldn't put the NMB into trusteeship.

Cute. No doubt the pro USAPA types are motivated by their perception of reality. Isn't that how we all operate?

And of course, ALPA could have done things better... but that doesn't justify USAPA's actions. As usual, the fight is out there... not within...

It takes allot of emotion to rally your group to vacate the rubber life raft and jump into open water.... but it is very curious to many of us....... While no doubt you will be relieved to be out of the ALPA rubber raft.... what do you plan to do exactly when you are free floating in open water? See questions below..

The louder you sing the more obvious it is that democracy is in action.

That doesn't mean USAPA is doing this for the right reasons.


Questions: (because no one seems to able to answer them.)

The opportunity is ripe for management to rid thier company of any pilot representation. What is USAPA's plan to ensure that USAIRways management does not drain USAPA finances and BK the pilots?

What will the dues rate be at USAPA?

It is common for in house unions to have assessments? What is USAPA's policy on assessments?

Will USAPA purchase services from ALPA as does the IPA, NPA, APA and SWAPA as well as many international pilot groups?

What is USAPA's plan for CapHill representation? Will they join CAPA? The only effective pilot group on CapHill is ALPA. Do USAPA pilots accept silence on major issues such as BK reform, pension reform, RLA reform, FFDO legislation, security/airport access, flight time/duty time, fatigue, NAS modernization, NTSB accident/incident investigation, FAA reauthorization bills, etc...

What is USAPA's plan for international issues such as MPL licenses, cabatoge, open skies, etc.. Will USAPA be silent on these issues that will effect USAPA pilots as does APA pilots? USAPA pilots will be forced thru their choice to be silent, like the APA pilots, as ALPA speaks for them.

There is only two organizations that have observer status at ICAO. ALPA is one of them. Are the USAPA pilots ready to forgoe thier voice on international issues, policy and law? Are USAPA pilots international pilots?

What is USAPA's plan to assist and recover a USAPA pilot who has been charged criminally overseas for doing his/her job to the best of his ability? ALPA has a go-plan and network to get ALPA pilots back to the USA within 72 hours of incident. What is USAPA's plan?



Answers please...

 

[Turtle21]

What is USAPA's plan?

ALPAphiles will never get it. There is only one problem that ALPA will never fix. ALPA manipulate the outcome of everything.

They never met a free and fair election that couldn't be canceled or meddled with.

 

[Turtle21]

... ALPA could have done things better... but that doesn't justify USAPA's actions...

While ALPA might work hard at perpetuating the idea that one can justify their actions by the thoughts and actions of others, USAPA does not subscribe to the same basis of motives.

 

[PCL_128]

In other words, you can't answer any of his very legitimate questions. Another dimwitted uSAPa sap.

 

[Ty Webb]

All Hail this week's Village Idiot

Let me get this straight. You are disputing the fact that Air Tran has not undercut Delta in every way possible? What planet have you been living on?

"In a game of how-low-can-you-go, AirTran Airways is trying to undercut top gun Southwest Airlines by offering steeper discounts on flights out of Midway Airport."

My nominee for Village Idiot of the Week goes to this guy ...... and I thought Tanker Clown had it pretty much sewn up.

First of all, Cletus, AirTran pilots work a shorter day than Delta pilots, who authorized a 13 hour duty day. I don't believe Delta's rigs or work rules are any better than AirTran's, either.

Secondly, Delta's policy of dumping capacity into our markets is the same as us offering lower prices. You might as well be screaming your head off like a little girl about Delta dumping seats into markets below their cost, which has a worse effect on the Industry than offering a few seats at a lower rate.

. . . . . So many Idiots, so little time

 

[PCL_128]

I don't believe Delta's rigs or work rules are any better than AirTran's, either.

Well, they do have a 5.5 hour min day. Much better than our 4 hour min day. Other than that, not much difference.

 

[Turtle21]

In other words, you can't answer any of his very legitimate questions. Another dimwitted uSAPa sap.

Do you get FPL to sing that song? :beer:

I am not a union rep or have any desire to be a union rep. Those that do are the appropriate source to seek answers to your questions. Perhaps you won't find them dimwitted, but then again you might.

I on the other hand am happy to be a proponent of democracy and encourage everyone to seek the answers to their own satisfaction before voting.

Smile and pretend you are enjoying life, this is the first vote in years.

 

[JoeMerchant]

You have to question why ALPA agreed to represent regional airlines to begin with. Perhaps they never saw the RJ coming. But is that reason enough to begin dismantling an organization that's done alot more good than bad in 75 years?

And to think that breaking up ALPA will result in the individual airlines getting more, well that's a pretty hefty bet. The smaller unions will be hard-pressed to develop any real working relationship with management - they lack the leverage. When companies start-up, they often appear employee friendly because they need employee involvement to fuel incredible growth. When it matures, the airline changes it's tune and yet another tale of loyalty-turned-betrayal and disillusionment is told.

So you admit there is a conflict of interest in ALPA with your first sentance....

Also I went back and looked over some of your past posts....You have had some tough words for ALPA yourself....

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?p=951077#post951077

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Do you get FPL to sing that song? :beer:

I am not a union rep or have any desire to be a union rep. Those that do are the appropriate source to seek answers to your questions. Perhaps you won't find them dimwitted, but then again you might.

I on the other hand am happy to be a proponent of democracy and encourage everyone to seek the answers to their own satisfaction before voting.

Smile and pretend you are enjoying life, this is the first vote in years.

Sounds like another uninformed voter.. man... the questions presented effect you... can you at least find someone in the USAPA ranks who can answer them.... this is your career!!

 

[PCL_128]

Do you get FPL to sing that song?

No. In fact, I got very little FPL during my years of ALPA service. I did 90% of my work on my days off. Most of your reps and other volunteers do also. In return, dimwitted fools like yourself attack them for their dedication.

I am not a union rep or have any desire to be a union rep. Those that do are the appropriate source to seek answers to your questions. Perhaps you won't find them dimwitted, but then again you might.

I on the other hand am happy to be a proponent of democracy and encourage everyone to seek the answers to their own satisfaction before voting.

If you can't even answer those simple questions, then you really aren't informed enough to vote. You should get educated first. I won't hold my breath.

 

[Turtle21]

No. In fact, I got very little FPL during my years of ALPA service. I did 90% of my work on my days off. Most of your reps and other volunteers do also. In return, dimwitted fools like yourself attack them for their dedication. If you can't even answer those simple questions, then you really aren't informed enough to vote. You should get educated first. I won't hold my breath.

Thanks for typing slowly.. I'm not real quick. let me get this straight...I'm attacking?

And that makes me a dimwitted fool?:blush: