Don't come to Horizon. Unless......

[QXpeon]

I hear that we need to hire a lot of pilots in the next few months. Some things to think about before you come here...

If you like being an FO for a great amount of time then come on down!

We're losing 16 Q200's to Commutair (unless the deal fall through) and gaining 12. If my math is correct, that's a loss of four.

Management wants a paycut (They ain't getting it) even though we're profitable. We made 10 million this past quarter and have been making money the past few years.

The old "we'll get 90 seaters if you'll fly them for 70 seat rates" rumor is starting to fly and we all know where that leads.

They're desperate for crews and the have the nads to ask for a paycut. The more people that don't show up for classes puts more power in the hands of the pilots at the bargining table.

Unity!

 

[ReportCanoa]

What's the upgrade time to CRJ Captain?

 

[rflight2u]

CRJ captain is around 8-10 years. dash upgrade is around 5 years....

 

[Detroitpilot22]

please don't give up your $42 per hour for the 70 seat for F/o's, you guys are the only regional where the pay is close to where it is supposed to be at.

 

[FN FAL]

The old "we'll get 90 seaters if you'll fly them for 70 seat rates" rumor is starting to fly and we all know where that leads.

Hot dam, it leads to hiring street captains for the 90 seaters! What's the fax number?

 

[dollacrackho]

unity, hahahahahahahahahaha
if you say no the flying will just go to some other mindless whores like pubicshuttleaqua or mesa or someone else. just like here at psa where we said no to crap 900's rates and now i'm sure the flying will go elsewhere. airlines are making money now even with fuel where it is yet people cant get out of their own ways to fly 90 seat airplanes for piss rates. welll piss on everyone

 

[LT. Dangle]

We're losing 16 Q200's to Commutair (unless the deal fall through) and gaining 12. If my math is correct, that's a loss of four.

While I don't disagree with your feeling on this issue, I have to point out we are actually getting 15 Q400s, while losing 16 Q200s. I am counting the 2 we got from China (whether or not they will be very reliable is a completely different subject) and the third is one that was just converted from an option to a firm delivery date last month.
This doesn't make the pill any easier to swallow, but I am very optimistic there will be a lot more converted options in the near future. We really could use the extra capacity.

 

[ReverseSensing]

CRJ captain is around 8-10 years. dash upgrade is around 5 years....

Actually, the junior CRJ upgrade on the training plan is a DEN CA, with DOH of August 99. So a little over 7 years by the time this person is off IOE.

 

[tomdav]

unity, hahahahahahahahahaha
if you say no the flying will just go to some other mindless whores like pubicshuttleaqua or mesa or someone else. just like here at psa where we said no to crap 900's rates and now i'm sure the flying will go elsewhere. airlines are making money now even with fuel where it is yet people cant get out of their own ways to fly 90 seat airplanes for piss rates. welll piss on everyone

I doubt the Airgroup is going to hire Mesa, G****s, ect to do Horizon's flying. I believe the tactic will be to take a lower rate to avoid having the A/C go to Alaska before they scope us. I say let Alaska have the CRJ900 or E190 and let them get a hourly rate/contract that will make us all proud.

 

[ReverseSensing]

I doubt the Airgroup is going to hire Mesa, G****s, ect to do Horizon's flying. I believe the tactic will be to take a lower rate to avoid having the A/C go to Alaska before they scope us. I say let Alaska have the CRJ900 or E190 and let them get a hourly rate/contract that will make us all proud.

Amen, brother!

 

[xjhawk]

well, one of my friends here at mesaba has been here for over 7 years.....he is a saab FO.......oh, and i am barely making 30 grand a year, been on reserve for three years, been furloughed once, and am now 40 from the bottom at the company.......i think a trip to your company would be a godsend.........

 

[ReverseSensing]

well, one of my friends here at mesaba has been here for over 7 years.....he is a saab FO.......oh, and i am barely making 30 grand a year, been on reserve for three years, been furloughed once, and am now 40 from the bottom at the company.......i think a trip to your company would be a godsend.........

I don't know the thread-starter and this is not intended to cast him/her or anyone at QX in a bad light, but you have to understand a lot of what you're dealing with at Horizon.

Here is one of the types:

UND Graduate. Was fortunate enough to attend a great school, with a cozy relationship with Horizon. Great pilots, smart kids, know their stuff technically, can fly circles around me, but generally have absolutely no appreciation for what the industry is all about. Start out at Horizon happy to be an airline FO, making the most money they've ever made, with someone else making all the tough decisions. On the one hand, think they've go it great, but this is still year one. After 3 years (or less), they know their job inside and out, the luster has worn off a little, and they can't friggin' believe how long it will take to upgrade. They're ready now. To them, Horizon is starting to suck because we're not buying enough airplanes.

They need to take a step back and realize it's not about someone else's decisions and how those decisions are working out for them. Sure, they could have gone to Skywest and been a Bra captain by now, maybe, if they could have gotten hired in the first place, and if they had enough hours for an ATP, which they probably couldn't have and probably don't.

Sorry, anyone expressing sour grapes about the long upgrade at Horizon either wasn't paying attention when they were hired, or thought the rules wouldn't apply to them, or thought that 6 years to upgrade wouldn't seem like a long time.

I think anyone who's paying attention realizes QX is a pretty good gig. Perfect? NO, of course not. But take your sector-leading pay, 10% 401(k) match, free (for a single guy/gal) full medical/dental/vision, a little bit of profit-sharing/OPR, decent equipment, etc, etc, with little risk of furlough or bankruptcy and combine that with realistic expecations, and a notion of the goat rodeo the rest of the industry is, and you should quickly realize QX ain't the worst place in the business to land.

 

[Sioux115]

Amen Brother! I also think you are taking it a little too easy on the UND stereo-type. Most of them think they should be captain from day 1!

 

[DoubleDown]

Amen Brother! I also think you are taking it a little too easy on the UND stereo-type. Most of them think they should be captain from day 1!

As a UND grad, I've been a bit dismayed about what I'm hearing from some captains about the attitudes of some of the UND new-hires. A lot of them have been bitching about bad pay, long reserve (2 WHOLE BIDS!), and long upgrade. I've said it in a previous post, buyer beware! We have a pretty sweet deal. Don't d!ck it up!

 

[WestSide]

As a UND grad, I've been a bit dismayed about what I'm hearing from some captains about the attitudes of some of the UND new-hires. A lot of them have been bitching about bad pay, long reserve (2 WHOLE BIDS!), and long upgrade. I've said it in a previous post, buyer beware! We have a pretty sweet deal. Don't d!ck it up!

You are absolutely correct. Having worked for another regional, I will tell you that this couldn't be more true. Yes, the upgrade is a little longer, but if you did your research before you accepted the job, you have no reason to complain. For the money we make (which will hopefully get better because we will NOT take a paycut) we do have decent thing going which can only improve. Even though that E190 that was parked over at Flight Craft on Monday does look pretty nice, it does not look nice enough to fly at 70 seat rates.

 

[Speedtape]

Captain wanna bees--Hooray for guys who want to be Captains from Day 1. Most of us didn't sign up to be First Officers for the long run.

Pay Cuts--Hooray for not wanting to take a pay cut at a profitable company. Why should you? So MGMT can give themselves a bonus. Soon, no one will want these jobs. If you are having trouble filling classes now, taking pay cuts will only fuel that fire--but that is a MGMT issue. If you are Union and have a contract, the only way you will have to take a paycut is if you're pilots vote one in. There are not any profitable companies going to bankruptcy court to void contracts. Hold the line!

 

[Sioux115]

It all depends on what is considered a paycut. If we don't get a cost of living raise its a paycut, if we fly bigger aircraft for the same pay it is a paycut. A lot of people seem to be ok with those ideas, so I guess we will just have to wait and see.

 

[tomdav]

Everyone wants a quick upgrade but,

Booooooo new hire expecting Upgrade after 2 years ....

HOORAY BEER!


Remember If you want a quick upgrade so you can make your move someplace else don't come to Horizon. If you want to live in the NW and can live with the FO pay for six years then come on down. Of course if you get in on the ground floor of the Airgoup's new startup "Sasquatch Air" you might just pop in the left seat of a new jungle jet. Of course the founders will have already taken the pains of voting in the teamsters and negotiating a contract for you. Ohhh yeah, left seat in a new jet and living in my singlewide.

HOORAY BEER!

 

[NWaviator]

How many pilots are they thinking about hiring in the near future? The QOL seems great, the pay is good, the upgrade is slow but being from the NW and staying around seems great.

 

[mrnolmts]

Captain wanna bees--Hooray for guys who want to be Captains from Day 1. Most of us didn't sign up to be First Officers for the long run.

Nothing wrong with wanting that Captain's seat. Plenty wrong with feeling you're entitled to it from day 1... Anyone who wants QX should know upgrade takes longer than most other places, and deal with it accordingly. If it's not your cup of tea, don't apply. Simple as that.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

QXpeon:
So, Horizon management wants a paycut. Good for them!

It's about time some of the mgmt people step up to the plate and act like the leaders they are. Since they are the leaders, they should be taking any paycuts first, to set the example, and, even better still, taking a higher% paycut than the peons.

How much is QX mgmt willing to give up in compensation? ;-) !!!

cliff
YIP

 

[Sioux115]

Mgt. definately will not take a paycut because all their thinking is in market based compensation. They probably think they need a raise after seeing all their peers around the industry getting raises and stock options

 

[QXpeon]

Mgt. definately will not take a paycut because all their thinking is in market based compensation. They probably think they need a raise after seeing all their peers around the industry getting raises and stock options

You just explained the entire thought process behind Alaska Air Group managemnt. If one group does something, management has to copycat them or the air group will go out of business if they don't.

You didn't expect them to think for themselves now did you?

 

[007]

Tell those UND guys to go to TSA. Maybe then they will understand the value of good pay and stability.

 

[check6]

Has anyone ever thought that most of the UND guys are from the Northwest? I grew up in the NW, went to UND, worked for another 121, and am now making the lateral move. Yes, I know what I'm getting into. It's a solid company with good pay, industry leading equipment, and a bright future. I'm not after the quick upgrade but do have high regard for a good quality of life (after working for another 121). That's what makes me happy!!

Any UND grad who works for QX as their 1st regional job is lucky, especially those who aren't from the NW and weren't around during the metro/fokker/dornier days. I only wish those could go slum it in a 1900 for a year.